What causes flabby strings on basses besides tension?

[4dog]

Beer..and maybe some whiskey..but it takes a lot of it.

 

[DavC]

flabby = to many donuts

break angles over nut / bridge saddles ..??

hex core strings are stiffer than round cores ..

 

[andruca]

I think low strings' authority and tightness lie mostly on the stiffness of the "platform" that supports both ends of a string. It depends on construction (neck to body contact patch might play a role too) but also on wood hardness. Particularly there's a variety of hardnesses amongst maple varieties, all structurally fit to be used for building necks but some definitely softer.

 

[bassbenj]

You could try shimming the neck so that you must raise the saddles to maintain the same action. The higher saddles cause a steeper break angle, which can make the strings feel stiffer.

Yes a proper setup can make a difference. My MIM Jazz V always had a moderately floppy (not serious flop) B string until I finally just dug in and did a trial and error setup over the whole thing. By the time I was done optimizing the B was fine. Same bass and same strings. I think this is part of the secret of why post 2008 Fenders have better Bs than before (mine a 2002). They just figured out a proper setup for 5 strings.

 

[McFarlin]

Have you considered core strength?
Hexagonal cores are usually less flabby, if you don't mind their crunchy, burpee tone.

 

[MEKer]

Would piccolo style strings (ala Stanley Clarke) be much better tension even if you lose the deep lows you normally want in bass? Not that you'd want to use them on standard bass material I guess.

 

[eb0248]

Unclean living and sloth

 

[Grumpynuts]

I think low strings' authority and tightness lie mostly on the stiffness of the "platform" that supports both ends of a string. It depends on construction (neck to body contact patch might play a role too) but also on wood hardness. Particularly there's a variety of harnesses amongst maple varieties, all structurally fit to be used for building necks but some definitely softer.

This! He has multiple basses that are virtually identical. The signature bass is the one he's feeling disappointment in due to the floppy E. So evidently Mikey Way likes a softer setup somewhere. Being a high tension guy myself I wouldn't change a high tension for a softer unless there was something sonically that I had to gain. Or maybe he likes mustangs and wanted a slightly softer tension setup.

Either way, I am hoping the OP knows different strings have different tension. His question came across is what else causes it. And after strings (which are probably similiar considering the similiarity of the basses) string height (which is adjustable in a dozen ways) but is probably stock setup similiar between them, the next thing is neck wood.

But I could be missing something. This thread is proving to be a solid noob question thread

 

[grrg63]

Was just wondering what causes flabby strings on basses.

Another reason why I prefer medium scale to short. Also in my experience I always found the G string on shorts to be weak sounding compared to 32-34" basses.

 

[Linnin]

hex core strings are stiffer than round cores ..

Bingo! Core type and gauge effect the flippy-floppy limp-to-stiff ratio.

 

[el_Bajo_Verde]

The core, wrap-type and material matter, too

 

[Growlmonkee]

If you're able ..try raising the action just a bit on the flabby string, that would make it seem tighter, but to do that correctly, it would require slight adjustments to your truss rod, and intonation, or at least checking both those things, in addition to raising the bridge saddle, small adjustments...a little at a time till all is good as it can be.

 

[RickGAUS]

The E string on my L2000 was doing this for a long time. I realised that I had earlier tried to set the neck up myself and had tightened the truss rod quite a bit. The other night I loosened it a bit and re-wound all the strings to get a better break angle at the nut. Seems to have fixed it.

 

[arbiterusa]

There are many causes to the phenomena the OP observed, but the answer to the question is "nothing", because all the variables eventually cause differences in the string tension. Which causes floppy strings.

It's too bad most short scale basses suck and are poorly made (usually made for kids) because a good one is nothing but fun.

 

[Old Garage-Bander]

Hi
Was just wondering what causes flabby strings on basses. To be more specific I have 3 short scale basses a Fender Mustang PJ, a Squier Jaguar ss and a Squier Mikey way Mustang, out of the 3 short scale basses the E string is absolutely fine on both the Squier Jaguar and the Fender Mustang PJ but the E string on the Mikey way Mustang is a little on the flabby side unless I use a heavy gauge E string. I know lack of tension is one thing that can make a string flabby but these basses all have the same brand and same gauge of strings on them so what is it that makes my Mikey Way Mustang sound and feel flabby on the E string and not my other basses, obviously it is more than just tension related.

It goes without saying.... but just in case... you are using short scale strings, right?

 

[Kubicki Fan]

I think low strings' authority and tightness lie mostly on the stiffness of the "platform" that supports both ends of a string. It depends on construction (neck to body contact patch might play a role too) but also on wood hardness. Particularly there's a variety of hardnesses amongst maple varieties, all structurally fit to be used for building necks but some definitely softer.

Since the stiffest feeling bass I have ever touched is my Kubicki, which has a 34 ply (vertically oriented) maple neck, I tend to agree with your conclusion. Still, take this with a grain of salt b/c I have not actually done a formal experiment.

 

[Jloch86]

A slightly high caloric intake/expenditure ratio

 

[rogerb]

Just an idea, press lightly the tip of the headstock against a wall, to reinforce the neck stiffness. See if the string tension improves or stays the same.

 

[shoulderpet]

This! He has multiple basses that are virtually identical.

Yes, this is where i am puzzled, all 3 basses are very similar, all have the same brand and gauge of strings so theoretically they should all play very similar. The one major difference is that the Mikey way bass is through body stringing

 

[andruca]

Since the stiffest feeling bass I have ever touched is my Kubicki, which has a 34 ply (vertically oriented) maple neck, I tend to agree with your conclusion. Still, take this with a grain of salt b/c I have not actually done a formal experiment.

Well, most of my "knowledge" on this subject is indeed more like "empiric belief" too. As per my experience I don't subscribe much to the "longer scale => tighter B" or "neck-thru => tight B" concepts, nor gimmicks like thru-body stringing, and have played and heard plenty of cases in which all of them fail at providing said lower register tightness by themselves. OTOH, I do subscribe to this "dead stiff" paradigm out of experience. I've been doing this often lately when trying a bass guitar: play a note, then try to do a neck bend and see how far the pitch falls. Compare basses and you'll see those harder to neckbend are the ones with a tighter lower register. I've even played some 33" scale bass that had a great low B. Guess what? Dead stiff.

EDIT: for dead stiff it all has to be stiff. You need a stiff body (that's the easiest part), a stiff wood for the neck (even made stiffer when laminated, also allows for the use of lighter wood with really stiff results as in your Kubicki) and also enough leverage at the heel in the case of bolt-ons (the longer the contact patch with the body the more leverage it has to opose any neck "micro-oscilation" that would dissipate string energy). You probably don't need a massive bridge but you certainly need one that is solidly anchored to the body (throughout its whole surface), particularly the points that retain string ends shouldn't be able to flex in any way. I don't see it as a question of how much tension but more of how constant/stable that tension is. I play Stingray&Sterling 5ers and altho' I don't have the means to measure string tension they play really soft to the touch while still having a dream of a stable low B (BTW, slim neck with the hardest maple I've seen, long neck joint, solidly anchored bridge -don't let size fool you, IME the size is not the trick-).