What comes first, the amp or the gig?

[CallMeAl]

Better to have and not need than to need and not have. And while you have time maybe play with the options of different heads and cabs. Of all my trips into Ithaca I don't think I've seen a music store. If there is one let me know, I'll be at the haunt on August 3rd. Remember more watts isn't always more volume. Surface area and air movement brother.

We have Ithaca Guitar Works, right downtown, Seneca & Cayuga. It's small, they wear their "Authorized Fender Dealer" badge with honor. They carry used anything, but only stock new Fender/Squier Amps & basses. But they are very nice folks.

It was in House of Guitars in Rochester where I fell for the Rumble 500, just last weekend. But at a 2 hr drive, it's hard to just pop over there.

Is your band playing the haunt? I've yet to meet a TBer in person!

 

[CallMeAl]

If your amp is straining, or distorting, or you’re routinely pushing it very hard I’d first consider putting a high pass filter (HPF) in your signal chain if the amp doesn’t gave one already built in. If the HPF doesn’t fix the issue then I’d consider getting an amp with more wattage

Yes! I've just been researching HPF. And in general learning that my instinct to turn bass up, treble down, does not really work live...

How much wattage do you need? Hard to say. My rule of thumb is I like my rig to be running at no higher than 50% of what it’s got. But I prefer a clean amp and don’t use much by way of effects

I have been avoiding turning my gain and master past 12:00. Havent needed to yet, so I actually think I'm good there! Plus I keep my bass guitar's volume knob at about 8/10, because I want a little play in there if i need it.

 

[CallMeAl]

How are you going to audition for a band without a sufficient amp? If you are serious, you at least need access to a gig-volume amp.

That is true but I think he wants to get playing with drums and rock out so in a way he does need a rig or he can't audition.

Just when I think I got it figured out...great point guys! So far I've only experienced low volume auditions, but I can imagine not everyone rolls like that.

I'm not actively looking to audition, add a 2nd gig or dump my current gig. But when the time comes, those are some really good points there!

 

[CallMeAl]

Every time some one asks an either/or question on a forum he will get very persuasive arguments from both sides. Rarely is there complete agreement.

Right!? I should have added a poll!

 

[CallMeAl]

If you are running the amp on the floor, try elevating it. This causes cancellation from boundary interference, which can reduce some of the output in the low mids. The cancellation occurs at the frequency where the distance from the sound source to the boundary is equal to 1/4 wavelength.

See attached Frequency Wavelength Chart for reference.
and here's and article on boundary interference: Speaker Placement 101: Is Speaker-Boundary Interference Killing Your Bass?

I told BL I was gonna get an amp stand, he says we can just EQ it. So IDK, if he's old school, senile, stubborn, or what...

Thanks for the link! Look like some great info

 

[CallMeAl]

Yes, but those Rumble 500w combos sound like they are in the next room, to me and many others.

Meaning... they're hollow? Weak?

 

[Jscriv]

We have Ithaca Guitar Works, right downtown, Seneca & Cayuga. It's small, they wear their "Authorized Fender Dealer" badge with honor. They carry used anything, but only stock new Fender/Squier Amps & basses. But they are very nice folks.

It was in House of Guitars in Rochester where I fell for the Rumble 500, just last weekend. But at a 2 hr drive, it's hard to just pop over there.

Is your band playing the haunt? I've yet to meet a TBer in person!

I tried to get on the bill but it's incredibly hard to book shows without a full length and 7000 likes on Facebook apparently. Therea some really amazing ska bands playing. One being a long time favorite. Oddly enough Ive never went to HOG and it maybe 1.5 hours from me. Ithaca on the other hand...solid 3 hour drive. I'm definitely going to be checking that store out.

 

[lat]

You have the luxury of time right now to kick all the tires you want, decide what the perfect next step for you is and wait for a great deal to come along. If you wait until you NEED the rig, you will be rushing to get whatever you can find on shorter notice, and may end up getting something that isn't right, is overpriced, or both.

 

[nnnnnn]

If you want a rig that doesn't look big and intimidating at small gigs with PA support but which can still keep up with a louder kit drummer in other situations, consider modular cab options.

I have two 15" cabs. One cab on its own is only 49cm wide and tall, so one cab with a physically small amp head on top really doesn't look scary and loud, but actually (with my particular amp) it's got 400 Watts if I need it, and a volume knob for when I don't. That on its own is fine with a kit drummer in the genres I'm likely to play.

Even both of my cabs stacked only comes to about waist height at just under one metre, so doesn't look intimidating like an Ampeg 8x10 fridge would. But both together (with my particular amp head) are 800 Watts. I wouldn't want to play in a situation where that isn't enough power, I value my hearing. And in practice I wouldn't be running the amp at maximum settings, but having that extra headroom means my tone stays clean.

 

[CallMeAl]

I tried to get on the bill but it's incredibly hard to book shows without a full length and 7000 likes on Facebook apparently. Therea some really amazing ska bands playing. One being a long time favorite. Oddly enough Ive never went to HOG and it maybe 1.5 hours from me. Ithaca on the other hand...solid 3 hour drive. I'm definitely going to be checking that store out.

Is it Bim skala bim? (the only one on the bill I recognize)
I was a bigger fan of the Pilfers, but I did really like Universal

 

[nnnnnn]

I told BL I was gonna get an amp stand, he says we can just EQ it. So IDK, if he's old school, senile, stubborn, or what...

You could try an amp wedge for some of the same effect as a stand with less obtrusive appearance. I've never used a wedge, but some people on this forum swear by them. I understand it reduces the coupling with the floor and the slight angle points the sound more at your ears so you may not need as much volume on stage.

 

[Jscriv]

Is it Bim skala bim? (the only one on the bill I recognize)
I was a bigger fan of the Pilfers, but I did really like Universal

They're going to be there, but I'm a HUGE Hub City Stompers fan. Singer from inspecter 7 if you are family with the original line up. Been waiting to see em for a good 15 years.

 

[CallMeAl]

You have the luxury of time right now to kick all the tires you want, decide what the perfect next step for you is and wait for a great deal to come along. If you wait until you NEED the rig, you will be rushing to get whatever you can find on shorter notice, and may end up getting something that isn't right, is overpriced, or both.

I think this about sums it up! I'm not in a rush, but do want to plan for the future. Thanks!!

 

[Jscriv]

I'm still a punk/ska kid, just with more money for nicer gear

 

[40Hz]

Yes! I've just been researching HPF. And in general learning that my instinct to turn bass up, treble down, does not really work live...

It’s counterintuitive until you realize your ears don’t really hear the low fundamentals so much as the higher harmonics and it’s your brain that connects the dots so you “hear” those lows. And it’s strange but true that cutting the lows and judiciously boosting the mids can actually make you sound cleaner, punchier, and paradoxically much bassier

Mantra: The mids are where the bulk of the musical interest lies.

If you have a HPF (I use one from Broughton Audio) you’ll soon discover that cutting somewhere between about 35Hz and 60Hz is pure magic for bass. A HPF and knowing how and when to use a compressor are the working bassist’s two best secret weapons.

I have been avoiding turning my gain and master past 12:00. Havent needed to yet, so I actually think I'm good there! Plus I keep my bass guitar's volume knob at about 8/10, because I want a little play in there if i need it.

Makes sense to me. I rarely turn my master past noon either. And I run my volume knob around 80% for the same reason you do.

What you need to remember is that whatever wattage your amp has, it’s all on tap and available for use at all times. So if you have a 500W amp, that 500W is always on. Lowering your master doesn’t reduce the available wattage. It just basically determines how much boost on average the signal from the preamp stage is going to get from the power stage. So you can set your master at noon, but if you slam a super hard note or kick in an overdrive pedal there’s a good chance any resulting spike is going to get the full available wattage from the power stage and slam it out through the speaker cab. That’s why someone can have their master set at noon and still blow a speaker by slamming a power chord or setting their boost pedal too high. So it’s not so much that a higher wattage amp necessarily has to be louder so much as it can be louder. And that’s probably the actual reason your bandmate is concerned about you possibly getting a larger amp.

From what you’re saying however, I agree with you that what you’ve got should do ya just fine for now.

Either way you might want to look into getting a HPF if you’re gassing to spend money. They run under $100 for a good quality one. And it’s an incredibly useful tool to have in your gig bag or living room.

Luck!

 

[StatesideRambler]

I won’t tell you what to do but only what I've done. I started with a too big rig, later went bigger and, for years, usually had way too much for the gigs I was playing. Now I have a few small amps (all but one are combos) and I haven’t ever been stuck with less than I needed. What you want and what you need don’t often have connections.

 

[Derry Murbles]

Law of attraction, friend!

Step 1) Get bigger amp in preparation for the bigger funk band.

Step 2) *Poof*

Step 3) Opportunity materializes to join said funk band!

 

[landrybass]

Phil Jones, sits below my knees, 500W and sounds killer. But also about $1500. I wouldn’t let a band leader dictate my gear either.

 

[bearfoot]

Prepare ye the way of the Funk.

 

[nonohmic]

I don't know your financial situation, but bass gear is so affordable now it's not unreasonable to have both. A 500c for the big gigs, and a 100c for the little ones.

Or go TC BAM200 + 208 cab for a modular setup.

You really dont have to spend much to be heard.