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What do you think, inconsiderate or not?

#41
I've been the opener and the headliner on a lot of shows in the last year-festivals and big clubs, and this is pretty standard, at least in the major-label country world. Headliner gets all the time and room, everyone else works around it.
 
#42
ggoat!!! said:
Yeah, I don't buy the Dio story either. In the early 90's, right after Dio left Sabbath for the 2nd time on the "Strange Highways" tour, at a gig in New Orleans it was literally sweltering. I was totally parched, and hadn't had the opportunity yet to get myself a drink. Dio didn't know me from a hamburger, didn't have a clue as to who I was. However, seeing how thirsty I must have looked, Dio instantly offered me his personal drink and a handshake. Imagine my surprise when it was pure Vodka (and I don't drink ha ha)...

Dio from that moment on seemed to me to be a truly caring down-to-earth person. I already respected him musically, but his untimely compassion and concern in the moment made me completely respect him as a person.

RIP.
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Well whether you buy it or not,that's how it went. As I said,he was obviously having a baaad day. His crew's comment said as much. The yelling from his bus said as much. He never came off as arrogant or egomaniacal,but let's be honest,EVERYBODY has those days now and then. We just happened to catch him in the middle of one..
 
#43
I'm dying to know who this opening band was, any singing drummer who chooses to set up front and center as you describe is obviously an egomaniac. I have never heard of any band setting up in the way you describe, whether the drummer is the lead singer or not. Even Genesis and the Eagles put the drum set in the back where it belongs, and Don or Phil would come out front to sing for a big part of the show, with a second drummer taking their spot behind the kit. I don't see how it is possible for a singing drummer to properly put on a good enough show as a front man for the crowd from behind a drum set... Regardless of whether it was in the back or the front of the stage. It sounds to me like at least subconsciously, he knows that his "front man" performance is lacking, and used his set up rules to keep the opening bands from upstaging his. I know you said you didn't want to say, but I really would like to know who this band was. Just out of morbid curiosity. Please PM me if you don't want to disclose in the thread, I will keep it to myself.
 
#44
generation zero said:
I'm dying to know who this opening band was, any singing drummer who chooses to set up front and center as you describe is obviously an egomaniac. I have never heard of any band setting up in the way you describe, whether the drummer is the lead singer or not. Even Genesis and the Eagles put the drum set in the back where it belongs, and Don or Phil would come out front to sing for a big part of the show, with a second drummer taking their spot behind the kit. I don't see how it is possible for a singing drummer to properly put on a good enough show as a front man for the crowd from behind a drum set... Regardless of whether it was in the back or the front of the stage. It sounds to me like at least subconsciously, he knows that his "front man" performance is lacking, and used his set up rules to keep the opening bands from upstaging his. I know you said you didn't want to say, but I really would like to know who this band was. Just out of morbid curiosity. Please PM me if you don't want to disclose in the thread, I will keep it to myself.
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Well I'm only at the dive bar level, but it's a trend I've been seeing more and more of. Usually they set up sideways or at an angle to the audience, either front and center or off to one side.

The drummer in one of my projects has been slowly creeping forward every show, in spite of my telling him to knock it off. I'm all for unconventional stage plots, but - go figure - the further out front he is the more he tells me to turn down...
 
#47
generation zero said:
I have never heard of any band setting up in the way you describe, whether the drummer is the lead singer or not.
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My dad used to sing in a cover band, a good one at that. His drummer's ego was so inflated he kept insisting on putting his drums front and center - which my dad always refused :)

It came to a point where my dad wanted to kick the drummer out, and everyone in the band agreed ... until the moment where it was supposed to happen and they all acted as if they didn't have a clue. My dad quit there and then. Drummer is still not front and center with his new band :D
 
#48
generation zero said:
I'm dying to know who this opening band was, any singing drummer who chooses to set up front and center as you describe is obviously an egomaniac. I have never heard of any band setting up in the way you describe, whether the drummer is the lead singer or not. Even Genesis and the Eagles put the drum set in the back where it belongs, and Don or Phil would come out front to sing for a big part of the show, with a second drummer taking their spot behind the kit. I don't see how it is possible for a singing drummer to properly put on a good enough show as a front man for the crowd from behind a drum set... Regardless of whether it was in the back or the front of the stage. It sounds to me like at least subconsciously, he knows that his "front man" performance is lacking, and used his set up rules to keep the opening bands from upstaging his. I know you said you didn't want to say, but I really would like to know who this band was. Just out of morbid curiosity. Please PM me if you don't want to disclose in the thread, I will keep it to myself.
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You've gotta be kidding me. The frontman goes in the front. Maybe you should play a p bass through an Ampeg and stand in the back, playing root notes. There is no "way it's done". This is the same garbage I get for being a singer who plays bass. People just can't fathom anyone fronting a band that plays an instrument that isn't an acoustic guitar not plugged in. Get over yourself. The headliner calls the shots, and whether it's rude or not, that's the way it is. They wouldn't be the headliner if they didn't have something going for them.
 
#49
strummer21 said:
...it sounds like you are condoning acting like a jerk as long as you are a big enough act...
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I worked stage security for a largish outdoor venue where I got to see a lot of mid and top tier performers who were complete unapologetic A-holes. I've often wondered how big do you have to be to be excused for being a flaming A-hole.

As for opening acts hogging the stage, I've been fortunate enough to have never had to deal with this. Not done too many shows opening for big acts, but those I've been fortunate enough to do were always a lot of fun.
 
#50
ggoat!!! said:
One of my older bands opened for Quiet Riot when they were still slightly successful and they were more than gracious regarding stage room and set-up; the drummer used a small kit then (much smaller than our drummer's) and the bassist hounded me all night about my Rick tone (which back then was run through an ADA MB-1); they couldn't have been nicer guys except for the singer, Kevin Dubrow...but he was known for being a **** so no one cared.
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If that was Rudy Sarzo, then I'm not at all surprised.

He has a serious reputation for being one of the nicest people to grace this Earth.
 
#51
It's standard procedure. For one thing, it slows down the show if every band has to shuffle their gear off a big stage, then the next band sets up. And you don't want the headliner to hit the stage, then realize something's not plugged in, etc. Set it up, do a soundcheck and leave it in place. It's more important that the show runs on schedule, than if there's a drumset in the way of the opening band. Weird that anybody is surprised to hear that's how it usually goes - don't you ever go see concerts? At big shows, the opening bands often won't get to use all the channels on the PA. The vast majority of the audience is there to see the headliners - that's why they're the headliners. Sure there are exceptions and it must be annoying to play under those conditions, but that's how it goes.
 
#52
I agree with the others that you just have to roll with the punches and deal with this stuff sometimes.

My current band opened for a very well known Milwaukee area at about three years ago during a local summer festival. While we were playing, their stage hands started lugging gear across the stage and setting things up.

Annoying? Yes. They had several hours before showtime and there was no reason for them to be tromping across the stage. . But there was nothing we could do about it. We finished our set and packed up.
 
#53
I guess some of you guys don't realize with what I have an issue with. We open for plenty of big bands and I get the whole hierarchy of who gets to do what and I am fine with that. Here's my problem, if you are a medium size band that is touring and you have what is essentially a car parked sideways in front of the stage, you should consider the opening acts that you will have in every city, just out of the mere fact that you were there once and only what I consider common courtesy for another band. We had a good draw ourselves and accounted for probably 20% of the sold out venue. They rely on regional acts such as ourselves to help fill their tour dates, but I don't feel that earns us any special privilege, I'm just talking about courtesy to other people. There was both room and time to slide the drum kit back without disassembling and re-micing it. All of their stuff was plugged in and pre-set ready to go, we used separate amps/mics/drumset etc. and the show ran on time with ample room in between acts. And by the way, it was absolutely appropriate for this band to have their kit up front and center, it was imperative for their show and I'm completely fine with that.
 
#55
K2000 said:
It's more important that the show runs on schedule, than if there's a drumset in the way of the opening band. Weird that anybody is surprised to hear that's how it usually goes - don't you ever go see concerts? At big shows...
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At "big shows" there's a schedule planned out months ahead of time, and you simply do not deviate from that schedule. That schedule includes ample set up and tear down time for all bands on the bill.

I leave for a US tour on sunday, and even I (the headliner's bus driver) am aware of each bands' schedule, including where they park, when they eat, and most importantly what time they start and end their set.

We may not be headlining Madison Square Garden, but we're far from playing house parties as well. That ought to come with a modicum of professionalism and courtesy.
 
#56
lowfreq33 said:
You've gotta be kidding me. The frontman goes in the front. Maybe you should play a p bass through an Ampeg and stand in the back, playing root notes. There is no "way it's done". This is the same garbage I get for being a singer who plays bass. People just can't fathom anyone fronting a band that plays an instrument that isn't an acoustic guitar not plugged in. Get over yourself. The headliner calls the shots, and whether it's rude or not, that's the way it is. They wouldn't be the headliner if they didn't have something going for them.
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Word...

Headliners might be douches sometimes but I mean, they were the openers at one point as well. We all have to go through it.

All you can do is make sure that when it's your turn to headline, you are one of the bands that is spoken highly of in threads like these.
 
#57
southshoreconor said:
At "big shows" there's a schedule planned out months ahead of time, and you simply do not deviate from that schedule. That schedule includes ample set up and tear down time for all bands on the bill.

I leave for a US tour on sunday, and even I (the headliner's bus driver) am aware of each bands' schedule, including where they park, when they eat, and most importantly what time they start and end their set.

We may not be headlining Madison Square Garden, but we're far from playing house parties as well. That ought to come with a modicum of professionalism and courtesy.
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These go a long way. Again, I've known some guys in touring bands who certainly didn't have to compact their stage gear, yet did to make everyone's life easier, and to make things smoother for the opener. I remember those guys, particularly, because they took the extra effort and step to make my life easier and our set better.
 
#58
theaters and places like that can be hard to make room. Sat in with a lot of band, opened for a lot of bands. You could have had a more bad experience. Back in the 80's it was not unusual for the monitors to be cut out. You could not hear vocals, or other things depending on stage volume. When working with true musicians bands, not a problem. But when opening for more pop type bands, they made sure to cut the monitors way down. It is what it is. I played in really tini spaces. Live with it, last thing you want is to get black listed. Back in the old days, Cheep Trick would set up in the same small space be it 200 people or 20,000 people. Like what another said, what gets me is when your idle is back stage watching your every move...
 
#59
funkingroovin said:
You know how they say "Never meet your heroes"? It applied that gig. I figured he was probably having a bad day or stressed from the touring,but truth be told,he was a complete ass to everyone within sight that day,his own crew included..I commented about the riser thing after our set with a "Really? You guys couldn't wait 15 minutes?" Ronnie told me to piss off and waved with less than all his fingers. His roadies helped us load up after they did their set up and said "Sorry guys,it's another one of those days"
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As shown in the above post, it could always be worse...you could have to work for the douche full time.
I pity the roadies more in that case.

Sometimes it's a crappy setup and can't be helped, and sometimes it's even handled gracefully, and that feels good for everyone.

A little kindness and professionalism goes a long way.
 
#60
We frequently open for national acts and nine times out of ten they are nice people. Very often they offer to let us use their backline. But we occasionally have similar issues. At one show last year, the middle of the stage was so full of the headliners gear that we had to split left and right and all in a straight line with our drummer far stage right. Made it impossible to communicate onstage but we just had to live with it. It was all due to the stage manager who also ran us out from the backstage area before the headliner came in from their bus. And this was band was far from the biggest names we've opened for.
 

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