Double Bass What does a bass player really add, anyway?

[Bass Doc]

So, I was at a big jam yesterday. One of my usual favorites 20-25 people, in a large church meeting room. Mostly Bluegrass songs, all level of players. Usually, I play the bass at this jam which meets every 3 months or or. Yesterday, however, the host of the jam (who usually plays guitar) brought an upright bass. Luckily, I also brought a guitar. So for me, it was guitar for almost the whole thing. That's OK I thought, I get to watch him play bass.

Now this guy is a professional musician. Has toured with big names, interviewed in Bluegrass Unlimited, name on cover etc. I won't identify him here. He is one of the nicest guys you will ever meet, and a really big heart. In short, one of the best musicians I have EVER had the pleasure to play with. He plays and teaches multiple instruments and is truly stellar on all of them. But I had never seen him play bass. Boy, did he play. He made me feel like a total beginner. after watching him for 2 minutes, I wanted to throw my bass out the window. He had a feel to walking bass that was totally intuitive. He made the bass come alive and sing. No simple I/V for him, he used the full range of the bass, all the time. The complexity of building in the melody to the backing bass line was superb. Now, my work is mostly all I/Vs with occasional walk up or down to indicate change in the tune coming. It really made me feel like a total novice.

Then it struck me. As a guitar player, I was not enjoying his bass playing. I could barely follow it, and it was throwing me off. He was walking almost every line in every song like a jazz player does. It sounded beautiful, but TOTALLY wrong for almost every song he played. I had trouble maintaining rhythm on my guitar while listening to him. While I enjoyed watching his totally uber -proficient playing, it ruined the jam for me.

So what do we add as bass players? We are the drums. My friend was adding all beautiful melodic stuff. No rhythm. At that moment, it struck like a thunderbolt: I HAD BEEN SUBCONSCIOUSLY ASHAMED OF PLAYING I/Vs ALL THE TIME. On some level I assumed that if i were good, I wouldn't have to play I/V all the time. How wrong I was. As Bluegrass bass players, our I/Vs are not a weakness, it is a strength. It is the drum, it is the pulse that breathes life into our music. I will never be ashamed of playing I/V again.

 

[Jake deVilliers]

As Bluegrass bass players, our I/Vs are not a weakness, they are a strength. It is the drum, it is the pulse that breathes life into our music. I will never be ashamed of playing I/V again.

Attaboy! But you know, there IS a middle ground. Its entirely possible to play Root/Five AND play the melody, too. You'll need to 'be' the song a little stronger and use some notes that aren't R/5.

Listen to Gene Libbea with the NBB for the best bass playing in a bluegrass context: he's got the drive AND the groove AND he plays each song as though its different from the last...

 

[JamesAdams]

Came away from our last recording session with the same impression. Our producer kept asking me to play more simply and the more I did, the tighter the groove got. Sometimes it's easy for the bass player to get bored with t I/V but really the most important thing to do is to establish and support the grove. That way when you do have an opportunity to throw in something fancier it will stand out and shine. Otherwise it just adds to confusion. Space is sometimes more important than notes.

 

[Feral Feline]

It's tough to fight that feeling of "I'm bored so the other musicians and audience must be bored with the bass-line too", whether in bluegrass or blues or any genre.

I recently was asked to walk a line for an extended period and afterwards the keysborder and gitawrist joked about how I stopped to do some sightseeing along the way – WoW, what a wake-up call! Only after their jibing did I realise I had failed to provide what was needed and, indeed, called for. The Next time somebody asks me to walk for 5-10-15 minutes or however long, that's what I'm going to do – with no detours and no "sightseeing".

 

[Bass Doc]

" I recently was asked to walk a line for an extended period and afterwards the keysborder and gitawrist joked about how I stopped to do some sightseeing along the way –"

I'm not sure i understand what you mean here. Do you mean they wanted you to JUST do I/V and they were irritated that you deviated from their request? Or do you mean you did not do a jazz walking pattern like they had asked for!

 

[ragtimelil]

Listen to Gene Libbea with the NBB for the best bass playing in a bluegrass context: he's got the drive AND the groove AND he plays each song as though its different from the last...

I found some Gene LIbbia to listen too! Thanks, but who is NBB? I found the Naked Brothers Band. Not sure if that's who you meant. Didn't sound like bluegrass

Still learning....

 

[cavemusic]

I found some Gene LIbbia to listen too! Thanks, but who is NBB? I found the Naked Brothers Band. Not sure if that's who you meant. Didn't sound like bluegrass

Still learning....

Nashville Bluegrass Band - http://www.nashvillebluegrassband.net/

 

[jthisdell]

I come from a jazz/rock/blues background and it has taken me a year and a half to simplify my playing for bluegrass. I still do not play very straight, much more of a swing sort of feel, but the guys in my band are a lot happier with me.

I do wonder how I would do in another genre now, if I'd have to be consciously trying to play more stuff instead of less.

 

[Feral Feline]

" I recently was asked to walk a line for an extended period and afterwards the keysborder and gitawrist joked about how I stopped to do some sightseeing along the way –"

I'm not sure i understand what you mean here. Do you mean they wanted you to JUST do I/V and they were irritated that you deviated from their request? Or do you mean you did not do a jazz walking pattern like they had asked for!

I did a walking jazz pattern until I thought the audience would be bored with the non-stop walking pattern (for more than 10 minutes under some other free improvisation that was going on), so I took a break from walking and reacted to the poet or to what another musician was doing, then I went back to walking – this happened a few times during the piece. No drummer on that particular piece, though the keys player also played drums on some other numbers, I should've been marking time throughout.

I thought breaking it up a bit would add more interest, but what I really needed to do was keep walking with conviction and make the walking itself more interesting, but alas, I am but a padawan and have much to learn from my Jedi DB masters.

 

[ragtimelil]

Nashville Bluegrass Band - http://www.nashvillebluegrassband.net/

That sounds more like it. Thanks for setting me on the right path.

 

[Jake deVilliers]

That sounds more like it. Thanks for setting me on the right path.

The 'Unleashed' album contains some absolutely amazing bass playing. You'll need to listen closely - its not show-off stuff, its beautifully subtle and completely integrated into the song.

 

[ragtimelil]

The 'Unleashed' album contains some absolutely amazing bass playing. You'll need to listen closely - its not show-off stuff, its beautifully subtle and completely integrated into the song.

Thanks. I will look for it.

 

[Jake deVilliers]

Thanks. I will look for it.

'Home of the Blues' and 'Waitin' for the Hard Times to Go' are also outstanding.

Here's 'Blue Train' from 'Home of the Blues':

 

[neddyrow]

I love this thread!

I play 1-5 as much as possible. If I stray too far, the sound suffers. Like the OP said, we are the drum - the pulse of the music.

It's a great job to be the bass player in a bluegrass band. You are the glue holding it all together. I've seen bands without a bass and even though they have banjos and mandos, it's just acoustic music to me.

If you have a good band, there is time in a set to show your chops besides your important job of keeping time and adding walk ups and transitional runs. We always do a few songs where I get a short break - boy do people cheer when the bass player plays a solo!

You bluegrass bass players are doing a great service. I hope you don't get bored - I never do.

 

[JamesAdams]

I actually gave a talk at Wintergrass last year titled "non-traditional traditionalism, or how not to die from I/V boredom". I feel like I've learned a ton this last year about playing more simply and I would do it much differently.

 

[ragtimelil]

'Home of the Blues' and 'Waitin' for the Hard Times to Go' are also outstanding.

OK it's official. I'm a fan!

 

[dc-upright]

This is a great info. I have been a big believer in less is more when it comes to bluegrass bass playing. My job is to drive the band and make the person taking the breaks or singing shine. If I am doing that it almost always involves simpler lines.

 

[wallawallabob]

I love playing bluegrass (my wife hates it, but that is another story...) and I find that there are certain songs that beg for a walking bass line, but mostly what is needed is the 1/5. An understated walk is what I strive for where it might take a couple of measures to get there. Also, I will do a faster walk, usually only 3 notes, when it is time for the singer to come back in after someone else does a solo. With people who have played together for a while, it acts like a trigger for the soloist to stop and the singer to come back in. Subtle, but effective for us.

 

[LEUllman]

Bass is the secret sauce.

 

[neddyrow]

We played a show last night at a bar that does music every Thursday night and usually my wife and I have friends sit in with us and we do a bunch of tunes that aren't our usual bluegrass set. Some blues, acoustic and classic rock tunes. Since we have people sitting in and it's a 3-hour show, our setup for the first set is me on acoustic guitar with an electric player and this time we had a fiddle sit in and a harp player.

The first set was rough. The electric player was playing a lot of open chords as was I. There was this wall of mids that sounded bad. I tried watching the other guitar player and tried to do different stuff to help the dynamics but it still was weird.

The second set I played bass and our other guitar player played acoustic with the fiddle player sawing away. It was amazing how much better everything was! We now had low, mid and high. Also, I slap a bunch and we had a nice beat too. It was funny - my wife said that she liked singing for the band in the second set much better than the first.