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What is really separating all these jazz basses?
- Thread starter jnevi9nr
- Start date
I wasn't trying to imply the most expensive is always the best, al though that is often the case. I think it is very important to get the bass YOU are most comfortable playing, whatever the price.
It can have an impact, more on comfort than playability, due to weight etc. I was really lumping it in to my point to show that the body and the neck and to some extent the hardware are what really makes the bass, and when you start replacing them you may aswell have not bought the bass
Of course all this is IMO and YMMV etc
Peace
right, so I am assuming that the wood from the one up and coming bass builder was different than the sadowsky wood and you prefer the wood/electronic combo from the bass builder, but I bet sadowsky could do that sam combo. most likely the specs arent the same and you prefer the sound based on the bass builder specs.
It wont sound like a Fodera if you did that unless you use the Fodera specs. So what that Fodera sound is, its made up of electronics and whatever specs and we can copy those specs and have to buy the electronics. specs arent copyrighted/patented - wood type, scale length, and whatever else helps make a fodera sound like a fodera other than the electronics, which might be able to be reversed engineered. and lastly, if I can get close to a fodera sound for $1000 instead of $10,000, i think 9 out of 10 people would take that.
I call it a jazz bass if it has jazz style pickups. i mean, right here, you are talking about 60s spacing and 70s spacing. which is it? if it can be one of those two spacing, why cant it be another spacing? if it aint a jazz bass without those spacings, what would you call it? i really think most basses should be referred to by the type of pickups it has: P, MM, J, PJ, MM J, etc. then you got the other specs: scale length, passive or active, # of strings, etc.
play three Ps, three Js and three MM and I bet the Js sound more like each other regardless of position than the Ps or MMs sound like a J.
all i am saying is that putting together your fav features can be cheaper than getting a sadowsky or fodera. if you want to pay more for someone else to put it together based on the sound they think you want, thats fine.
my broad generalizations werent formed based on people's perferences, it just enhanced my argument. my last thoughts from yesterday werent really relevant to the topic but they underscore why people might be choosing to go that route.
and I am sure that the perfect feel for any given person can be found for under $1000 unless you have some kind of special body type. sound is the thing that may cost money depending on how much your particular sound is. i guess i am more old school. i am more about just having a bass sound in general. give me a passive bass and ill go to work.
If I ever decide to get a J-type bass-which I never considered until now-it will be a Carvin SB5000! Carvin has attracted a lot of attention from established pros and others not so established for good reason. Price, options and quality makes the SB4000/5000 very hard to beat!
A Groove is a Terrible Thing to Waste!
so you dont think that you can find that quality in craftmanship at a lower price?
I'd imagine the necks being a major factor, each company has their own preferred neck carve, fretboard radius, scale length, fret count, etc, etc...
Add that to the different pre-amp, pickup, hardware, woods, build mechanics, finishing materials techniques, and so on, you could find two similar looking(say 5 string candy apple red and maple fretboard) Jazz basses by different companys that could sound nor feel anything alike at all.
Add that to the different pre-amp, pickup, hardware, woods, build mechanics, finishing materials techniques, and so on, you could find two similar looking(say 5 string candy apple red and maple fretboard) Jazz basses by different companys that could sound nor feel anything alike at all.
right, based on his business model and high labor costs. maybe he would sell more if he lower the price and was more efficient in producing them.
i like this answer a lot! this particular neck feels the best, doesnt matter where its made or how it looks or the price.
good point. so are you saying that the person in NYC is more capable of a better review than a person in asia? prolly not. the markup is due to the cost of living. which is exactly my point. do you think all these companies are moving their manufacturing plants to asia because they want a crappier product. no, they feel that the product's quality will be the same, but that the production cost will be lower and profit margin higher, or maybe lower the market price for consumers to sell more items.
marketing is a good point. however, when we go to a store to buy a bass, we SHOULDNT take into consideration the what name is on the bass. we should be buying it based on feel and sound, which I think we have identified as the two key elements to a bass purchase. maybe certain companies have certain sounds that we like so we gravitate to those basses, which I dont have a problem with. however, i am going to fine the basses with the best feel and then if all is (feel and price), ill pick the better sound.
so certain looks are worth more than others? give me the bass with the cheapest look with all other things equal. thanks.
I wasn't trying to imply the most expensive is always the best, al though that is often the case. I think it is very important to get the bass YOU are most comfortable playing, whatever the price.
It can have an impact, more on comfort than playability, due to weight etc. I was really lumping it in to my point to show that the body and the neck and to some extent the hardware are what really makes the bass, and when you start replacing them you may aswell have not bought the bass
Of course all this is IMO and YMMV etc
Peace
why is the most expensive the best? why is that the case? i agree, get the most comfortable bass, thats the one that is going to lead to the best performance and encourage practice.
i think weight goes into feel and I think its an important factor. i dont think the hardware make the bass like others think. the body and neck feel is the bass to me. hardware is interchangable and dont really change the feel of the bass in most cases. tuners? really? tuners dont effect my playability and isnt a factor into whether a bass is a good fit for me. i agree that some tuners are better than others and we can prolly measure why that is, but i dont let that be a big factor in any decision because I can swap them out if my tuners arent doing the job.
what i am saying is that company a and company b use the same specs, to include wood types. we already determine that certain companies dont use exotic woods due to price, business model and their perspective impact of the sound and quality of the bass.
i think we determine that the pickups and preamps are the key to different prices and certain sounds cost more than others.
the neck is important and people can have preferences for those neck specs, but their price shouldnt be too much vs. another neck, unless you use more material, 5 string vs. 4 string neck. this is what I am really seeing as the key feature to buy one over the other, but one neck shouldnt be that much more than the other unless exotic wood was used.
Even with the same types of wood, properly aged, and higher grade wood costs more.
Certainly a major factor in the tone department, not so much in the price department. Different brands of pickups are't really more expensive than one another, and even the bigger separated ones pricewise would only add 2-300 on to the price.
It's a lot more than basic material, compound radii are much more work intensive, has the bass graphite reinforcement, or steel, one piece neck, or separate fretboard, binding, inlays, single truss rod, double truss rod, multi laminate neck?
A maple/maple neck could be either,
A standard one way truss, no reinforcement, one piece neck with skunk stripe and 12" radius,
A double expanding truss, graphite reinforced, 3 piece neck, with a 12-16" compound radius and higher grade maple.
The 2nd would cost a lot more, but on the surface, not seem all that different.
right, but higher grade wood cost the same to purchase for each manufacturer most likely, maybe some get discounts based on amount of wood or ability to negotiate the price down.
ok, pickups and preamps are cost factors, but maybe not as much when you thnk about $5000 wal or fodera basses. but i still think it plays a factor in price.
all those neck specs cost the same for each company, unless some are doing some of them and some arent. i think that would come down to type of manufacturing you are doing, assembly line vs. sadowsy or fodera individual builder. would you agree? i am agreeing with you that the more work you put into the neck, the more expensive its going to be, but it should be equal across the board unless a company has some kind of very efficient machine that can do all of that in record time that no one else knows about. so again, this is price of materials that you are talking about and the more you use, to include labor to do those things, the more expensive your bass will be.
Yes, That's me. So for me, if I could get the "road wore" neck specs (vintage frets, 7 1/2 radius, comfy old school feel and whatever body maybe Jazz but, who knows) and good working pickup and all that may entail, I'm down or, in or, whatever the kids say
So price for me would be how ever cheaply I could do that would be fine with me, for it's about the notes (and how to achieve them) not the name.
I agree the body and neck are what makes the bass, but IMO the bridge etc still has something to do with it, although nowhere near as much.
IMO, the stuff that makes the bass is the stuff that if you got rid of it, you couldnt attach strings, ie. body, neck, bridge, tuners, each to a greater or lesser (tuners) degree. Yes pickups and electronics are important, but theyre all about sound reproduction, not the actual bass, or playing...
...Kind of
the stuff that makes the bass are the things that all bass manufacturers can get for a similar price. ash body, maple neck, rosewood fretboard. done. sadowsky doesnt get a supply of ash wood that is significantly better than fender or fodera's ash wood. so thats a set price, and the body and neck is the main part of the bass and the main factor for sound, other than pickups and preamp. so at this point, before pickups and preamp, why should the price jump from a fender to a sadowsky or fodera? well, we talked about why. personally, i dont think that "added value" really adds up in the end. fender has a business model and years of experience that allow them to offer the bass to players at a cheaper cost than other builders. sort of like walmart.
see walmart, you all may hate them, but they have a lot of control on pricing. they can force suppliers to accept a certain price because they would buy so much of it and their customer base. they offer the same products that other places do at cheaper. same with amazon. they are able to offer same products at cheaper cost due to business model. thats why these music places wont match their costs a lot of times. they think that amazon isnt a real dealer or something and try to say "they dont offer the services that we do". personally i dont care about service, i want the bass i want for the cheapest price. its not like amazon is getting the crappier versions of the same fender basses that guitar center or sam ash gets. if gc and sam ash aint matching amazon prices, that should tell you something about GC and Sam Ash and not Amazon.
see walmart, you all may hate them, but they have a lot of control on pricing. they can force suppliers to accept a certain price because they would buy so much of it and their customer base. they offer the same products that other places do at cheaper. same with amazon. they are able to offer same products at cheaper cost due to business model. thats why these music places wont match their costs a lot of times. they think that amazon isnt a real dealer or something and try to say "they dont offer the services that we do". personally i dont care about service, i want the bass i want for the cheapest price. its not like amazon is getting the crappier versions of the same fender basses that guitar center or sam ash gets. if gc and sam ash aint matching amazon prices, that should tell you something about GC and Sam Ash and not Amazon.
You probably can, but as far as the cost and variety of options available, I don't think so.
A Groove is a Terrible Thing to Waste!
