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What makes a 51' P a 51' P?
- Thread starter vbasscustom
- Start date
Musician and inventor Paul Tutmarc developed a fretted electric string bass. The 1935 sales catalog for Audiovox, featured his Electric Bass Fiddle, a four-stringed, solid-bodied instrument with a 30½-inch scale length.
I much prefer the tone of the Audiovox #736 over the early Fender P as posted on the EMP site.
I certainly agree, like I mentioned before, "What Leo DID do was make the first mass-produced electric bass. ... .and a darned good one!"
Tutmarc may have made the first "horizontally" played electric bass, but there were earlier electric up-right type basses (Rickenbacker & Vega for example).
I'm a Fender bass lover and Leo certainly changed the music world with his precision bass and other guitars, but I still cringe when folks say he "invented" the electric bass.
He sure did perfect it though!
Interesting story about THAT one in "FENDER PRECISION BASSES 1951-1954" by Detlef Schmidt (The bass book mentioned in earlier posts).
Seems the body is dated '54 .... but all evidence seems to prove it to be one of the original 83 P's made in '51.
207 Oak Street in Santa Ana apparently was where his store was located. In 1950, he built a new building next to his existing buildings in Fullerton .... long since torn down.
I wonder if the store front in Santa Ana is still there.
I wonder if the store front in Santa Ana is still there.
Or was it his house?
Looks like an apartment complex on the site now.
I did a Google Map search.
Thought I'd chime in here,and mention something unique to 51's that is often overlooked.
51's had a grounding wire lead off of the pick-up,this wire was seated beneath the pick-up cover.
Spent some time with an original 51' many moons ago,and this is something that kinda stood out with me.
I often wondered why this feature was dropped from subsequent models,because it did change the function somewhat.
With the cover on/grounded,the single coil hum was toned down,interference was minimized-and the sound of the pick-up was smoothed out.
Guess you could say it was toned up
Maybe with the old 2 prong power cord style amps there might have been some unpleasant zaps? who knows?
Recently,a TB'r sent me a very nice pic illustrating this set-up.Although this particular 51' was a reissue,it was a Mark Kendrick,masterbuilt.
And it really blew my mind,that Kendrick,went to the nth' degree on this build.
Here is the pic.
There has been some good info posted here so far,but I'd like to also talk about the neck profile of these early P's a bit more.
Because to me this is one of the main distinguishing factors that set the early P's apart.
M.R.Ogle,provided a brilliant illustration in post #27.
I currently own a Fender Custom Shop 51' P that was made circa 1991,this was the fortieth anniversary of the Precision,the custom shop made a special run of 51 basses to commemorate this milestone.These are pretty special basses,very similar to the originals.
I also own a 55' custom shop P,and both these basses have the same neck profile,as illustrated in Ogle's post.
To me this neck profile is pleasingly plump and a big contributor to the early P's distinctive sound.
The more recent 51' P reissues by Fender,Japan,do not have this neck profile,they are close but no cigar
If you can check out either a custom shop 51' or 55' reissue you will be able to see and feel what I'm talking about
Hope this helps.
51's had a grounding wire lead off of the pick-up,this wire was seated beneath the pick-up cover.
Spent some time with an original 51' many moons ago,and this is something that kinda stood out with me.
I often wondered why this feature was dropped from subsequent models,because it did change the function somewhat.
With the cover on/grounded,the single coil hum was toned down,interference was minimized-and the sound of the pick-up was smoothed out.
Guess you could say it was toned up
Maybe with the old 2 prong power cord style amps there might have been some unpleasant zaps? who knows?
Recently,a TB'r sent me a very nice pic illustrating this set-up.Although this particular 51' was a reissue,it was a Mark Kendrick,masterbuilt.
And it really blew my mind,that Kendrick,went to the nth' degree on this build.
Here is the pic.
There has been some good info posted here so far,but I'd like to also talk about the neck profile of these early P's a bit more.
Because to me this is one of the main distinguishing factors that set the early P's apart.
M.R.Ogle,provided a brilliant illustration in post #27.
I currently own a Fender Custom Shop 51' P that was made circa 1991,this was the fortieth anniversary of the Precision,the custom shop made a special run of 51 basses to commemorate this milestone.These are pretty special basses,very similar to the originals.
I also own a 55' custom shop P,and both these basses have the same neck profile,as illustrated in Ogle's post.
To me this neck profile is pleasingly plump
and a big contributor to the early P's distinctive sound.The more recent 51' P reissues by Fender,Japan,do not have this neck profile,they are close but no cigar
If you can check out either a custom shop 51' or 55' reissue you will be able to see and feel what I'm talking about
Hope this helps.
You lucky duck!
I have the old Bass Player mag with several articles on the '51 P bass ..... including the making of the 40th anniversary RI.
Fab Surperlative,
You are right about the ground wire from the pickup to the cover, there are other differences also.... the pole pieces in the 51 pickups are usually flush with the top of the pickups and not raised ...in 52 they started raising them... I have a real early 51 with a metal backing plate under the pickup that appears to be original, while some would argue it is not... there is at least one early 51 with a .05 astron cap in the tone circuit, while most have .1 caps. everyone I've seen also have a 15k resistor to roll off the volume when the tone control is in the bass position. Since the necks were hand finished they are all different. I have 5 51's and every neck is slightly different and the nut size is not consistant even though Tadeo made all of them... I don't find the necks fat at all but extremely comfortable and easy to play, not the "baseball necks you always hear about".
You are right about the ground wire from the pickup to the cover, there are other differences also.... the pole pieces in the 51 pickups are usually flush with the top of the pickups and not raised ...in 52 they started raising them... I have a real early 51 with a metal backing plate under the pickup that appears to be original, while some would argue it is not... there is at least one early 51 with a .05 astron cap in the tone circuit, while most have .1 caps. everyone I've seen also have a 15k resistor to roll off the volume when the tone control is in the bass position. Since the necks were hand finished they are all different. I have 5 51's and every neck is slightly different and the nut size is not consistant even though Tadeo made all of them... I don't find the necks fat at all but extremely comfortable and easy to play, not the "baseball necks you always hear about".
Some really good info on vintage Fender paint and finish processes: Link Removed
Some interesting spec info on vintage Fender pickups: Link Removed
Some interesting spec info on vintage Fender pickups: Link Removed
Of course, we all know ..... Leo didn't invent the electric bass.
Fender still likes to think so.
True. But Fender (Leo) was the first who constructed it really well(extremely)and put in series production. Precision Bass with it`s success tells us it was the FIRST REAL ELECTRIC BASS.
Unfortunately to me it doesn't sound nearly as good as the electric bass first marketed 15 years earlier.
I had a Fender catalogue in Finland 1967, i can`t say from which year, but i remember vaguely that Santa Ana or Santa Monica was printed on it as address.
Coronado models and XII was included, so it was probably the newest catalogue then.
What was that bass? Was it Rickenbacker? I haven`t seen too many clear pics of it yet. Pity it didn`t became as popular. Maybe it was too early.
What was that bass? Was it Rickenbacker? I haven`t seen too many clear pics of it yet. Pity it didn`t became as popular. Maybe it was too early.
Audiovox Model 736 by Paul Tutmarc. There is information and a clip of that and several others on the EMP site.
Great thread!!
It's funny how the original concept was so simple: a chunk o' maple, bolted on to a chunk of ash. One single-coil pickup. How do you mess that up?
Unfortunately, it seems like there are a million ways to do so: to get the materials and dimensions pretty close yet have the final result totally miss the point.
That's what the OP's query gets at for me: which details make that crucial difference between a ho-hum copy and a real-deal holy grail that absolutely oozes musicality?
As a player, I'm not so hung up on 1951. I would welcome - even require - many of the refinements that came with subsequent model years.
But the question remains: what makes a good original SCPB so special and how can we capture that with a new build?
It's funny how the original concept was so simple: a chunk o' maple, bolted on to a chunk of ash. One single-coil pickup. How do you mess that up?
Unfortunately, it seems like there are a million ways to do so: to get the materials and dimensions pretty close yet have the final result totally miss the point.
That's what the OP's query gets at for me: which details make that crucial difference between a ho-hum copy and a real-deal holy grail that absolutely oozes musicality?
As a player, I'm not so hung up on 1951. I would welcome - even require - many of the refinements that came with subsequent model years.
But the question remains: what makes a good original SCPB so special and how can we capture that with a new build?
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