What should I say?

[stringthrough]

"Dude, you're too good a guitarist to hide behind all these effects."

 

[dxb]

Talk to the other band members and make sure they agree with you, then ask the guy privately if he could dial back the effects a bit because you think they degrade his tone. If he disagrees, ask him if he'd let the other guys weigh in. That way it'll be his decision to involve them and maybe he'll take their criticism more constructively, as opposed to thinking you all ganged up on him.

...If that doesn't work, just steal the knobs off his amp.

 

[CatchaCuda]

You guys are way too mature.
Start an effect war. Your drummer needs an electric kit and a massive amount of delay on everything. Vocals could be manipulated to be an octave up. Or better yet, a half step down from an octave up and mix the clean signal with it 50/50. As the bass player, you should just keep doing your thing.

 

[swarfrat]

Can we slag on effects outside the effects section??
Seriously,I think I'd try to approach it one point at a time. "More dry signal" is one point at a time if need be. Just try not to start off with "you have way too much bass, the chorus predelay is way too long, and your tremolo and chorus lfos are beating each other to death, and oh yeah nobody outside of VH cover bands really uses harmonizers any more." Thats likely to burn your bridge

 

[Nickweissmusic]

We're not playing out yet. Will probably be a while. They only want to practice once every 2 weeks. There really isn't a definitive BL from what I gather. These guys are all pretty laid back, which is great. Maybe too laid back... or at least the guitar player. It's almost to the point of ignorance on his behalf. I mean, if you were in the room listening to us, I'm pretty sure you would see where I'm coming from.

Seems like you’re the wrong guy for the job if they’re already established. He doesn’t get it, and the other guys are complicit or don’t get it either, let them have their fun.

 

[4dog]

have you ever heard him play just guitar to amp zero effects....some players hide their lack of skill behind a wash of noise,its effective...he could be one of these players.

 

[gidbass]

record and playback (like someone already mentioned)

With my band, we are in the process of setting up to record every practice and then critique it afterwards. It's not easy, but necessary IMHO.

Good Luck!

 

[1bassleft]

My band always recorded, but if he likes what he's hearing at the time, I'm not sure retrospect will change that. I once played with a keyboardist who had the shiny new DX7 and I got on well enough to say "not the blimmin' strings patch again!" but it seems like you're not in that position. I'd go with the positive persuasion approach. Either during playing (if he ever reins it in a bit) give that snap of the neck, wide-eyed approving nod - I did it with the LG in a jam and he said afterwards "I saw your reaction and thought, must try that again in a few bars' time"
Otherwise, after the song approach him about a part you know he did well but mushed it up. "What was that you were playing in the middle eight? Really good lick. Yeah, it was like that but it sounded crisper... can you just dial back the... yep, that's it. I like it, really adds to the song, we need to make sure that comes through clearly in the mix."
If you don't ham it up too obviously, it'll come across better than "that POS needs setting on fire."

ALLEFFECTS:ALLTHETIME!! - don't knock it... worked for "The Edge", didn't it?

 

[leonard]

Bring him a 5e3 Tweed Deluxe for a try. After that he will never play a Line6.

 

[Spidey2112]

Honestly, I'm to the point in my life where I would say, "hey your overuse of effects is amateurish and embarrassing, and masks the level of skill that made me want to play with you in the first place. Either knock it off, or we are no longer in the same project. And I actually WANT to be in a project with you."

Try it. It separates the wheat from the chaff.

Why would you say this, in the middle of a wheat field? More importantly, once the chaff is separated from the wheat, are we to call Agro services, hopefully finding a suitable home for said chaff?

The humanity...

 

[1bassleft]

Why would you say this, in the middle of a wheat field? More importantly, once the chaff is separated from the wheat, are we to call Agro services, hopefully finding a suitable home for said chaff?

The humanity...

Try it. They'll be all ears.

Sorry.

 

[Element Zero]

Honestly, I'm to the point in my life where I would say, "hey your overuse of effects is amateurish and embarrassing, and masks the level of skill that made me want to play with you in the first place. Either knock it off, or we are no longer in the same project. And I actually WANT to be in a project with you."

Try it. It separates the wheat from the chaff.

That’s... quite brash... but I whole heartedly agree.

 

[Jscriv]

We usually handle it like this....."hey man, that sounds like $h!t".

 

[jwr]

Stop playing, look him directly in the eyes and say "hey bro, I don't think we need that for this section of the song". Communication. It's key to any relationship.

 

[Kro]

maybe deguise it in a compliment ...

man , i wish i could hear your really good guitar tone better ,... but it's getting fairly buried in all the extra effects ..!!??

Was just going to reply to say the same thing. All musicians want to be heard. If the effects are making him sound muddy, or if he's getting lost in the mix, say it that way.

I also agree with having him listen back to a recording, and ask if you'd ever want to hang out at some point, just the two if you and work on some tones. Most guitarists (and bassists as well) will jump at the chance to hang out and work on that type of stuff over a few beers. Good luck!

 

[jwr]

Honestly, I'm to the point in my life where I would say, "hey your overuse of effects is amateurish and embarrassing, and masks the level of skill that made me want to play with you in the first place. Either knock it off, or we are no longer in the same project. And I actually WANT to be in a project with you."

Try it. It separates the wheat from the chaff.

Just curious why you say that point in your life? I think people tend to really overthink using effects in general. Music is an expression of oneself. When I write music (which I write a LOT of my own and have for years now), I use what I believe is appropriate. I'm no pro though obviously but I have seen them use them up the wazoo and sound amazing. It depends on the artist, the group, the theme...etc.

I don't equate it as being an amateur. I think of it as trying to figure out what you like to use for your own signature tone. It also doesn't mask skill in any sense. I've seen zero evidence of this despite folks on TB (and mind you, I ONLY see this on TB) saying such as if it's a law of the land.

Folks, music is not just some formulation that has only straight lines to follow because it's a job. People who are passionate about music don't care about song structures, they don't care about over-saturation of their bass or guitar. They care about creating an extension of themselves. At least that's the way I do it. When I play, it's based on my mood and what sounds like magic to my ears.

With that said, everyone is entitled to their opinions and I'd never say otherwise. I engage with you however and try to find some common ground.

 

[Kro]

ALLEFFECTS:ALLTHETIME!! - don't knock it... worked for "The Edge", didn't it?

If by work you mean he did something and got paid for it, yes that's undeniable.

If by work you mean good guitar parts, well, the very fact that I'm posting this seems to indicate that's debatable.

 

[Kro]

Honestly, I'm to the point in my life where I would say, "hey your overuse of effects is amateurish and embarrassing, and masks the level of skill that made me want to play with you in the first place. Either knock it off, or we are no longer in the same project. And I actually WANT to be in a project with you."

Try it. It separates the wheat from the chaff.

IMO that's a good way to get somebody's defenses up and get nowhere. It might separate the wheat from the chaff, but maybe not in the same way you mean it.

 

[JRA]

Just trying to think of a way to break it to him without pissing him off.

try some version of honesty...people actually like honesty --- even if you're uncomfortable with it.


here's one version:

"hey your overuse of effects is amateurish and embarrassing, and masks the level of skill that made me want to play with you in the first place. Either knock it off, or we are no longer in the same project. And I actually WANT to be in a project with you."

 

[JRA]

if you aren't clever enough to handle conversations where honesty/forthrightness is what you are seeking = don't enter into them.