When learning a song by ear...

[Whousedtoplay]

It shouldn't be a problem for our TB members to figure out the chord progression of the following Pop song.

 

[Whousedtoplay]

I promise it's my last posting for today in this thread.
I was listening to a new Eric Clapton's song, "Pompous Fools", and it reminded me about my younger gigging years.
It could be late in the evening when I would receive a phone call,
"Hey, can you grab your gear and get here right now? We need a bass player ASAP."

Most probably, there were about 80% songs from this/that band's repertoire known to me or, at least, I've heard them, but...
There were songs unknown/unheard to me that I needed to play it right now, right here on stage.
And the guitar (keyboard) player would tell you,
"It's in C, but we start it with F (subdominant).
"It's a slow British-Pop/European Pop 8th beat."
"Let's go One Two and One Two Three Four."

OK.
Here is that song in C but it starts with F.

Just try for yourself. You are on stage and you don't want to disappoint the singer.

 

[uOpt]

Hmmm. I'm so screwed / have to work hard.

 

[Whousedtoplay]

Hmmm. I'm so screwed / have to work hard.

No, you are in the right place with us.
Now.
Let's take a closer look at that Clapton's song and review my "actions" on "guessing" the chords of the track.

"Hey, guitar player, is it a difficult chord progression?"
"No, everything is, more or less, diatonic."
"Just play, mostly, the roots."
"OK."
"Thanks."


I know the tempo and the drum pattern (British/Euro Pop).
The guitar starts, and the guitar phrase/tune in Intro clearly tells me, "It's POP music."
I know it start on F.
(I hear some "additives" to that F major chord but I don't pay any attention to it,
"Is it Fmaj7 or Fmaj9", but I hear F6/9 (it has D), etc.?"

I know, it's F for me.
The guitar solo in Intro (before the vocal) tells me, "After F we are going back to C - as IV - I."
Yes, it could go to ii - Dmin7, but the melody "leans" more towards going back to IV.
And the guitar pop soloing in Intro indicates (and the rhythmical accompaniment) - it will be some repetition of IV - I.
(I'm careful and don't play loud.)

In the third repetition of that standard IV - I, I hear a diminished chord.
I would, probably, miss it (the first time, unless the guitar player specifically indicate visually about that change or playing it as a syncope) and would play that F# in the bass on the second eighth note (keep the Groove) of Beat 3 (maybe, as a slide), and I would pronounce that F# loudly on Beat4.
Now, you can hear that F# on the bass.

N.B. I would memorize that chord movement from F to F#min7b5 for the future rendition of that song.

It's nothing new for a pop song to have that kind of chord progression from F (Fmaj9) to F#min7b5, but...
After that F#min7b5, I know there are a few pop cadences - like some TEMPLATES.
Usually, it goes back to I (Tonic, but it could go to vi, or else) and the TEMPLATE continues through the Circle of 5th.
It's, kind of, a pop-ishly Blues cadence - I - VI(7) - II7 - V7 - I
(I've heard a lot of songs with that kind of Chord progression/Cadence. It's very memorable.)
In our case of the bass (root) notes, it's C - A - D - G - C

Now, I've learned the chord progression in Part A.
I just need to repeat the same chord progression.
N.B. Just don't forget that diminished chord - the bass plays F#.

After several repetitions of that chord progression, I would be carefully waiting for some new section of the song.
"But what about some BRIDGE part?"

Usually, the guitar/keyboard player would indicate,
"Hey, pay attention. Look at my hand, or just - Attention."
Sometimes, a guitar/keyboard player would yell, "Amin"
"Thanks."

Yes, here is our Bridge or Part B, and it's Amin (like a minor Tonic).
If I've missed that Amin on Beat 1, I would slide from C to A or rhythmically walk/get to A.
That (temporary and quietly) C in the bass with Amin does not destroy the Amin chord.
Next.
The melody in that Part B, kind of, indicates a chord movement from Amin to E7.
(To tell you the truth, the beginning in PartB/Bridge sounds like Eagles' Hotel California.
That movement back from E to Amin could be, slightly, "delayed" but rhythmically proper.
Once again, that temporary (and quiet) E with Amin does not "torture" the Amin chord.
Next. The pop melody back on Amin (again, memories from other pop song chord progressions)
and the rhythmic accompaniment of G7 indicate a movement to C - the TONIC.
The next chord movement/progression is (UNTICIPATED) a real cliché of ii - V - I, but...
Instead of I (as C) it goes to a vi (Amin) - think of relative modes.
I would anticipate that movement to vi - Amin with some 60% chance instead of C for two reasons:
The MELODY goes to A, plus, we still have a few bars/measures to go in order to complete that section/Part B.
N.B. It's very important to think about of the song's form.

And the last part of that Bridge - after clearly inculcated POP melody notes and movements -

It's D and G, but...
With G chord, we have a tutti - the drummer would indicate, "Pay attention"; therefore, my first rendition of it would be some G, going up an octave G, reactionary A and "smudged" B or Bb.
Oh, yes, it's movement in the bass - G A Bb/A# and B.
I must remember it.

 

[Whousedtoplay]

I think it's time to stop my braggadocio.
I've talked about the chord movement/progression of a simple (diatonically-inclined) Euro Pop song, but...
Let's imagine that the band tells me (on stage), "Hey, next song is "Don't Give Up On Us" - JOURNEY.
Have you heard it?"
"NO!"
And that song would destroy any happiness of being a bass player for me.
Yes, it's a PURE JOURNEY chord structure/architecture.
Yes, I can hear, "It's JOURNEY", but...
I would be glued to the guitar player's hand in order to follow the chord progression.
I'm not suitable of recognizing/predicting that kind of chords.
I know to play the roots, but what about all those unpredictable chord movements.
My brain would have "issues" trying to memorize the harmony of the song.
The bass starts with Eb (as Ebmin - Tonic) and moves to Cb (as B), to Bb (with Gb - I would, probably, play Gb), to Db, Ab (Abmin), and back to Eb - minor Tonic (as PLAGAL CADENCE.)


Are we finished yet?
LOL

N.B. But the song still tries to keep up with its DIATONIC chord structure, but there is an exception when we have a borrowed chord of Ab major with the bass playing C natural - it's in the part of the guitar solo.
Ebmin to Ab/C to Db to Ab/C, and repeat several times.
After the guitar solo, we have a descending bass movement:
Gb - Gbb(F natural) - Eb - Cb (as B)
Gb - F natural - Ab
Gb - F natural - Eb - Db - Ab to Cb (as B natural)
and, EVENTUALLY, back to our TONIC - Eb.

I would scream inside, "ENOUGH!"
The chord movement is very confusing for me.

 

[LBS-bass]

One point, that I think you're making though I haven't listened to the examples yet, is that once you have played a lot of songs, much of what you'll hear is familiar. Music has natural patterns and many popular songs will follow one of these patterns, so if you've played them enough, you'll have a pretty good idea about where a song is going to go, even if you haven't ever played it before.

I used to play with a guitar player who accused me of being psychic because I didn't know his songs very well but I always figured out where he was headed. The guy was steeped in the blues and his bag of tricks wasn't really that deep, much of it was pretty easy to guess at. But the other trick I learned a while back was something that I hear Phil Lesh doing a lot in live shows - that's a little hiccup of syncopation at the chord changes to give your ear a chance to hear what's happening on the first beat so you you can come in with it on the "and" or the 2. If you don't have a clue where the music is headed next, you can always listen and come in with something a little late that sounds planned but wasn't

 

[Whousedtoplay]

once you have played a lot of songs, much of what you'll hear is familiar. Music has natural patterns and many popular songs will follow one of these patterns, so if you've played them enough, you'll have a pretty good idea about where a song is going to go, even if you haven't ever played it before.

Yes.
Depending on the music style, your ears (and your brain) starts recognizing those "possible" chord progression patterns, plus, the Melody also contributes a lot with the prediction of the next chord/s.
When I was younger, I used to dabble in writing songs/instrumentals. Over a long(-er) period of time, you tend to develop a skill of predicting the chord progression through the Melody movement.
Yes, sometimes the Melody (and the chord progression) could take a very unusual turn. That's when you say, "WOW!"

 

[LBS-bass]

Yes.
Depending on the music style, your ears (and your brain) starts recognizing those "possible" chord progression patterns, plus, the Melody also contributes a lot with the prediction of the next chord/s.
When I was younger, I used to dabble in writing songs/instrumentals. Over a long(-er) period of time, you tend to develop a skill of predicting the chord progression through the Melody movement.
Yes, sometimes the Melody (and the chord progression) could take a very unusual turn. That's when you say, "WOW!"

That's the way I like to write. I think of the predictable thing and then do something else

 

[Biggbass]

I map out the chordal arrangement, then compare the bass part to the root notes, make my personal notes on anything that doesn't follow the typical pattern of bass on the root/kick. And let it roll.

But, for the most part, if you can recognize progressions, scales, arpeggios, modes, etc, you can usually hear the bass part and see it in your mind's eye while mentally interpreting the changes.
Many tunes are somewhat standard progressions and root patterns. It just takes time and doing it over and over and over and over and over until it's like a second language.

 

[Whousedtoplay]

But, for the most part, if you can recognize progressions, scales, arpeggios, modes, etc, you can usually hear the bass part and see it in your mind's eye while mentally interpreting the change

Yes, your memory should start recognizing those STANDARD chord progressions.

The vi–ii–V–I progression

From Wikipedia.

"It is "undoubtedly the most common and the strongest of all harmonic progressions" and consists of "adjacent roots in ascending fourth or descending fifth relationship", with movement by ascending perfect fourth being equivalent to movement by descending perfect fifth due to inversion
"In music, the vi–ii–V–I progression is a chord progression (also called the circle progression for the circle of fifths, along which it travels)."

It means that we, as the bass players, must recognize that chord progression in any style of music.
Here is an example/a song that, for sure, 99% of the TB members have never heard about, but the musical memory should say, "Hey, I recognize that progression."
Emin - Amin - D7 - G(maj7) as vi–ii–V–I.



It's just goes over and over again - Intro and Chorus, but...

In Verse or Part B (that's what I call it) we have some interesting harmonic device.
Instead of going back to the TONIC - Gmaj7 after D7, we have a borrowed chord of Dmin11 and "humanly-produced TEMPORARY chord movement of ii - V7 - I but...
That temporary tonicization gives us a "false" TONIC chord of Cmaj7 as in Dmin11 - G7 - Cmaj7.
All our smart TB members - the Jazzists - always remind us (the Pop musicians) to pay attention to that very Jazzy ii - V - I progression that could pop up in very unusual harmonic places with TEMPORARY Tonics via TONIZATION.
Part B:
Dmin11 - G7 - Cmaj7 - Cmaj7
(but the next chord - D7 (dominant) tells us - we are back to our REAL KEY of G.)
D7 - Gmaj7 - Gmaj7.
We have a new repetition of that Part B:
Dmin11 - G7 - Cmaj7 but instead of staying on Cmaj7, it moves to Amin (relative minor) and gets us back to our "FAVORITE" vi–ii–V–I, as Amin-D7- Gmaj7.

 

[Whousedtoplay]

N.B. It's going to be my last post in this thread for today.
I promise.
It's just the following track
(A) has so much of the Circle of 5th progression - TRAIN YOUR EAR to recognize the C5th progression.
(B) arranged and played by a superb Musician/Bass player.
(C) it has a very MELODIOUS bass solo.

Some description of that newly-rendered track.

"Stranger in Paradise" is a popular song from the musical Kismet (1953), credited to Robert Wright and George Forrest. Like almost all the music in that show, the melody was taken from music composed by Alexander Borodin (1833–1887), in this case, the "Gliding Dance of the Maidens", from the Polovtsian Dances in the opera Prince Igor (1890). The song in the musical is a lovers' duet and describes the transcendent feelings that love brings to their surroundings."

Just beautiful!

 

[Whousedtoplay]

It shouldn't be a problem for our TB members to figure out the chord progression of the following Pop song.

The chord progression is - more like - two chord progressions:
1) I - ii - V - I
and
2) I - vi - ii - V

As G - Amin - D7 - G - Emin - Amin - D7 - G

Now, when listening to that song many years ago, I was expecting to hear (probably) the most common bass pattern - the root and fifth pattern.
An example:

But, the bass was playing just the roots.
N.B. The bass plays the 5ths only at the very end of the song form before another cyclic form begins.
Plus, sometimes the bass plays two eighth notes instead of one quarter note in that groove.
Ex.:

Since then, I've started checking and theorizing when to play the Root - 5th pattern and when to play only the roots.
It has been an interesting topic for me as a Pop Bass player.
P.S. Almost no other bass players (including our TB forum) were interested in that topic.

 

[Spin Doctor]

Hmmm. I'm so screwed / have to work hard.

Try to make this narrative a little bit less complicated. Just watch this video until you pretty much have the sounds of these common chord progressions memorized. It will explain a lot of stuff that you don't currently understand, but it's super easy to get your head around.

You want to get to the point where you can sing these progressions to yourself on command. So make up some flashcards, write down the progressions and test yourself with them every single day. That should give you a good start to building your ear. This is only seven progressions demonstrated here, but honestly there's not that many progressions that even sound good anyway.

The key to learning difficult tasks is to make the problem as simple as possible. If you do this one thing I guarantee your ear will get better, but you're not going to solve everything at one time. Just pick one simple goal and get after it. Then pick something else and do the same. Give it enough time so that you understand what you're doing in each phase.

 

[Whousedtoplay]

Just watch this video until you pretty much have the sounds of these common chord progressions memorized.

Thank you for a very informative link.
Very nice.
To my regret, it has not worked for me.
For me, it's that never-ending, constant, everyday, actively-engaging listening over a long period of time that has helped me to hear simple chord progressions, but I'm still learning.
And I always need to update my knowledge.
As soon as I can hear, "Yes, it's a Major chord,", then, another question pops up,
"Hey, is it Major 7 or Major 9, or Major 6/9, etc..."
For numerous reasons, the contemporary harmonic palette of even simple Pop songs gets too complicated.

 

[Trilobita]

Yes, sometimes it could be difficult for a lot of musicians, including myself.
I would start with very simple (harmony-wise) pop songs and let my brain to recognize/internalize those simple chord progression.

Let's start with the following (constant) 3-chord progression track.
Can you listen and try to figure (approximately) what's happening with the chords?

I have just found your game today. Please keep posting these. I would certainly keep coming back to them (and to check the answers).