Double Bass Which pickup?

[Caoimhín]

How's it going?

Finally have a bit of cash to get myself a pickup for my bass. Was thinking of getting the Upton Rev Solo 2 but the gap between the wings and the legs on my bridge isn't quite parallel (see below) so this might rule it out? I suppose the reason I was looking at the Solo was cos of good reviews here and that it's quite cheap and easy to install and remove (don't have to remove the bridge or get a new one).

I'd be looking for that 'like my bass only louder' sound cos I get a fairly decent pizz sound as it is (arco is a different kettle of fish but thats another story). The bass is a fairly new carved Czech Strunal. The bridge does tend to bend towards the fingerboard from time to time - I don't know if this means I should replace the bridge anyway or if its just the due to the strings stretching and being retuned.

So my dilemma is:

- do I get a new bridge with a parallel gap so I can fit the Rev Solo?

- if I'm getting a new bridge anyway would it be more worthwhile maybe go for the fishman full circle?

- do I go for the Gage Realist which would mean no new bridge for now but a bit more intrusive and hassle to install/remove?

ALSO - I don't have a dedicated acoustic amplifier. I have my Warwick CCL 115 combo that I use for my electric. Will this be OK to use for a double bass or do people generally go for the dedicated amplifiers like AE and acoustic image etc?

Any advice is appreciated...

 

[mstclairmiller]

This is interesting - a friend gave me a bridge with the same shape wings, but I have never used it due to using an Underwood. Any comments would be gratefully received, as this is only the second one I have ever seen.

Looks like a Realist for you, unless you want to pay for another bridge! Each pickup sounds different on each bass, so it is really a question of suck it and see, so to speak. It seems to me that the pricier pickups reproduce the sound of the bass, and the cheaper pickups tend to give a "sound". If you really like the sound of your bass, a realist will probably give a good amped sound. Check out the other threads re pickups to get a broader perspective - there are lots of pickups around and even more opinions on each one, but each bass (and amp) is different. Hence Leo Fender making the precision!

re the amp, plug in your bass, once you get a pick up, and see what it sounds like

Also, the Realist seems to me to be one of the easier pickups to install - just slacken the strings, bung it under the bass bar side foot, reset bridge, and your are in business. Much easier than carefully sanding the wings to fit a Rev Solo.

 

[greitzer]

...The bridge does tend to bend towards the fingerboard from time to time - I don't know if this means I should replace the bridge anyway or if its just the due to the strings stretching and being retuned...
- do I go for the Gage Realist which would mean no new bridge for now but a bit more intrusive and hassle to install/remove?

Any advice is appreciated...

One additional thing to think about (and make the dilemma even harder) is this: if your bridge tends to lean northward, it won't make full contact with the Gage Realist (which needs the full bridge foot on top of it to function), and you won't get much sound, or maybe not any sound. This is a problem I had with mine, until I put different strings on and the bridge doesn't lean any more.

Perhaps a new bridge, with the more traditional flat wing shape, might be a good idea.

 

[Eric Hochberg]

Regular bass maintenance requires checking the bridge position and adjusting the angle when necessary (loosen the strings and push the top of the bridge south). The bridge top tends to creep north with time. If your bridge is warped, then you need a new one.

For the Rev pickup, you might be able to have a piece of maple grafted to the wing slot to accommodate the pickup, but from the shape of your bridge, that might be difficult and wouldn't be the best solution. You could get a Full Circle and have an adjustable bridge in the bargain (I think this is the best idea). You could also get a Schertler Stat B which fits in the circular cutouts of the bridge. A shim might be necessary if the holes are too large, but this is easily done.

 

[Nils Ö]

A Schertler electrostatic pickup should fit. It will require a small piece of wood being glued to the bridge (as with any bridge).

I think the Schertler is a better choice than the Realist, both when it comes to sound and mechanical/electrical quality. (Strictly IMHO)

 

[holzwurm]

You won't have a problem with the wing design or bridge foot contact by using a pickup like the Wilson K1 or K4, or Balsereit. However, you need to drill a hole into your bridge.

 

[TroyK]

The search for the perfect pickup (and amp) can be a long and painful one. Opinions abound and much depends on where and how you play. I personally believe that "like my bass only louder" is myth and will cost you a lot of money to rule out. You will not get there with a 15" speaker and a Warwick amp. But you might get to a good sound.

First, your bridge. If it's leaning towards your fingerboard, it shouldn't. If it's bent, you're going to want a new one. If it's just leaning (the feet have tilted off of the table) loosen the strings a little bit, lay your bass on her back or have a friend hold her, put your fingers between the strings and pull it back towards the tailpiece until it is at a right angle to the table. If the bridge was made properly for your bass, it will fit nicely to the top. If not, your bass will never sound right.

I don't see adjusters, which rules out the full circle for that bridge. If you get a new bridge, I think it's a good choice. If your bridge is warped, you'll need a new one and let's come back to that.

The Realist has some good and bad qualities. They sound pretty natural. Especially with a plywood bass, I think they do very well. I had one for years and hundreds of gigs. They do leave a little mark on the top of your bass, some people really worry about this others don’t. If you’re obsessive about that union between the bridge feet and the top, anything in between is bad, but you’re obviously not. A good thing about the Realist for you is this, not all amps are made for piezo pickups. EBG amps are not and they sound terrible when you plug a piezo pickup into them unless you use a premp. Not a big deal if you have a impedance matching preamp and don’t mind using one, but more money, more stuff to bring to the gig, more things to break, more things to keep batteries for, more stuff to go wrong. The Realist works and sounds fundamentally the same with whatever amp (or PA) you plug it into and I always liked it for that reason. It’s a good workingman’s pickup. Affordable and functional. Not as harsh as anything that goes into a bridgewing in my experience.

The Rev Solo didn’t work for me the way it has for other. Sounded like a bridge wing pickup, which in my experience is harsh and stringy. Might have got a better sound with some magic pre-amping, but I’m not into that sort of thing. My bandmates hated it following the Realist.

I’m currently using The Full Circle and like it. I may like it better than the Realist. Perhaps only just. I like the way that it mounts on the bass the best, but I use adjusters and don’t feel the need to take it off.

The Stat-B, as someone mentioned mentioned is a nice pickup too. A bit expensive. Very high in fidelity, you have to use THEIR pre-amp (included) and they can feedback. They are a bit finicky and can be difficult to live with. I have a friend who has used one for years and loves his. To each his own. I can’t really say why people have different experiences with them.

Other bridge wing pickups like the Underwood are not really of the “like my bass only louder” variety.

Hope that helps. In the end, you’ll have to pick something and go.

 

[Eric Hochberg]

T
I don't see adjusters, which rules out the full circle for that bridge. If you get a new bridge, I think it's a good choice.

I say get the bridge cut for adjusters and use a FC. You don't need a new bridge unless the old one is warped. You'll be able to adjust your string height and the FC reportedly sounds very good.

Regarding the Realist, I have only heard one bass where the Realist brought out a wide enough frequency spectrum for a good, punchy bass pizz sound. My bass sounded too dark with it for pizz as most other basses I've heard do. They sound quite good for arco, however.

 

[TroyK]

I agree and disagree.

I use the fullcircle now and like it quite a bit. Good pickup.

I used the Realist for years and liked it too. I know quite a few other Realist users and think they generally sound consistently good. I think that there is a volume level that they tend to lose some goodness, but it's pretty loud and I think that there is a range of sounds that you can't dial in with the Realist that you can with say the Stat-B, which is more versital, but is also more troublesome. It is a plug and play pickup.

But, I chose to switch to the Full Circle and am happy that I did. I think it's a better pickup. By how much? I'm not sure and it probably depends on your needs.

Either way, you might want to get a luthier to take a look at your bridge.

 

[Caoimhín]

Thanks for all the input lads - I've a lot to think over now.

As far as the bridge is concerned I don't think it's actually too bad. I was at my luthier's last week getting some minor repairs and he just mentioned in passing afterwards that he adjusted the bridge. I didn't even notice it beforehand. My teacher adjusted it once before as well a few months back. However, I would be open to getting a new bridge if it looks like this could become more of a problem in the future and this would be as good an opportunity as any.

I've heard good things about the Schertler pickups but can't actually find anywhere online that seems to be selling them. I presume I'm just not looking in the right places. And from what I hear they're a good deal more expensive. I suppose I would be of the more 'plug in and play' musician - don't really relish fiddling with knobs and positioning etc when I could be playing.

From reading this forum and others I've pretty much heard the same stuff said about the full circle and realist so I suppose it's horses for courses really. And it is a good point about the amp - that's on a wishlist for another day and if I can get a decent sound from the pickup hopefully that day can be as far away as possible.

So far the realist is looking like a front-runner...

 

[Caoimhín]

Well, now I've been doing some thinking and looking and reading and searching and I'm thinking of splashing out on an amp while I'm at it. I was thinking of the Acoustic Image Contra combo but I've seen here more than once people saying that realists don't match well with the Contra. And that they tend to be on the quiet side. I tend to play next to some loud drummers and I already gripe about the volume from my Warwick amp[for my electric]. THEN I was thinking of maybe getting a Clarus 1 head and a suitable speaker cab? I'd like - if at all possible - to get an amp that I could use my electric through as well. BUT with a cap of about $1000.

Asking too much??

Can it be done??

Any suggestions??



Oh yeah, MSTClairMiller, the bass is from the Srunal factory in the Czech republic. I bought it from a local luthier that had it in his shop unused as far as I know for quite some time and that bridge was on it when I got it. So i assume it's the factory bridge. At the school of music where I get lessons they have another bass in the room with a similar shaped bridge. And judging from what I've read here it's not all that uncommon. Hope that helps...

 

[TroyK]

Impossible to say about the bridge without looking at it. If your luthier isn't worried about it, I wouldn't worry about it. If if was just out of position, then having it repositioned is all you need. If it is warped, it's got to be replaced. Much better off with a new bridge than ANY new amp.

Which amp? Sheesh. I dont' ahve the energy for that now. The AI Combos are nice, not the best all purpose EBG, DB, any pickup/any gig, only amp I own combos. But good for what they're good for.

There's a lot of research involved and a lot of cash and trial and error involved in just the right rig. You started out by saying "I finally ahve the money for a pickup." Are you sure you want to start this? Should you maybe just ask you luthier about your bridge, put a Realist (or something) on, go out and play some gigs and then revisit later on after you've made some dough?

 

[bolo]

... I was thinking of maybe getting a Clarus 1 head and a suitable speaker cab? I'd like - if at all possible - to get an amp that I could use my electric through as well. BUT with a cap of about $1000.

Asking too much??

Can it be done??

Any suggestions??

I think it can be done. The Clarus 1 is $750 new. But there is a TB/DB classifieds section here.

I think there are lots of good head and cab combinations that might meet your needs. There are some good threads in this forum if you search a bit on 'doubling', stuff like that.

 

[MT Spaces]

.... I was thinking of the Acoustic Image Contra combo but I've seen here more than once people saying that realists don't match well with the Contra .... THEN I was thinking of maybe getting a Clarus 1 head and a suitable speaker cab?

Cao ..... I'm confused here . The Contra and the Clarus are both AI amps .... so if the Realist isn't good (because of impedance, for example) with the Contra, it won't be good with the Clarus either.

Now, if you are talking about the tone and volume of the Contra's internal speaker versus hooking a Clarus up to a nice external speaker like an EA Wizzy cabinet of some kind so you can get a different and louder sound ..... well, that is a different kettle of cabbage .

I really don't know (I have a Solo Rev II and an AI Coda) whether the Realist works with AI amps or not but you can search threads about the Realist to find out. You may just need to get one of FDeck's snazzy little gizmos or other pre-amp to put between the Realist and the Clarus. Good Luck.
Invalid Link Removed

 

[TroyK]

It's not really that.

Reputationally, not scientifically, The Realist doesn't get along very well with the AI combos. It's not an impedience issue and I'm not sure it's a universal opinion. Opinions on the AI combos are not universal for that matter. Of the people who like them, the Realist doesn't seem to be their pickup of choice.

 

[MingusAmongUs]

I 2nd Troy here -- currently using the full circle but also had great results with the Realist -- In fact I liked the Realist better under normal circumstances but at louder volumes it does tend to fuzz out and get kinda ugly.

So, I'd recommend either the Realist -- it's really pretty easy to install, not necessary to remove the bridge, just loosen the strings up enough to slip the pickup under the E foot, and unwind the G to get the jack around it -- or the full circle and a new bridge. If your current bridge is bending (not leaning but warping) then you may need to replace it anyway.

 

[Caoimhín]

All valid points lads - thanks for the input here my head is starting to sway!

mingus - the bridge really is a lean and not warping

bob - hooking up a clarus to a different make's cab is pretty much what I was thinking. although having said that i've so many thoughts going round and round my head god only knows what I'm thinking now

bolo - thanks for the link. didn't even occur to me to check under my nose. there's a guy in Europe with some EA gear that I'm inquiring about

troyk - you're right about the cash involved aspect but this is a fairly typical thing I do, set out with a small target and get carried away. i don't even fight it anymore


I'm thinking now of the Henriksen Jazzamp 12 with a realist. Pretty much seems to fit the bill from what I've read (which has been waaay too much at this stage) in terms of price, volume and weight. Although I'm still unsure about doubling it with a slab.

 

[Caoimhín]

Just in case I've been keeping ye all up late at night paining over what choice I'd make I'm delighted at last to be able to put ye out of ye're misery.

After a lot of soul and amp/pick-up searching I went ahead and bought a second hand EA iAmp 500 and Wizzy 12 that I found in the TB classifieds. I'm still considering which pickup (back at square 1 I hear you say?) but have pretty much settled on the realist at this stage.

Have only tried the EA gear on my electrics so far (only got back from picking it up yesterday) and already its a big big improvement on what I had. I'll have to wait just that bit longer to let the big girl loose on it.

Can't wait though....