Who can decipher this? Nashville Number System

[E Joe]

So tonic chord in first inversion or Ib in roman, with 5/7 being dominant chord in 3rd inversion or Vc in roman.

Somewhat confusingly, but ultimately way easier for bassists, 5/7 would be the first inversion of the 5 chord.

The numbers are always going to relate to major scale intervals. So in the key of C 5/7 would be G/B chord. If you wanted to have the G chord in 3rd inversion it would look like this 5/4.

Basically read every number as it relates to the tonic or 1 chord, unless it’s a small number next to it used to indicate a specific voicing like on a standard lead sheet.
So a dominant 5 chord would have a little seven on the upper right hand side and no slashes in between them.

 

[SteveCS]

The numbers are always going to relate to major scale intervals. So in the key of C 5/7 would be G/B chord. If you wanted to have the G chord in 3rd inversion it would look like this 5/4.

OK, that figures (no pun intended). So if it was the 5 chord in second inversion, e.g. G/D in C, would it be 5/2 or 5/9? I'll take a punt at 5/2, since 5/9 implies above the root, i.e. there is no inversion and someone else has the low note.

 

[E Joe]

Yep! It’d be 5/2

 

[E Joe]

In defense of the Nashville system versus standard notation, the vagueness is a feature and not a bug as the chart is often used as a rough guideline so the player can use their own discretion on what to play over the changes.

Even if they want it played exactly as recorded you’re expected to learn that by ear and use the chart as a rough guide.

To expect a songwriter to notate each instrument exactly would be pretty demanding even if they wrote music well.

It’s not about dumb, it’s more about lazy. I’m a fan generally!

 

[Acoustic356]

I sort of do the same thing myself - my own personal chart with my own " musical notations". I'm not in Nashville, and I know about the Number system, but, where I am, I usually get a " demo " recording of whatever they want me to play bass on. Typically, this will be a scratch vocal track, with ( hopefully ) percussion and keys. Sometimes I'm free to come up with a bass line, others I'm given a rough idea of how they want theView attachment 4582546 bass to go, and finally, sometimes a bass " pattern " they want me to follow ( Johnny Rawls typically does this ). Making my own " charts ", helps me tremendously better than just giving me a chord chart to follow. Saves so much time, and, time is money in the studio, as we all know. Here's a typical " roadmap personal chart" that I used.

Charts like that are fine, until you get to a gig and the singer says, I can't hit those notes today, let's change from D to G... or other odd things that I've had to go through.

Last minute changes to arrangements due to singer changes or whatever happen. Although I can read a chord chart, learning by numbers allows me to play any song that I know in any key without having to only think about being musical in the context.

 

[Whousedtoplay]

how something more rhythmically complicated is charted.

What about those dots?

 

[jnewmark]

Charts like that are fine, until you get to a gig and the singer says, I can't hit those notes today, let's change from D to G... or other odd things that I've had to go through.

Last minute changes to arrangements due to singer changes or whatever happen. Although I can read a chord chart, learning by numbers allows me to play any song that I know in any key without having to only think about being musical in the context.

Yes, not intended for all situations. I usually use my little " road maps " in the studio. As far as gigs go , they are pretty well rehearsed beforehand; the only guys who need charts are the horn players, mostly.

 

[Drucifer]

I recommend this book, but had no idea it was this expensive now. I’m going to treat my copy better.

It's $19.95 new at this link: https://www.amazon.com/Nashville-Number-System-Chas-Williams/dp/0963090674/

 

[SteveCS]

What about those dots?

View attachment 4583971

From that and other clues I might infer a 6/8 time signature:

so, translated into the key of C for something like this:

 

[dreamadream99]

I just want to remind everyone that:

• TAB alone Can show fingerings, but not rhythm
• Nashville Numbers can show intervals, but not pitch
• Traditional notation can show pitch, rhythm, intervals, dynamics, tempo, time signatures, directional markings, and articulations.

There is a reason that traditional notation has long been, and continues to be standard.

 

[SteveCS]

Traditional notation can show pitch, rhythm, intervals, dynamics, tempo, time signatures, directional markings, and articulations.

... and fingering, if you so wish.

 

[Acoustic356]

I just want to remind everyone that:

• TAB alone Can show fingerings, but not rhythm
• Nashville Numbers can show intervals, but not pitch
• Traditional notation can show pitch, rhythm, intervals, dynamics, tempo, time signatures, directional markings, and articulations.

There is a reason that traditional notation has long been, and continues to be standard.

There are a lot of places where this is t reasonable.

Certain live applications like cruise ships, churches, most studios in Nashville.

Think of it as another tool that you need to know to be able to get more work.

 

[TomB]

It's $19.95 new at this link: https://www.amazon.com/Nashville-Number-System-Chas-Williams/dp/0963090674/

Shucks! You mean I paid 4 bucks too much ?

 

[DrummerwStrings]

Yeah, you and me both. I wouldn't have the slightest idea of what to do with that "chart". I use my own self taught, hack Nashville number-esc system which is largly listing the chords as the number of their root note in the major (or minor scale if it's in a minor key). I assume they are some kind of major chord variant unless I put a small "m" after the number which means that it's some kind of minor chord variant. I write the number down for each measure it's played. A simplified example could be something like this (for a 12 bar blues) ...

111144115415

I play mostly blues, soul and r&b so what I do most of the time is assume a 12 bar and only annotate where it varies from the basic pattern with all kinds of semi-standard terms like "quick 4", "long 5", church changes on the turnaround, rhythm changes, sharp 5/5 turnaround, 2-5-1 turnaround, hang on the one until the vocals come in, etc, etc. I use my bastardized Nashville number-esc system mostly for sub gigs where I'll write down all kinds of crib notes for myself in order to deliver as professional a performance as possible and then they'll call precious few of the songs we talked about and instead throw mostly curve balls at me all night. Da blues ... ya gotsta love it!!!

You have to have had the Blues to PLAY the Blues. I guess - I wouldn’t put playing a song I did not practice in the same league as coming home & once again finding too many dirty dishes. On St. Valentine’s Day.

I’m looking forward to reading more insights from people who regularly use the Nashville Numbering System, especially from pros in Nashville.

I guess a takeaway is you won’t get called up to the pros if you can’t hit a curve?

 

[DrummerwStrings]

So tonic chord in first inversion or Ib in roman, with 5/7 being dominant chord in 3rd inversion or Vc in roman.

Question: would the third inversion be written

7/1

if ‘The 1/3 is actually a 1 over 3 or a 1 chord with a 3rd in the bass (ie: C/E or F/A… etc).’ ?

 

[E Joe]

Question: would the third inversion be written

7/1

if ‘The 1/3 is actually a 1 over 3 or a 1 chord with a 3rd in the bass (ie: C/E or F/A… etc).’ ?

I hope I’m not butting in here, but a 1 chord 3rd inversion would be written as 1/7. In the key of C a 1/7 would be voiced the same as a C/B would on a standard lead sheet.

 

[E Joe]

26152830[/URL], member: 53358"]I just want to remind everyone that:

• TAB alone Can show fingerings, but not rhythm
• Nashville Numbers can show intervals, but not pitch
• Traditional notation can show pitch, rhythm, intervals, dynamics, tempo, time signatures, directional markings, and articulations.

There is a reason that traditional notation has long been, and continues to be standard.

While I totally agree traditional notation does have more clarity for specifics the Nashville system is a lot more suited to certain styles where you want the musician to play over the changes using their own musicality.

Part of why its so useful is because it’s not meant to tell you exactly what to play and where. It gives the player the bare minimum harmonic and structural information and assumes they’ll know how best to play their instrument. Kinda jazz like in that sense.

I don’t think it’s a failing of the system, but a more appropriate chart for many scenarios, and it is essential to working in or for Nashville/LA type artists as they’ll assume everyone uses it.

EDIT: I’m not trying to imply that reading staff isn’t using hella musicality, I’m just bad at finding a better wording for what I meant

 

[Lownote38]

The Nashville number system was devised as a quick way to transpose for singers. Especially in the studio where a transposition might be necessary FAST. Singer can't hit the note? Lower the key. Super simple with that system. We learned it in music school here because to work in Nashville, you really need to know it.

 

[DrummerwStrings]

I hope I’m not butting in here, but a 1 chord 3rd inversion would be written as 1/7. In the key of C a 1/7 would be voiced the same as a C/B would on a standard lead sheet.

Thanks for speaking up.

I used 7/1 because I thought the third inversion would have the 7th in the root position, then the root next: the example I quoted used 1/3 for C/E.

I recognize the notations aren’t universal - I’m trying to go along with the example.

 

[SteveCS]

Thanks for speaking up.

I used 7/1 because I thought the third inversion would have the 7th in the root position, then the root next: the example I quoted used 1/3 for C/E.

I recognize the notations aren’t universal - I’m trying to go along with the example.

Your terminology is just a little confused here. Root Position doesn't refer to the lowest note in the arrangement - it refers to a chord arranged such that the Root is the lowest note. So it isn't possible to have a chord in 3rd Inversion and Root Position at the same time. The Root is nothing more than the letter-name or scale degree after which the chord is named.