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Who prefers mass produced over boutique?

I could never understand or get comfortable with this personally, if that's your choice no problem I don't mean to convince anyone otherwise...

Personally I didn't spend time and money trying to find the bass that best suits my needs to leave it home when I have a gig regardless of the pay.

If you try to cross this philosophy into other lines of work it many times doesn't make sense either.

I never understood it either but I guess I can empathize with it.

I take anything I own anywhere I want. I don't spend extra time worrying about my gear, I do the same common sense stuff no matter what I'm using. I've used my Anthony Jackson and my Kawaii FII-B on the same $100 gigs and treated them the same.

I don't lean them up against stuff.
I don't leave them where people can easily get to and mess with them.
I make it clear, in whatever fashion I need to, that I value my stuff and won't tolerate people messing it up. In most cases just looking like I give a damn is enough to get that point across.
I don't lend out my instruments to people I don't know. If that makes people think I'm a dick, cool... I'm a dick with well-kept gear.
I load out my instruments LAST. Very important. If someone wants it bad enough to steal it off my shoulder, come and get it.
:cool:

On any of my gigs you'll typically see me with a couple of basses worth several thousand dollars... but I don't act like it. I didn't buy this stuff to use only on special ocassions.
 
It's really just a choice that exist in every walk of life from a 1963 corvette split window coupe to your wife's best jewelery and her fine china for special occasions. If you don't understand this either you, 1. Don't own a one off bass or, 2. You just don't get it?

I get it and no offense, it's more of a collector mentality than a player one. I go with player... and I own several one-off basses. Most times I show up with two one-offs for gigs. Again, they're mine so why be so anal about them I don't use them? Most people would be mad if someone else told them they couldn't use what they own.
;)
 
It's really just a choice that exist in every walk of life from a 1963 corvette split window coupe to your wife's best jewelery and her fine china for special occasions. If you don't understand this either you, 1. Don't own a one off bass or, 2. You just don't get it?

It's funny I had a 5 figure upright bass in college, for 4 years it was the only bass I played and I took it everywhere. I never thought twice, except I was really lucky to have a nice bass and wanted to play it as much as possible.

We have "fine china" and we use it every day (dishwasher safe of course). My wife and I don't use paper plates and plastic cups when we have a party.

Some people just don't cover their living room furniture in plastic.
 
It's really just a choice that exist in every walk of life from a 1963 corvette split window coupe to your wife's best jewelery and her fine china for special occasions. If you don't understand this either you, 1. Don't own a one off bass or, 2. You just don't get it?

1. I have several "boutique" basses ( Custom Alembic, Status, Mouradian, Knuckle etc) that I gig with on a regular basis. Basses were meant to be played and I'm not going to take an SX out and play it and leave one of these sitting at home in a case. I also have a semi-exotic sports car that most owners leave in their garages and only drive on sunny days for my daily driver. Sports cars like basses are built to be used.

2. I get it, I choose not to live my life afraid that something might happen to my stuff.
 
Hmm... Good points, but I think this is really going to have to be an "agree to disagree" sort of thing - I believe that my high-end basses are meant to be played, too, but I also want to keep them nice so that I can enjoy them for many years to come.

In my humble opinion, the simple fact is that there are a lot of factors you can't control when you're taking these instruments out. The obvious counterargument is that you can't anticipate what "might" happen at home, but after having a bass killed in a bar fight I'd just as soon not tempt fate.

(I was at the bar, my Fender Jazz was in it's case, and the ******* bouncer ended up stepping on it to stop the fight - big guy, broke the neck at the heel.)

At any rate, I enjoy the **** out of my Dingwall and JC Bass, and my Alembic when I had it, etc, at home.

IME, there are three factors here:

1. No one's going to notice how much better you sound with your 5 figure bass than with my 3 figure bass, with very few exceptions. Obviously I'm not talking about recording studio time or high-class gigs, but in a bar full of 20-somethings, odds are one or two people will comment on your tone. Odds are pretty even that more people will come up to you and tell you how "cool" it looks.

2. No one wants to steal a cheapo. It's not a universal rule, but I haven't caught any envious glances from people who are loading in and out at the same time as me when I'm sporting the SX. In the hustle and bustle, I spend more time making sure my gear is safe than helping my band, and that doesn't make anyone happy.

3. If something does happen (and something will, eventually, to everyone) then I'd rather spend a few weeks modding another cheapo to the point where I'm satisfied with it's sound, playability, and looks than drop another $1K+ to repair a bass, much less buy a new one.

Therefore, please don't assume I don't play my basses, or enjoy playing them, or suggest that I'm doing them a disservice by keeping them safe. This is no different, IMO, than wearing the right clothes for the right event. If you're cool with wearing a business suit to a bar gig, then by all means do so, but don't assume that I don't appreciate business suits because I'm wearing jeans.

I understand that there are more points of view on this than just mine, but IMO practicality is just as important as anything else - I bought my SWR gear over Bergantino because of the same 3 reasons above. It's just not practical to me to drive a Ferrari to work everyday. The only reason I can see for doing it, since I can enjoy it just as much on sunny days, is that I want everyone to see that I can drive a Ferrari to work every day.

As always, though, my $.02 is just that.
 
Hmm... Good points, but I think this is really going to have to be an "agree to disagree" sort of thing - I believe that my high-end basses are meant to be played, too, but I also want to keep them nice so that I can enjoy them for many years to come.

In my humble opinion, the simple fact is that there are a lot of factors you can't control when you're taking these instruments out. The obvious counterargument is that you can't anticipate what "might" happen at home, but after having a bass killed in a bar fight I'd just as soon not tempt fate.

(I was at the bar, my Fender Jazz was in it's case, and the ******* bouncer ended up stepping on it to stop the fight - big guy, broke the neck at the heel.)

At any rate, I enjoy the **** out of my Dingwall and JC Bass, and my Alembic when I had it, etc, at home.

IME, there are three factors here:

1. No one's going to notice how much better you sound with your 5 figure bass than with my 3 figure bass, with very few exceptions. Obviously I'm not talking about recording studio time or high-class gigs, but in a bar full of 20-somethings, odds are one or two people will comment on your tone. Odds are pretty even that more people will come up to you and tell you how "cool" it looks.

2. No one wants to steal a cheapo. It's not a universal rule, but I haven't caught any envious glances from people who are loading in and out at the same time as me when I'm sporting the SX. In the hustle and bustle, I spend more time making sure my gear is safe than helping my band, and that doesn't make anyone happy.

3. If something does happen (and something will, eventually, to everyone) then I'd rather spend a few weeks modding another cheapo to the point where I'm satisfied with it's sound, playability, and looks than drop another $1K+ to repair a bass, much less buy a new one.

Therefore, please don't assume I don't play my basses, or enjoy playing them, or suggest that I'm doing them a disservice by keeping them safe. This is no different, IMO, than wearing the right clothes for the right event. If you're cool with wearing a business suit to a bar gig, then by all means do so, but don't assume that I don't appreciate business suits because I'm wearing jeans.

I understand that there are more points of view on this than just mine, but IMO practicality is just as important as anything else - I bought my SWR gear over Bergantino because of the same 3 reasons above. It's just not practical to me to drive a Ferrari to work everyday. The only reason I can see for doing it, since I can enjoy it just as much on sunny days, is that I want everyone to see that I can drive a Ferrari to work every day.

As always, though, my $.02 is just that.

Well chosen TB handle you've got!

Like you said - it's up to the owner to decide. I bought a $3k+ bass 2 years ago that is my #1 for all rehearsal and gigging. I got it because I love the sound and feel, and I want to play it every chance I get. Battle scars happen (neck snapped off is too much!).

If I could afford a $20k Alembic custom that sounds like it, I'd play that one every time.
 
Hmm... Good points, but I think this is really going to have to be an "agree to disagree" sort of thing - I believe that my high-end basses are meant to be played, too, but I also want to keep them nice so that I can enjoy them for many years to come.

In my humble opinion, the simple fact is that there are a lot of factors you can't control when you're taking these instruments out. The obvious counterargument is that you can't anticipate what "might" happen at home, but after having a bass killed in a bar fight I'd just as soon not tempt fate.

(I was at the bar, my Fender Jazz was in it's case, and the ******* bouncer ended up stepping on it to stop the fight - big guy, broke the neck at the heel.)

At any rate, I enjoy the **** out of my Dingwall and JC Bass, and my Alembic when I had it, etc, at home.

IME, there are three factors here:

1. No one's going to notice how much better you sound with your 5 figure bass than with my 3 figure bass, with very few exceptions. Obviously I'm not talking about recording studio time or high-class gigs, but in a bar full of 20-somethings, odds are one or two people will comment on your tone. Odds are pretty even that more people will come up to you and tell you how "cool" it looks.

2. No one wants to steal a cheapo. It's not a universal rule, but I haven't caught any envious glances from people who are loading in and out at the same time as me when I'm sporting the SX. In the hustle and bustle, I spend more time making sure my gear is safe than helping my band, and that doesn't make anyone happy.

3. If something does happen (and something will, eventually, to everyone) then I'd rather spend a few weeks modding another cheapo to the point where I'm satisfied with it's sound, playability, and looks than drop another $1K+ to repair a bass, much less buy a new one.

Therefore, please don't assume I don't play my basses, or enjoy playing them, or suggest that I'm doing them a disservice by keeping them safe. This is no different, IMO, than wearing the right clothes for the right event. If you're cool with wearing a business suit to a bar gig, then by all means do so, but don't assume that I don't appreciate business suits because I'm wearing jeans.

I understand that there are more points of view on this than just mine, but IMO practicality is just as important as anything else - I bought my SWR gear over Bergantino because of the same 3 reasons above. It's just not practical to me to drive a Ferrari to work everyday. The only reason I can see for doing it, since I can enjoy it just as much on sunny days, is that I want everyone to see that I can drive a Ferrari to work every day.

As always, though, my $.02 is just that.

1. I am going to notice how much better I sound. That is all that is important to me when it comes to the bass that I take out to play

2. People will steal anything. You could have your house robbed and your expensive bass stolen while you are playing your cheapie (its happened to a few friends of mine). But if you are that worried about it then by all means don't take an expensive bass out to play

3. "If something happens" I could be struck by lightening or hit by a drunk driver on my way to the gig. I choose not to let worrying about "what could happen" stop me from enjoying playing a nice bass.
 
You can replace a bass so why not play it, gig with it and treat it like the means to an end it is. If your intention is to collect, more power to you, keep it pristine don't play it, just show it. When you have the ability to obtain items such as a high end bass I think your perspective about them and what they represent becomes different. I have a number of one of basses, but if I lost them all I can always get some different one of basses. I really just need something that plays well and if it looks sharp that's all good too.
 
I never meant "never"
Let me give a example; I was going to a rehearsal, it was raining, I slipped fell on my bass (in a good hard case) and snapped the neck like a twig. 1200.00 bass, 350.00 neck.
I could have had my 6k bass and it does not have a bolt on neck!
Lets see??? How much did I save by not taking my high dollar bass to that rehearsal.
Someone said they took their top dollar bass on every gig and it was the only bass they owned, and... What else would you take? just a thought?
Anyone ever knocked over your base at a practice? You will notice that some people unplug their instrument when it's sitting in the stand, I can tell you why.
This is why I don't take a high dollar Bass's everywhere.
This is just my opinion, to each his own. You can row you boat with your bass, just take some pictures for the rest of us.:D
 
1. I am going to notice how much better I sound. That is all that is important to me when it comes to the bass that I take out to play

+1. I have two different criteria for tone, though, and I'm willing to sacrifice my tone for the peace of mind.

2. People will steal anything. You could have your house robbed and your expensive bass stolen while you are playing your cheapie (its happened to a few friends of mine). But if you are that worried about it then by all means don't take an expensive bass out to play

3. "If something happens" I could be struck by lightening or hit by a drunk driver on my way to the gig. I choose not to let worrying about "what could happen" stop me from enjoying playing a nice bass.

<snip>The obvious counterargument is that you can't anticipate what "might" happen at home, but after having a bass killed in a bar fight I'd just as soon not tempt fate.</snip>
...and my renter's insurance covers theft in the house, but not at a bar.

I agree with the sentiment, but I disagree with the thought that I can't enjoy my bass when and where I want - or that I enjoy it less because I play it less.

It's all well and good to say that you choose to not worry about what could happen. I'm just saying that I evidently can't choose to not worry - I'm not in a position where I can replace instruments, and I'd much rather err on the side of caution. It's quite simple for me - take it out and worry, or don't and enjoy myself - and probably sound better as a result. My choice is to leave it at home.

EDIT: Also, for the record, my expensive basses stay in their cases when not in use, as opposed to hanging on the wall with all my cheapies. Is that just good sense, or am I worrying too much there, too?
 
I never meant "never"
Let me give a example; I was going to a rehearsal, it was raining, I slipped fell on my bass (in a good hard case) and snapped the neck like a twig. 1200.00 bass, 350.00 neck.
I could have had my 6k bass and it does not have a bolt on neck!

I've been gigging for over thirty years and have never fallen with a bass. Think that's a result of pure luck or something else? I vote something else.

Don't take this the wrong way... a lot of what people consider accidents IMO aren't. Like a bass "accidentally" falling when it's leaning against your amp. That's not an accident. Or running over it with your car. Or not paying attention to what you're doing. IMO "accident" is the easy way out. I prefer another "a" word... anticipate.

Lets see??? How much did I save by not taking my high dollar bass to that rehearsal.

You saved yourself from the enjoyment of playing that instrument. And yes, life is short;)

Someone said they took their top dollar bass on every gig and it was the only bass they owned, and... What else would you take? just a thought?

If they were as fearful as some hear, a beater. Since they're not, they only need one bass.
:cool:

Anyone ever knocked over your base at a practice? You will notice that some people unplug their instrument when it's sitting in the stand, I can tell you why.
This is why I don't take a high dollar Bass's everywhere.
This is just my opinion, to each his own. You can row you boat with your bass, just take some pictures for the rest of us.:D

No, no one has ever knocked my bass over at practice. For them to do that, they'd have to be within the safe space I've designated should I see fit to put it on a stand. More than likely it's going to either be on my strap or in my gigbag. Problem averted. Thanks, anticipation.:D

This is basically the same approach I take when driving. Assume you're on the road with some of biggest dummies ever... then drive accordingly. You'll be surprised at how much less often you get surprised if you take that mindset.
 
Hmm... Good points, but I think this is really going to have to be an "agree to disagree" sort of thing - I believe that my high-end basses are meant to be played, too, but I also want to keep them nice so that I can enjoy them for many years to come.

I've found it extremely easy to keep all of my gear in at least as good a condition as when I acquired it. I don't consider anything I do in that regard special, it seems like common sense to me. I have high end basses I've had for more than 25 years that are in great shape... and not because I left them home.

In my humble opinion, the simple fact is that there are a lot of factors you can't control when you're taking these instruments out. The obvious counterargument is that you can't anticipate what "might" happen at home, but after having a bass killed in a bar fight I'd just as soon not tempt fate.

There are far more factors you can control. And yes, you can anticipate what will happen. Unless you're doing Blues Brothers chicken wire gigs of course. I still play in bars occassionally but I don't play in dives. It's a choice.

(I was at the bar, my Fender Jazz was in it's case, and the ******* bouncer ended up stepping on it to stop the fight - big guy, broke the neck at the heel.)

Where was your case that someone could step on it? Just curious. For someone to step on something of mine in a case, they would typically have to be walking on a wall. Because that's typically where I'd set it.

At any rate, I enjoy the **** out of my Dingwall and JC Bass, and my Alembic when I had it, etc, at home.

Cool... I prefer to enjoy mine in the mix, with other musicians. For me, that's really what they're made for.

I do an open mic every Monday in DC. Among other things there can be some pretty animated rappers but at no point has someone even come close to doing anything to any of my basses. I take any of my Brubakers, my Fodera, Ambush, F bass, Elricks, vintage Fender, whatever I feel like taking because bottom line, that's why I bought them... to play.

Maybe I'm overdue:smug:

IME, there are three factors here:

1. No one's going to notice how much better you sound with your 5 figure bass than with my 3 figure bass, with very few exceptions. Obviously I'm not talking about recording studio time or high-class gigs, but in a bar full of 20-somethings, odds are one or two people will comment on your tone. Odds are pretty even that more people will come up to you and tell you how "cool" it looks.

That's a basic difference between me and many bassists... "I" care how much better I sound and I consider what you're saying, no offense to be kind of a copout. One you're entitled to but it's really saying that since no one knows any better, work to that level. I would like to kill every single time I hit the stage and that's what I shoot for.

2. No one wants to steal a cheapo. It's not a universal rule, but I haven't caught any envious glances from people who are loading in and out at the same time as me when I'm sporting the SX. In the hustle and bustle, I spend more time making sure my gear is safe than helping my band, and that doesn't make anyone happy.

Given a chance, people will steal anything. The obvious problem is that many musicians give those potential thieves a chance. I don't. If I have an instrument visible in my car, I'm either in the car or standing next to it. If I have to leave the area, so does the instrument. Is that a pain in the butt? Sure, sometimes it is... but far from as big a one as having an instrument stolen. get in the habit and it becomes no big deal. people ask me why I walk into a store or restaurant with a couple of gigbags over my shoulder... it's because I want potential thieves to at least say hi when they decide to take my stuff. So far, so good:cool:

3. If something does happen (and something will, eventually, to everyone) then I'd rather spend a few weeks modding another cheapo to the point where I'm satisfied with it's sound, playability, and looks than drop another $1K+ to repair a bass, much less buy a new one.

Again, 30+ years of gigging, never had anything anywhere near what you spent on repairs. A preamp might eventually fail, I think I broke a string back in the 80's, other than that, nada.

Therefore, please don't assume I don't play my basses, or enjoy playing them, or suggest that I'm doing them a disservice by keeping them safe. This is no different, IMO, than wearing the right clothes for the right event. If you're cool with wearing a business suit to a bar gig, then by all means do so, but don't assume that I don't appreciate business suits because I'm wearing jeans.

I didn't get the impression that people thought you didn't enjoy playing them, more that you're worried about them so you leave them home.

Obviously, do what you want to do, it's your stuff. It's obvious that many people like myself don't worry to the point that we can't enjoy our gear anywhere we play.

I understand that there are more points of view on this than just mine, but IMO practicality is just as important as anything else - I bought my SWR gear over Bergantino because of the same 3 reasons above. It's just not practical to me to drive a Ferrari to work everyday. The only reason I can see for doing it, since I can enjoy it just as much on sunny days, is that I want everyone to see that I can drive a Ferrari to work every day.

And you seem to miss the obvious reason... because it's FUN. That's why I drive what I drive vs. making them garage queens. I could easily enjoy a Ferrari in the rain. There are people who love to take people to their garage and show them how clean their car is. Then there are people who love to DRIVE.

I can see a parallel between this and music.
:D

As always, though, my $.02 is just that.

Same here.
:)
 
I've been gigging for over thirty years and have never fallen with a bass. Think that's a result of pure luck or something else? I vote something else.

Don't take this the wrong way... a lot of what people consider accidents IMO aren't. Like a bass "accidentally" falling when it's leaning against your amp. That's not an accident. Or running over it with your car. Or not paying attention to what you're doing. IMO "accident" is the easy way out. I prefer another "a" word... anticipate.



You saved yourself from the enjoyment of playing that instrument. And yes, life is short;)



If they were as fearful as some hear, a beater. Since they're not, they only need one bass.
:cool:


Man! If I could only be as perfect as you, I could be just as arrogant!! Where is the God smiley? I would post it for ya. I'm done with this one.
 
I've owned a few "boutiques" (Ken Smith, Alembic, STR) over my short playing career, and I've also owned a number of mass-produced basses (EBMM, Yamaha, Fender) as well. I played almost all of them on bar gigs and at college jazz concerts. I've never let the price of a bass influence my decision of what bass to take out to a gig. I bought all of my instruments to play them, and if I'd be afraid to take a bass out to a particular club, I'd rather not be there to begin with. I've never had anything bad happen to any of my instruments at a gig because, as Brad suggested, I've tried to anticipate any issues that might arise, and I've acted to mitigate the risk they might cause.

As for the original debate, I own a $350 Fender, a $450 Daion, and a $3500 STR 6-string. They're all quality instruments, but I've found that boutique instruments offer something to me, both as an aesthete and a player, that I haven't been able to find in instruments that I've pulled off the rack at music stores. I'll elaborate as to why in the morning.
 
+10000000000

I wouldn't buy an expensive car and rarely drive it nor would I buy an expensive bass and not play it on gigs regardless of what the gig was paying. This is just my opinion but I don't let my possessions possess me.

++++11111 BUTTTTT, flying with an expensive bass is another story unless there was some guarantee I could take it onboard with me. With the way the airlines are trippin' now...:ninja:
 
+1. I have two different criteria for tone, though, and I'm willing to sacrifice my tone for the peace of mind.



...and my renter's insurance covers theft in the house, but not at a bar.

I agree with the sentiment, but I disagree with the thought that I can't enjoy my bass when and where I want - or that I enjoy it less because I play it less.

It's all well and good to say that you choose to not worry about what could happen. I'm just saying that I evidently can't choose to not worry - I'm not in a position where I can replace instruments, and I'd much rather err on the side of caution. It's quite simple for me - take it out and worry, or don't and enjoy myself - and probably sound better as a result. My choice is to leave it at home.

EDIT: Also, for the record, my expensive basses stay in their cases when not in use, as opposed to hanging on the wall with all my cheapies. Is that just good sense, or am I worrying too much there, too?

+100000 I think alot of this depends on where you are in life. I've been playing bass for about 24 years (I am a recovering guitard). For about the first 10 years of playing bass I played the equipment that I could afford ( Aria Pro basses and Peavey Amps). If something had happened to them at the time I didn't have the money to do anything about it ( I usually wound up borrowing friends basses).

Then in '93 my financial situation changed and I was able to afford the basses I had always dreamed of and I indulged myself ( my wife would say I went hog wild). If something happened to one of my "boutique" basses it would definitely suck but now I am able to easily replace it whereas the first 10 years of my playing I would have been up a creek (and back before computer milled basses were common in the 80's you couldn't get anything worth a crap for under $500)

I still have the Aria Pro's that I started out on and still take them to gigs but since I am in a better position to take the hit if something were to happen to my high end basses I am able to take them out and play them without worrying too much (well most of the time anyway):)
 
++++11111 BUTTTTT, flying with an expensive bass is another story unless there was some guarantee I could take it onboard with me. With the way the airlines are trippin' now...:ninja:

I flown (pre and post 9/11) domestically and overseas with basses both carry on and check in. I've checked in a Larrivee' acoustic bass to fly to South America (the bass was fine but the case took a beating). Most overheads are 36" but if you have the bass in a soft gig bag usually they will put it up front in the aircraft but you will want to know the policy ahead of time or you could have to check your bass in and I would not recommend doing that in a gig bag