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why are Foderas so expensive?

#221
stringsmith said:
You guys can argue this until you are blue in the face! There is NO explanation for the prices of Fodera basses. We all agree that they are excellent instruments. But what makes them twice the price of other master luthiers. Are they growing special trees with magical wood? Are they using special electronics made on another planet? Is Vinny really that much better than Tobias, Sadowski, Benevente, Skjold, Roscoe, Alembic, etc, etc, ad nauseum. Come on guys. Fodera is The Nike of Basses and Vic Wooten is Michael Jordan and Matt Garrison is Labron James and Anthony Jackson is Dr. J. When you have all of the bass god superstars you can overprice your product. If your rich enough to own one, great! just admit you have one because you can afford it, not because it is somehow better than every other custom bass.
Click to expand...

It's amazing how much ___ you crammed into such a relatively small space. No offense of course;)

I agree, there's no way someone who thinks as you apparently do will get this. There is most definitely an explanation, you just refuse to get it or don't understand consumers, the market, supply and demand, business costs and who knows what else.
:)

Is Vinnie really that much better than the people you mentioned? Think about that. No, really think about it... to the people who have a far greater preference for what he's doing over the others, what do you really think? No? Then you were right.

Fodera does not have all of the superstars of bass. That's just plain ridiculous... or should be to anyone who gets out and/or knows who's out there.

Simple question: Do you have to be rich to own a used Kia?

If your answer is "yes", I see where you're coming from. If it's "no"... thanks for the show.
:D
 
#222
quadrogong said:
so, what's the deal..? does it get much better than this? my sadowsky and FBB both are flawless to me,(after a good setup) and another thing..90% of "perfect" is SET-UP!
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For you, no. For me, heck yeah. Several other brands in fact.

good bass+ bad setup= crap
bad bass + good setup= decent
so, therefore, my equation holds water....si? or no?
Click to expand...

Sure... like a mosquito net.

And yes, i'll agree this thread is getting silly, but I do really want to know..seriously,
can it really get much better than this? excluding fancy inlays,woods,decorative stuff..
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"excluding"? That may be my favorite tactic.

"Excluding styling and performance, is a Corvette really worth more than a Cobalt?
:hyper:
 
#226
Brad Johnson said:
Could you get a better Fodera cheaper? Probably not.
;)
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Yes one can, it's called an Rbass :D

Call Ray Rodgers a copy cat, cheat or whatever. All I know is that due to low overhead and a questionable business reputation, we can all afford a Fodera clone. Because of his Carl Thompson and Fodera stints, it is a fact that his basses are of very high quality. Some even say that they are at least as good if not better than Fodera. This has proven to be a very subjective and touchy subject here in the past; all I know is that I love mine and no longer want for a Fodera.
 
#227
fullrangebass said:
I own 3 Fodera's. They have a big sound, and they are quality instruments. But IMHO in terms of value for money, they score lower than some of my other high end instruments (for me and me only).
Click to expand...
Assuming that you played one/all of these Foderas before puchasing, it must have had/has enough redeeming qualities that compelled you to purchase it...is it (are they) daily players or still "gig worthy"?

Just askin'.
 
#228
KenToby said:
Yes one can, it's called an Rbass :D

Call Ray Rodgers a copy cat, cheat or whatever. All I know is that due to low overhead and a questionable business reputation, we can all afford a Fodera clone. Because of his Carl Thompson and Fodera stints, it is a fact that his basses are of very high quality. Some even say that they are at least as good if not better than Fodera. This has proven to be a very subjective and touchy subject here in the past; all I know is that I love mine and no longer want for a Fodera.
Click to expand...

It's not touchy for me:D

It's not a Fodera. There's a really simple test for this: try to sell it and see what you can get;)

I repeat... you can't get a better Fodera cheaper.
 
#230
KenToby said:
Sorry, I don't see the need to spend the extra $4000 for a butterfly inlay to feed my ego.
Click to expand...

Did someone infer that you did?:D

Does this stuff ever stop? BTW I spent $2500 on mine... and it's a beaut.
:bassist:
AJFodbody.jpg



I made a very simple statement. "You" decided to respond to it. You don't have a cheap Fodera, you have an R Bass. OTOH I have a cheap Fodera.

Try my test and see what offers you get. Without the butterfly.
:hiding:
 
#231
Brad Johnson said:
Did someone infer that you did?:D

Does this stuff ever stop? BTW I spent $2500 on mine... and it's a beaut.
:bassist:
AJFodbody.jpg



I made a very simple statement. "You" decided to respond to it. You don't have a cheap Fodera, you have an R Bass. OTOH I have a cheap Fodera.

Try my test and see what offers you get. Without the butterfly.
:hiding:
Click to expand...

What kind of test is that??? Try to sell my Rbass for $4500 and see what I get??? I don't get it, that "test" doesn't discount the fact that Ray builds his basses with knowledge he gained from Vinny and Joey and Carl Thompson and is now making a comparable instrument to Fodera for $4000+ less.

You and I both know the definition of someone who chooses to buy the same item elsewere for $4000 more. Those of us who own Fodera's, oh, I mean Rbasses are laughing all the way to the bank.

Like Joey told Mike Lull, "...yea, it's expensive to drive a Farrari in NY City". (Ask Mike for the exact quote)

Value has nothing to do with it, the Fodera guys are great luthiers but even better marketers!! I hope they pump the market for all they can get, after all - this is America!!

Long live Fodera!!
 
#232
KenToby said:
What kind of test is that??? Try to sell my Rbass for $4500 and see what I get??? I don't get it, that "test" doesn't discount the fact that Ray builds his basses with knowledge he gained from Vinny and Joey and Carl Thompson and is now making a comparable instrument to Fodera for $4000+ less.
Click to expand...

The test is a very simple one. Foderas, actual Foderas have a value. If your bass doesn't have that value... it's not a Fodera. No matter how much you like it.

Do you follow that? That's not a slam on your bass, it just is what it is. As far as "comparable", I'd hope you know how personal that is. And irrelevant.

You and I both know the definition of someone who chooses to buy the same item elsewere for $4000 more.
Click to expand...

Which has nothing to do with this situation. Again, no matter how much you like your R Bass nor how much it looks like a Fodera, it is not the SAME THING. So you're going to need a better definition;)

Those of us who own Fodera's, oh, I mean Rbasses are laughing all the way to the bank.
Click to expand...

Not as hard as I'm laughing, having spent less than an R Bass goes for for a bass that's worth about double what I paid. At least we're both laughing:D


Like Joey told Mike Lull, "...yea, it's expensive to drive a Farrari in NY City". (Ask Mike for the exact quote)
Click to expand...

I love it when they whip that one out.
:D

Value has nothing to do with it, the Fodera guys are great luthiers but even better marketers!! I hope they pump the market for all they can get, after all - this is America!!

Long live Fodera!!
Click to expand...

You're right, value has nothing to do with Fodera and by extension nothing to do with any bass.

Long live R Bass. Still not a Fodera.
:hyper:
 
#233
KenToby said:
What kind of test is that??? Try to sell my Rbass for $4500 and see what I get??? I don't get it, that "test" doesn't discount the fact that Ray builds his basses with knowledge he gained from Vinny and Joey and Carl Thompson and is now making a comparable instrument to Fodera for $4000+ less.

You and I both know the definition of someone who chooses to buy the same item elsewere for $4000 more. Those of us who own Fodera's, oh, I mean Rbasses are laughing all the way to the bank.

Like Joey told Mike Lull, "...yea, it's expensive to drive a Farrari in NY City". (Ask Mike for the exact quote)

Value has nothing to do with it, the Fodera guys are great luthiers but even better marketers!! I hope they pump the market for all they can get, after all - this is America!!

Long live Fodera!!
Click to expand...


Thinking...this post just may be the best gem so far.

I'm sure alot of other players would think their mid- priced basses better than yours, or any RBass. For them, hmmm.... wouldent that make your RBass a pretty ****** deal and a blown -out over- hyped overpriced calamity based on some "thin" marketing that he did some time in more proven and experienced luthier shops?

The only way you'd be laughing all the way to the bank is if you actually did sell your self- described "discounted" Fodera/RBass for the same price as a Fodera in the marketplace. Otherwise, you have nothing but an RBass and the price you payed for it and whatever you can sell it for.

Which is not the same as what a Fodera costs and what you can sell THOSE for ( I'm not saying that any player should like Fodera over RBass either).

Dare say, there "may" even be a whole gaggle of Fodera owners and non- owners who are laughing at you for thinking you scored a Fodera for $2000...but you really ended up with an RBass . No slight on Ray's work...putting his well known reputation aside.

Just a thought that will undoubtedly not be understood;
Not a good idea to use someone else's name in spreading your dirt either.....maybe Mike would not have appreciated that on the internet.
 
#234
basses55 said:
Thinking...this post just may be the best gem so far.

I'm sure alot of other players would think their mid- priced basses better than yours, or any RBass. For them, hmmm.... wouldent that make your RBass a pretty ****** deal and a blown -out over- hyped overpriced calamity based on some "thin" marketing that he did some time in more proven and experienced luthier shops?

The only way you'd be laughing all the way to the bank is if you actually did sell your self- described "discounted" Fodera/RBass for the same price as a Fodera in the marketplace. Otherwise, you have nothing but an RBass and the price you payed for it and whatever you can sell it for.

Which is not the same as what a Fodera costs and what you can sell THOSE for ( I'm not saying that any player should like Fodera over RBass either).

Dare say, there "may" even be a whole gaggle of Fodera owners and non- owners who are laughing at you for thinking you scored a Fodera for $2000...but you really ended up with an RBass . No slight on Ray's work...putting his well known reputation aside.

Just a thought that will undoubtedly not be understood;
Not a good idea to use someone else's name in spreading your dirt either.....maybe Mike would not have appreciated that on the internet.
Click to expand...

+1

It would appear that non-Fodera owners have egos too. Imagine that.:eek:

:D
 
#235
Personally, I don't think Fodera's are worth the extra $. Others, feel differently...and to them, the money's well spent. But what I do know for a fact is that someone like say, Victor, is going to sound just as good as he does on a Fodera, on just about anything he lays his hands on.
 
#236
hansC said:
Personally, I don't think Fodera's are worth the extra $. Others, feel differently...and to them, the money's well spent. But what I do know for a fact is that someone like say, Victor, is going to sound just as good as he does on a Fodera, on just about anything he lays his hands on.
Click to expand...

Maybe... and maybe he just really likes his Fodera.

It happens. I know I have much more fun playing on instruments I really like.
 
#237
Not a good idea to use someone else's name in spreading your dirt either.....maybe Mike would not have appreciated that on the internet.[/QUOTE]


Why is my opinion "dirt" and yours valid??

This is an opinion forum. If you can get to the root of what I am saying, I think you'll unserstand that I'm more right than you give me credit for.

Mike didn't offer nor did I draw any concrete conclusions from Joey's statement. Mike was illustrating that for whatever reason, Vinny and Joey's products commanded their prices and in turn they were doing well for it. I agreed. Mike didn't say that the Fodera folks were in any way unfairly competeing. He didn't bad mouth the Fodera folks in any way. I imagine there may be some admiration there.

Again, for Ray, a past apprentice using Fodera and Carl Thompson techniques and lessons learned to build a comparable bass at 1/4 to 1/3 the price, this tells me that there is a significant Fodera profit margin. Yea, I understand the NYC rents are high and there are employees but at $6K - $9K a pop...
There's nothing wrong with that, matter of fact I applaud it, but I think its a huge mistake to beleive the $4000 gap between a Fodera and an Rbass (outstanding Fodera clone) makes the Fodera superior in any real way. Marketing, name recognition, reputation are the major keys the their success from what I have experienced with both basses - nothng more.

Long live capitalism and Fodera!!
 

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