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Why are the Ampeg Portaflex amps so cheap?
- Thread starter Jay Mastro
- Start date
Had a 350 for 2 years. Awesome amp, totally reliable. Got dropped and rained on at a music fest when a flash flood hit. Never an issue. Upgraded to the 500 and I love it. I've done at least 25 gigs with it since October. No issues whatsoever.
Fat Steve
The poodle bites, the poodle chews it.
My opinion: The PF series is as affordable as the Rumble series by Fender. I purchased a Rumble 500 V3 as a backup to my all tube Fender 100T. $329 spent used to have a backup to my main amp. The point is that these amps serve a purpose in providing class D economical amplifiers with many features at a great price. They sound great but realistically will not sound like a full tube head (I.M.H.O.).
Marc
Marc
^^^ This for me as well. Reliability and customer service are everything for me when it come to amps. Played lots of Ampeg stuff in the shops, but would never buy one. Way too many other choices with a better reliability/customer service reputation. Just my own experience and opinion as I know there's lots of happy 'peg players out there. Peace.
If I remember correctly MarkBass amps are no longer made in italy. Pf500's did initially have reliability issues but I'm pretty sure it has been fixed for a while now.
I think that part of the price drop might relate to an iron or steel body as opposed to the aluminum ones that the gk's have. Economies of scale and manufacturing location could help, but the pf amps are heavier than their other counterparts, I think the use of steel for a case/cabinet might be part of why -it weighs more, but to my knowledge it's cheaper, correct me if I'm wrong.
How about as an affordable backup to a shuttle 6.2?
Or is that sacrilege?
Had ampeg for years, then GB, 6.2 is the only thing I have now.
Or is that sacrilege?
Had ampeg for years, then GB, 6.2 is the only thing I have now.
How is Markbass's customer service? I still plan on going with the Little Mark III, and I appreciate everybody taking the time to shed some light on the subject.
Also, if you wondering what cab I will be using it is a Carvin BR410-8.
Also, if you wondering what cab I will be using it is a Carvin BR410-8.
No Oops needed. I purchased this class D " made wherever" Rumble 500 V3 as a backup amp too my all tuber (irony: made in Mexico...ha,ha). It is what it is my friend(s)..... Marc
okcrum
in your chest
If you pay less than a dollar a watt (new) for a micro head (Ampeg, GK, Kustom, Fender Rumble or others) you're buying a toaster. An appliance. A disposable piece of kit, in effect. Markbass has always seemed like an overpriced toaster to me, but lots of people like them, except for those who have had to get repairs. Main circuit boards are pricey.
The GK micros were bashed when they came out because of the teething problems. Then there were the noisy MB-200s. So were the PFs. ISTR the PF revs with issues were a couple of years ago now, but people still like to hate their manufacturer of choice.
Pay more than a dollar a watt (Genz Benz, Aguilar, Warwick, etc.) and you are in another realm of design, support, and engineering.
YMMV, as the "dollar a watt" is a fuzzy kind of rule. There are always exceptions like expensive crappy gear (usually won't last long unless it gets a cult) or completely great inexpensive gear.
Most importantly, try amps yourself if you can. Gather opinions from more sources than just TB - actual live owners in your area/scene, for example. A question like yours will generate probably 50/50 useful vs. information free or misleading or just plain inaccurate replies in a topic like this. TB is still the internet, after all. It does have a better than average track record, but it's still the 'net.
The GK micros were bashed when they came out because of the teething problems. Then there were the noisy MB-200s. So were the PFs. ISTR the PF revs with issues were a couple of years ago now, but people still like to hate their manufacturer of choice.
Pay more than a dollar a watt (Genz Benz, Aguilar, Warwick, etc.) and you are in another realm of design, support, and engineering.
YMMV, as the "dollar a watt" is a fuzzy kind of rule. There are always exceptions like expensive crappy gear (usually won't last long unless it gets a cult) or completely great inexpensive gear.
Most importantly, try amps yourself if you can. Gather opinions from more sources than just TB - actual live owners in your area/scene, for example. A question like yours will generate probably 50/50 useful vs. information free or misleading or just plain inaccurate replies in a topic like this. TB is still the internet, after all. It does have a better than average track record, but it's still the 'net.
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So in your personal opinion an Aguilar TH500 is worth every penny more than a Markbass Little Mark III?
okcrum
in your chest
Definitely, IMO. I've played through a couple (350 and 500, on gigs), and they're really nice. But I do not own one, so for lifetime issues, you'll want opinions from Tonehammer owners.
FWIW, my regular gigging amps are a pair of PF500s. They've served me well.
FWIW, my regular gigging amps are a pair of PF500s. They've served me well.
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Problems reported on here with the PF500 are much fewer over the past couple years. PF350 and PF800 have always been solid with very few reports of breakage. I also witnessed Ampeg CS stepping up and doing their best to take care of customers who had problems, including doing stuff like sending them out new amps before the old ones got sent back and upgrading their original purchases to something else when back-ordered. So hd, I don't see where you can call Ampeg's CS unresponsive, but I guess you can't please everybody who's trying to get their out-of-warranty stuff repaired for free 
And Markbass' stuff is made in Indonesia, and every manufacturer uses mostly Chinese parts regardless of where they're assembled, so I can't see cost of manufacture being grossly different for any of them.
And Markbass' stuff is made in Indonesia, and every manufacturer uses mostly Chinese parts regardless of where they're assembled, so I can't see cost of manufacture being grossly different for any of them.
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Congratulations on getting a good one. I've never had any problems demoing them. It's just the risk seemed to great to only have that head for shows.
I dont think anyone is claiming all the amps failed, are bunk, or are garbage. Far from it. There are numerous vocal and happy pf owners. Because yours is fine doesn't mean there aren't/weren't reliability issues. The thing that scared these people off (myself included) was the alarming rate of failures other tb'rs were having leaving some amp-less. It doesn't even have to be a majority of amps failing. All it takes is enough to feel like there's a mild chance that you might and up left out in the rain. This website can be the kiss of death to a line.
Like Jimmy said, the issues are becoming much less common. However, what people remember is the word of mouth issues, substantiated or not.
Besides markbass being import and Aguilar being hand made in New York it seems as though this reputation (earned or not) has damaged the used value of pf500's. This is especially unfortunate if the new stuff is great/of great quality.
okcrum
in your chest
One of the PF500s I own was returned to MF by a TBer (who shall remain anonymous) as not working. I've been gigging it for over three years now. So at least one of the claims of user error with that amp is true.
You're right about the hearsay, though. Especially the guys that had claimed 3-4 failed on them. I might have checked the rest of my rig after the 2nd, if it happened to me, Just saying.
Some of this has been well explained by agedhorse in other threads. There are cabs that can be virtually a short circuit at one or two frequencies, and while tube amps and lead sleds don't mind these so much, they can cause havoc with some class D designs. Much of what you pay for with the premium class D brands (At least Genz and Aggie AFAIK) is the part of the design that surrounds the power amp. That doesn't come off the shelf like the power amp itself. Andy explains it better in the context of building a class D design, especially points 2 and 3:
EMI = electromagnetic interference
SMPS = switch mode power supply (switcher)
You're right about the hearsay, though. Especially the guys that had claimed 3-4 failed on them. I might have checked the rest of my rig after the 2nd, if it happened to me, Just saying.
Some of this has been well explained by agedhorse in other threads. There are cabs that can be virtually a short circuit at one or two frequencies, and while tube amps and lead sleds don't mind these so much, they can cause havoc with some class D designs. Much of what you pay for with the premium class D brands (At least Genz and Aggie AFAIK) is the part of the design that surrounds the power amp. That doesn't come off the shelf like the power amp itself. Andy explains it better in the context of building a class D design, especially points 2 and 3:
EMI = electromagnetic interference
SMPS = switch mode power supply (switcher)
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IMO, the Mark Bass stuff has always seemed way over priced. Ive played through several at local stores and yes they sound good but not better enough to justify the high price.
Back Story: When I was looking for a light weight powerful Class-D combo, I tried Ampeg, Fender, Acoustic, Mark and GK. I set all eq's to flat, used same bass and spent about 3-5 min with each. The GK and Mark to me clearly sounded better than the others, however the Mark was a lot more than the GK even though the sound quality was close.
For one thing, having tried the PF500 in the store as well, I can say, if you are expecting a "comparable" volume to a typical 500 watt amp thru the same cabinet, all things being equal, you will most likely be dis-appointed. The one I played, has maybe slightly more volume than my GK MB200. (Which is plenty loud to gig with 2 cabinets BTW)
So there is that. YMMV.
Having owned and gigged the Markbass LMIII as well, It was a decent head, but it cut out in the middle of songs due to a power supply issue. It would drop out completely for about 5 seconds of a song, and then be back on.
So there is that. YMMV.
Having owned and gigged the Markbass LMIII as well, It was a decent head, but it cut out in the middle of songs due to a power supply issue. It would drop out completely for about 5 seconds of a song, and then be back on.
