Why aren't there cheap(er) lollipop tuners?

[definenredefine]

Like the title says. The background is that I've taken on amateur bass building for charity over the last 18 or so months, and I would love tuners that aren't the generic clover or Y shapes. But...I don't wanna spend $25 each or more than $100 per set on basses I plan to give away.

While we're at it, why are there so few shapes for bass tuners in the first place? It's pretty much just the 2 common shapes and (less commonly) lollipops. But if you look at vintage import basses, there's a few different shapes at least! Like the heart-shaped tuners on old Ibanezes are lovely...why aren't those a thing anymore?

 

[ardgedee]

The simple answer would be economies of scale: Lollipop tuners are more expensive because they're not popular, so they're made in smaller batches.

The more complicated (or at least more accurate) answer would have to involve investigating why lollipop tuners aren't popular, but my casual guess would be it's because most people don't pay attention to (or don't particularly care about) tuner shapes so if they want a vintage/classic style they expect cloverleafs and if they want a modern/compact style they expect Y-shaped; everything else is off-menu.

 

[definenredefine]

The simple answer would be economies of scale: Lollipop tuners are more expensive because they're not popular, so they're made in smaller batches.

The more complicated (or at least more accurate) answer would have to involve investigating why lollipop tuners aren't popular, but my casual guess would be it's because most people don't pay attention to (or don't particularly care about) tuner shapes so if they want a vintage/classic style they expect cloverleafs and if they want a modern/compact style they expect Y-shaped; everything else is off-menu.

Yeah that all makes sense. I suppose my initial post was born more of frustration than anything else, so the rationality inherent to economies-of-scale etc was lost on me.

It is kinda odd to me that major manufacturers who also make budget lines don't have different tuner shapes that may suit some of their offerings better. For example, a Squier Mustang would probably look pretty great with lollipops. Ditto an Ibanez TMB.

Also there seems to be a lot more variety of shapes in budget guitar tuners, but that's probably due (at least in part) to how many more people play guitar rather than bass (that whole economies-of-scale thing again, dagnabbit.)

 

[ardgedee]

It is kinda odd to me that major manufacturers who also make budget lines don't have different tuner shapes that may suit some of their offerings better. For example, a Squier Mustang would probably look pretty great with lollipops. Ditto an Ibanez TMB.

I agree it's at least a little surprising that "vintage" bass tuner shapes have become samey since they're stamped metal, so hypothetically it should be the easiest tuner of all to make in any possible shape. But profit lies in the margins so if they can make US$0.003 more per tuner by not offering a variety, I guess that's how they're going to go since apparently customers aren't demanding a variety.

Contrast this with guitar buttons which are made of cast metal or molded plastic... I dunno.

 

[Yahboy]

Like the title says. The background is that I've taken on amateur bass building for charity over the last 18 or so months, and I would love tuners that aren't the generic clover or Y shapes. But...I don't wanna spend $25 each or more than $100 per set on basses I plan to give away.

While we're at it, why are there so few shapes for bass tuners in the first place? It's pretty much just the 2 common shapes and (less commonly) lollipops. But if you look at vintage import basses, there's a few different shapes at least! Like the heart-shaped tuners on old Ibanezes are lovely...why aren't those a thing anymore?

Suggest chat and share your idea to AliExpress guyker .

 

[J-Bass RMR]

Around '66 - when the "paddle" tuners appeared, Fender was now manufacturing their tuners "in house"
Those Fender branded "paddle" tuners appeared for only a relatively short period of time: 1966-1969
Mostly limited to the Jazz & Mustang Basses (but always exceptions with Fenders)
The paddles tuners were more expensive to produce since the paddles were Chrome - consistent with the "higher-end" Jazz, and made in smaller production numbers.
The "clover leaf" tuners were also produced in house - now bearing the Fender Logo - and in far greater numbers, since the P-bass significantly outsold both the Jazz & Mustang at the time.

So while there have been many re-issues paddle tuners since; likely those same ratios and scale of production apply to after-market manufactures.

 

[Kmrumedy]

I really wish Fender custom shop would sell these relic versions for those of us with original 66's with broken or missing tuners.

My 66...seller sold the tuners separately and buyer won't sell them back to me. (Currently has 79-81 clover tuners)

 

[Dirk Diggler]

Well if you got setup with Hipshot you could get them as cost.

Here's the cheapest lolypop style at around $23 retail a piece.
Licensed Ultralite® Bass Tuning Machine 3/8" (Sold Individually)
These are the licensed/import ultralights.

 

[lark_z]

Off topic a bit....

Who are you donating them to? I need a winter project each year and I do not need any more basses, but I really enjoy refurb'ing them. I don't want to hassle with selling them

 

[bassdude51]

I really wish Fender custom shop would sell these relic versions for those of us with original 66's with broken or missing tuners.

My 66...seller sold the tuners separately and buyer won't sell them back to me. (Currently has 79-81 clover tuners)

1966 was a strange year for the Jazz Bass. There were at least 3 different versions that were made.. Dots. Rectangles with edging. Pre-CBS Kluson tuners. Lollipops. And please don't quote me!........the standard in house made clover leaf tuners.

I hope that you can find some replacement "lollipops" for your J! Probably will cost a "pretty penny"!

 

[Bass4ThePublic]

$25 a tuner is cheap lol. Respectfully, YOU might be the cheap one

 

[jimmydean]

If you want it , you must pay the price .

 

[dfp]

Know where to look…

Gotoh Lollipop TUNERS from Fender Ltd. Foil Jazz Bass Tuning Pegs $10 OFF | eBay

Description: 6 Gotoh Lollipop Key Tuners from the Fender Ltd. Foil Jazz Bass (Tuning Pegs)- Vintage Style- Condition near Mint (Please note that ferrules are not included-$10 Off) Type: Tuners- Country/Make: Mexico .

www.ebay.com

EDIT: to be fair, these don’t come up for sale often. Better hurry bc another set may be a while.

 

[tpaul]

Ideas for other tuner shapes:



I think top hat tuners would work well on telecasters, and Strat players might like the ones shaped like a gold record. And maybe some tighty-whitey tuners for Les Pauls. Clenched fist for Precision Bass and of course, Jazz Bass gets the wine glass.

 

[JIO]

Know where to look…

Gotoh Lollipop TUNERS from Fender Ltd. Foil Jazz Bass Tuning Pegs $10 OFF | eBay

Description: 6 Gotoh Lollipop Key Tuners from the Fender Ltd. Foil Jazz Bass (Tuning Pegs)- Vintage Style- Condition near Mint (Please note that ferrules are not included-$10 Off) Type: Tuners- Country/Make: Mexico .

www.ebay.com

EDIT: to be fair, these don’t come up for sale often. Better hurry bc another set may be a while.

Gotoh makes the most accurate replica lollypop tuners - just missing "Fender" stamp. That's a confusing Stratosphere post - copy says "6" tuners (ala guitar) and only one odd-angle pic... great price though. Ferrules can be bought separately for around $10 a set of 4. Just make sure they are the correct diameter for the big 1/2" posts.

 

[JIO]

Ideas for other tuner shapes:



I think top hat tuners would work well on telecasters, and Strat players might like the ones shaped like a gold record. And maybe some tighty-whitey tuners for Les Pauls. Clenched fist for Precision Bass and of course, Jazz Bass gets the wine glass.

 

[dfp]

Stratosphere has outstanding customer service, I wouldn’t hesitate to order the tuners on the chance that both the photo and title are correct and they just got one thing wrong in the description. Gotoh doesn't to my knowledge make guitar lollipop tuners, only bass lollipop. Also, photo matches description (no ferrules).

 

[Pilgrim]

How about buying good used sets? Tuners last nearly forever IME.

 

[waveman]

Guyker - @ $27 on Amazon. Kaish - about $35. There are some sets even cheaper.

 

[definenredefine]

Around '66 - when the "paddle" tuners appeared, Fender was now manufacturing their tuners "in house"
Those Fender branded "paddle" tuners appeared for only a relatively short period of time: 1966-1969
Mostly limited to the Jazz & Mustang Basses (but always exceptions with Fenders)
The paddles tuners were more expensive to produce since the paddles were Chrome - consistent with the "higher-end" Jazz, and made in smaller production numbers.
The "clover leaf" tuners were also produced in house - now bearing the Fender Logo - and in far greater numbers, since the P-bass significantly outsold both the Jazz & Mustang at the time.

So while there have been many re-issues paddle tuners since; likely those same ratios and scale of production apply to after-market manufactures.

This is probably gonna sound sarcastic but I assure you I'm being sincere- thanks for the history lesson!

Off topic a bit....

Who are you donating them to? I need a winter project each year and I do not need any more basses, but I really enjoy refurb'ing them. I don't want to hassle with selling them

Play it Forward Wilmington.
FB - Play It Forward Wilmington
Insta - https://www.instagram.com/playitforward_wilmington/

The owner is a good friend/bandmate. I've donated 6 basses (I think) and 3 guitars to him. I gotta tell ya, though, that only 2 basses were given out last year, so he told me he'd prefer to have guitars donated...

$25 a tuner is cheap lol. Respectfully, YOU might be the cheap one

Oh I definitely am. As I said in the OP, though - "I don't wanna spend $25 each or more than $100 per set on basses I plan to give away."

View attachment 7455404

I love those! I have a set (poached from a '79 Ibanez) on my jazz bass. See here - https://www.talkbass.com/threads/d-rs-build-thread.1591463/page-8#post-29227373

How about buying good used sets? Tuners last nearly forever IME.

I am definitely good with buying used, but I haven't found any...

Guyker - @ $27 on Amazon. Kaish - about $35. There are some sets even cheaper.

I haven't found any that from either of those brands, but I'll take another look. To be fair, I don't really look at amazon much these days, so that may be why I haven't found them...