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Why don't pole pieces line up with strings?

#21
back when Fender 'invented' his basses the typical string spacing was 20mm. Since most of the pickup companies have designed their J pups to be a replacement for the Fender ones they still have a 20mm strings spacing. Pretty much every builder now a days have settle for a 19mm string spacing on their basses (predominately for 4 strings basses) with few exceptions.
that's the reason of this 'misalignement'.

M
 
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#22
mmbongo said:
Acutally that picture shows that Sadowsky's are 'misaligned' exactly like that Lakland you said had QC issues. The point is, it's normal even on $4000 basses.
Click to expand...
This pic shows perfect alignment.
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maurilio said:
back when Fender 'invented' his basses the typical string spacing was 20mm. Since most of the pickup companies have designed their J pups to be a replacement for the Fender ones they still have a 20mm strings spacing. Pretty much every builder now a days have settle for a 19mm string spacing on their basses (predominately for 4 strings basses) with few exceptions.
that's the reason of this 'misalignement'.

M
Click to expand...
Thank you. This makes the most sense of all the replies so far, but I still wonder why you see misalignment on Fender basses.
 
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#23
0190085800_frt_wlg_001.jpg
 
#25
uh, that's just because you haven't cut the notches in the bridge right (if at all); the whole idea of these bridges is to notch them so that they do line up perfectly.

this is actually a pet peeve of mine, too; it doesn't make a big difference, but it does make a difference, especially if you like your pickups a little closer and you hit it harder like i do. you get a little smoothing of the attack when they're right between the magnets, just like leo's patent suggests:

the original fenders had grooved saddles that let you get it totally right, and in the bargain pressed the outer saddles against the inner ones, holding everything together (i've posted this rant a few times, but what the hell):

fender_jazz_bass_04.jpg


it wasn't until the '70s that fender went to the single-groove saddles, and too-narrow ones at that (note the nice gap between the G and D saddles, allowing them all to slide around):

fenderpickups.jpg


that sadowsky bridge is indeed just right for jazz pickups, and all too many are just not.
 
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#26
Walt, thank you for editing and clarifying that. I haven't put grooves in the saddles because I didn't want to put extra stress on a string bend. But, I suppose they bend at the saddles anyway. Perhaps I'll take care of that.
 
#27
deeptubes said:
Walt, thank you for editing and clarifying that. I haven't put grooves in the saddles because I didn't want to put extra stress on a string bend. But, I suppose they bend at the saddles anyway. Perhaps I'll take care of that.
Click to expand...

You will put more stress on the string without the groove cut. As it is now it's bending over that sharp edge at the back of the saddle, and then resting ion the flat top surface.

With a properly cut groove, the back of the string travels up the groove and then has it's witness point right at the front edge of the saddle. The rest of the string shouldn't really be touching anything.
 
#28
The original Precision bass did in fact have just one magnet pole underneath each string. IME that design does like to have the string aligned as close over the center as possible. (It also seems very sensitive to string / pickup height adjustments.)

It is my understanding that Leo Fender changed to a design with the string between 2 poles in 1957 to help reduce the transient spike when a note was sounded. Apparently the speaker cones of the day weren't holding up very well with the sharper attack. (He eventually went back to poles directly under the strings with his Music Man and G&L designs.)

I seem to be partial the original design and my modern woofers can certainly take it! :bassist:

I like one pole per string so much, I had this set made for my P-bass:

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That's an Aero Type 4A - that pole layout is not very common in that style housing. (But it certainly is doable - Delano also offers it.) I am very satisfied with the results, so much so that I think I am going to do a similar thing with a J-bass.

Bill Lawrence combines the two approaches - has one pole directly underneath each string and one between (when used with 4 strings). His pickups are pretty affordable and I like his J model a lot (one reason I haven't gone with the much more expensive Aeros just yet...)

HTH
 
#29
matante said:
This pic shows perfect alignment.
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Thank you. This makes the most sense of all the replies so far, but I still wonder why you see misalignment on Fender basses.
Click to expand...

That's because Roger uses (used to have. Not sure which one is standard now a day) a 20mm string spacing (with 19mm as option).

In my (long) experience, I have never heard any difference between 19 and 20 (aligned/misaligned).
But that's me

M
 
#32
To Jeffenator and INTP, Please read the thread. Your posts have nothing to do with the topic of discussion. I blame myself for not expressing my question correctly in the title.

This thread is about strings not running perfectly centered between the pole pieces on basses with two poles per string.
 
#33
Blue_Whistle88 said:
Design flaws that have no functional impact and little to no aesthetic impact are alnos never addressed. It's as simple as that.
Click to expand...

I think there's a big aesthetic impact to having a design flaw on a $3k bass, or even an $800 one.

In any case I'm still curious as to why. Maurilio has given a good explanation with regards to 20mm vs 19mm spacing, but why does a Fender designed bass with Fender designed pickups not have proper string alignment over the pole pieces? Is it an inferior bridge as Walter suggests?
 
#36
5 and 6 strings etc are a totally different thing. Nothing is standard. Most common is 19mm and there you have pretty much the pups companies goes with that. At Nordstrand everything is 'by default' 19mm, but pretty much any string spacing can be customized.
Fender still use all their tools and why changing (see $) something that works? Fender misalignment is because they have change to the standard 19mm, too (4 strings).
 
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#37
Don't forget Leo Fender originally designed his pickups to be under the pickup covers.

Besides since the magnetic field on a properly set up bass is a contiguous strip where the strings past though the field and not discrete pools, functionally, aligning the strings precisely between the poles isn't necessary.
 
#38
maurilio said:
5 and 6 strings etc are a totally different thing. Nothing is standard. Most common is 19mm and there you have pretty much the pups companies goes with that. At Nordstrand everything is 'by default' 19mm, but pretty much any string spacing can be customized.
Fender still use all their tools and why changing (see $) something that works? Fender misalignment is because they have change to the standard 19mm, too (4 strings).
Click to expand...

Makes sense to me, as far as 4-strings go. This doesn't explain why their 5-strings are misaligned.

And Lakland? And others? What's their excuse?
 
#40
i'm kinda surprised more jazz pickup makers don't go to 19mm spacing for the polepieces instead of 20mm, based on how many bridges are at the narrower spec; the overall shape could be the same (so they fit he cavities), just with a slightly narrower magnet spacing.
 
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