I may need to use my XRF gun on a few sets of strings to see the chemical content. Could be interesting.
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*Why* is SS brighter than NPS?
- Thread starter LetItGrowTone
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I've made lots of tuned metal percussion instruments out of a variety of alloys. The alloying elements in stainless steels cause it to produce a lot of higher pitched tones/harmonics along with the fundamentals. This sounds brighter to the ear. Its not just strings!
- Sep 9, 2007
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- Endorsing Artist: Eventide, GHS Strings, G&L Guitars, NS Design, Tsunami Cables
Only if you can confirm that the exact construction of both is the same, save the final cover. Does Rotosound publish those types of specs?
Fascinating.
Are these higher pitched tones/harmonics often dissonant, or unrelated to the fundamental?
Strings are a recipe.
The metallurgy, the number of wraps and how many layers of wrap, hex core, round core, the tension they were wound at, and more, it all figures in, and each brand has its own proprietary tricks.
I can compare them by the basic yardstick of 'sounds right, feels right', but past that, it's a black art that I'm just not privy to or confident to address when you start splitting hairs about this or that alloy, and all the rest.
The metallurgy, the number of wraps and how many layers of wrap, hex core, round core, the tension they were wound at, and more, it all figures in, and each brand has its own proprietary tricks.
I can compare them by the basic yardstick of 'sounds right, feels right', but past that, it's a black art that I'm just not privy to or confident to address when you start splitting hairs about this or that alloy, and all the rest.
Chemistry of the metal as it reacts with the pickup magnet.
JeezyMcNuggles
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- Feb 23, 2018
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It's steel under nickel, that's why they rust.
Stainless is brighter than nickel because it's brighter than nickel. It most likely has to do with stainless being a very hard metal, and nickel is a soft metal over standard steel.
Pure nickel strings are very warm. Nickel is a soft metal. Soft metal, warm sound. Stainless is a very hard metal. Hard metal, bright sound. Right? Makes sense to me.
Thanks everyone.
It looks like the answer is both the presence of a softer metal in at least a thin layer, and the properties of the underlying metal.
-Stainless, forced to bend, generates inharmonic highs,
and if the points of contact are stainless on stainless (hard), a maximum of these highs are preserved to be heard.
-A less rigid steel generates less,
and if it is - probably by necessity - plated with nickel, then the softer points of contact dampen some of these.
-And if the outer winding is entirely ("pure" or close enough to it) nickel, then the least inharmonic highs are generated.
At least this corresponds to what I think I hear.
Yesterday I installed a set of Rotosound Swing Bass RS66LC strings on a P-Bass which has been refretted with stainless steel frets. These strings are stainless steel and the resulting tone is very bright, but in the lower range the low fundamentals are there, so it isn't just twangy highs. I wanted to try the Rotosounds again after a very long break, in my 20s I used the exact same strings exclusively for many years.
Yeah, I'm not saying stainless is bad, @Petethebassman, and I have set of those in that gauge that I haven't tried yet.
One other source of timbre is the interaction between the plucking thing the surface of the string. To me, it seems obvious that, sure, round wound strings are scratchier if you do a pick scratch, and it's intuitive that, sure the difference in timbre between round and flat wound strings must be at least a little bit related to the way your finger or pick slides off the string as it finishes the pluck. But my intuition is that it couldn't be as important as how the shape of the string vibrates through the magnetic field.
But, I'm thinking this difference must have, actually, quite a large contribution to timbre and tone (or something bigger than I'd initially expect); because tapewound strings sound quite different than roundwound strings. I believe Daddario tapewound simply have nylon wrapped over very light tension XLs, right? I have a bass with BEAD strings tuned up to C# F# B E, so I imagine that the primary differences I hear in tone that I hear are due to the way my finger or pick slides off the string (compared to the round wrap of standard nickel-plated steel XLs). It makes me think the primary difference in tone between (similarly constructed strings, Boomers I would guess, and) pressurewound strings would be because of the change in "rubbing" as your finger or pick moves against the string.
The vibrations of this rubbing (like rubbing your finger with the direction of wrap, not against) do seem like they would be very high frequencies, so maybe they're changing the way we perceive the timbre and harmonics of the notes? It still seems kind of crazy to think that the plating could do very much. A test for this factor might be to compare tone of strings only when tapped instead of plucked.
But, I'm thinking this difference must have, actually, quite a large contribution to timbre and tone (or something bigger than I'd initially expect); because tapewound strings sound quite different than roundwound strings. I believe Daddario tapewound simply have nylon wrapped over very light tension XLs, right? I have a bass with BEAD strings tuned up to C# F# B E, so I imagine that the primary differences I hear in tone that I hear are due to the way my finger or pick slides off the string (compared to the round wrap of standard nickel-plated steel XLs). It makes me think the primary difference in tone between (similarly constructed strings, Boomers I would guess, and) pressurewound strings would be because of the change in "rubbing" as your finger or pick moves against the string.
The vibrations of this rubbing (like rubbing your finger with the direction of wrap, not against) do seem like they would be very high frequencies, so maybe they're changing the way we perceive the timbre and harmonics of the notes? It still seems kind of crazy to think that the plating could do very much. A test for this factor might be to compare tone of strings only when tapped instead of plucked.
Another wild idea for wildly small tone differences...could be the way the plating affects the types of gunk that sticks to the string. This is VERY speculative, but if there are microscopic differences between the plating that change the amount or types of oil from your fingers that gets stuck and stays as the strings wear in...maybe you would hear that as subtle differences in tone?
If you put strings on with surgical gloves, would NPS and SS sound exactly the same out of the package? would they break in differently or at all?? This sounds increasingly inane, but you are welcome to swipe this idea if you are a youtuber looking for content.
If you put strings on with surgical gloves, would NPS and SS sound exactly the same out of the package? would they break in differently or at all?? This sounds increasingly inane, but you are welcome to swipe this idea if you are a youtuber looking for content.
I practiced for an hour this morning to break in the Rotosounds a bit- having played only flatwounds for the last 10 years or so these feel rough, but it was very much a stroll down memory lane, they felt and sounded just like I remember from the days of youth. Tomorrow is band rehearsal so I get to try them in a band setting.
Rotosound does not publish the info, but I did send them an email inquiring about this a short while ago. They did confirm the only difference between the Swingbass 66 Stainless Steel and the Swingbass 66 Nickel is the final cover being SS vs. NPS. Otherwise, they both have the same core and stainless steel inner layers.
That's not quite true. More Iron makes for more ferromagnetism, so Alloy 52 strings are more magnetic than Stainless.
Buy a set of each, clip an inch off the leader of each, so you still have enough to mount the strings properly, and measure the diameters of the wrap and the core (assuming the strings don't have multiple windings, and even then, you might be able to extrapolate the diameter of any intermediate winding, if there is only one, and it is not compression wound like the DR's are). But you're right: it does make a difference. For example, I wondered what a 45 bass string would sound like on a guitar that was 10-46 standard set, and vice versa. The D'A guitar 46 has a thinner core and thicker wrap than the 45 bass XL, which has a thicker core and thinner wrap, and it shows: the 46 guitar XL is twangy and thin on a bass, and the 45 bass XL is thumpy on a guitar.
I don't know why, but I tried a set of SS Lowriders, and it was pure torture until I finally got them broken in, argh! (I actually play Nickle Lowriders on all my basses now.) 
- Sep 9, 2007
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- Endorsing Artist: Eventide, GHS Strings, G&L Guitars, NS Design, Tsunami Cables
In this context, “compression wound” is nothing more than marketing. Every single string company does compression winding; it’s how the cover wires grab onto the core and each other.
I remember the Rotosound Swing Bass 66’s during my mid teens, this was in the late 70’s, and they were a dull, grayish color, and they felt pretty abrasive to the touch, compared to the other brands of roundwounds that I was familiar with.
And their tone was absolutely glorious, IMHO.
I also remember that Rotos had a series of “bumps”, or more like “humps” along their entire length. And the more experienced bass players that I knew used to tell me that Rotosound SB66’s were “unfinished”, which explained their dull, grayish color.
I bought a new set of Rotosound SB66’s over a year ago, and I put them on my P-Bass. I immediately noticed that their surface texture felt smoother, and that they were shiny, instead of a dull, gray color.
And, fresh out of their package, they still sound glorious, IMO. In fact, my P-Bass is still wearing them. I haven’t put a ton of playing time on them, but they still sound excellent to my ears.
This is a fascinating subject to me. I’ve always wondered what made SS roundwounds sound brighter than NPS roundwounds.
So, please keep this discussion going!
