Why no Rickenbacker import line?

[Iristone]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but wasn't it this very reason why Fender started the Nippon facility in the first place? Their knock offs were just as good, if not better, than the real thing.

I think so. And Gibson's Orville line. And maybe the Alembic Japan that just resides somewhere in my memory.

 

[micguy]

Well, Fender is Fender. Squier is something else.

The original Squier instruments were "Squier by Fender" - had the Fender name right on there. Fender Japan (instruments with just Fender on them, not made in the USA) also started the same year.

 

[Beej]

@PennyroyalWe you should ask this question on the Ric forum. I'm sure you'll get a lively discussion.

 

[Iristone]

Well, Fender is Fender. Squier is something else.

Well Squiers are good. Fenders are just better. Lulls and Sadowskys might be even better.

 

[micguy]

I'm sorry, I don't mean to be "that guy" but I can't resist.

Mercedes has the Smart car line. A relatively budget line for Merc.

The analogy, minus that little tidbit is a valid one. No need to dilute the brand name in this case.

If you go to Germany, you will see a lot more car models with the Mercedes badge on them than we have in the USA - a lot of them are smaller, obviously less expensive models. Mercedes is not just a high end car maker, but their USA subsidiary chooses to only sell the high end ones here - it costs as much to import a cheap car as it does to import an expensive one, so competing with local manufacturers means they won't make much (if any) money on the cheap ones, so.... They adopted a "high end " strategy in the USA, Just like Apple, they let everyone else slog it out for the meager profits from the bottom of the market, while they go home with healthy profits and only selling a few cars. That fact that most Americans think Mercedes is only a high end manufacturer means their strategy is working.

 

[john_g]

From an investment in longevity, it's completely narrow minded. They will feel the effects at the next economic downturn when the backlog runs out and the orders slow down. Not to say that they did so much to ramp things up. Ric has not done much to innovate their product, but who's to say they have to? But a budget minded off shore model would be flying off the shelves right now and might carry them through the next recession.

Im not a Ric apologist at all, but John Hall has said that when they tried to offer a new product, like the 4004, it didnt sell as well as the 4001/3. Most people that want a Ric want the classics. I dont recall the slow economy back in the late aughts hurting them (I got my current Ric around that time and it was more expensive than they are today). So, they have a product that is selling well enough, a majority of their clients that want the "classic design", and are a smaller operation that dont have stock holders or boards to answer to. I get it, people want a Ric for cheap, but for the foreseeable future, thats not going to happen.

 

[micguy]

Well Squiers are good. Fenders are just better.

As a musical instrument (not a piece of nostalgia), I'd take a modern "high end" Squier over a 70's Fender any day. With modern manufacturing techniques, a high end Squier is a better made instrument.

 

[Gringo Basso]

The reason is very simple: ric is a carpenter’s workshop that builds musical instruments, complete with a carpenter’s workshop mentality. The foreman’s name is Mr Hall.

The guys at ric simply don’t understand that they could make millions from licensing deals alone without any investment on their end.

Rica have always sold for roughly the same as USA fenders (give or take 200 bucks) but with a much higher production cost.

I would understand ric not wanting some overseas production if this were a 5,000 USD+ bass , but at the current price, come on!!

I agree wholeheartedly - it seems as John is comfortable as he is - he likes the "family business" and is proud that generations of employees work in the shop, and he might just be a guy who'd be uncomfortable is he was really "rich". Coming from a German, working-class family, he may not everyone want to join that rich 1% of the world, especially the headaches that come along with it. I admire John for not selling out and for keeping a dream alive - it takes a certain man to realise that. I do wish he'd spend more time creatively instead of the legal squabbles he seems to enjoy. The fact that he replaced the 4003 tailpiece shows that he does listen to us "little people". An import line could destroy everything he's built in a matter of a few years.

 

[Iristone]

As a musical instrument (not a piece of nostalgia), I'd take a modern "high end" Squier over a 70's Fender any day. With modern manufacturing techniques, a high end Squier is a better made instrument.

I mean modern Fender.

 

[Skybone]

They're probably doing just fine with their current offerings, just like Mercedes-Benz is.

Mercedes own Smart

 

[Cowboy in Latvia]

If you go to Germany, you will see a lot more car models with the Mercedes badge on them than we have in the USA - a lot of them are smaller, obviously less expensive models. Mercedes is not just a high end car maker, but their USA subsidiary chooses to only sell the high end ones here - it costs as much to import a cheap car as it does to import an expensive one, so competing with local manufacturers means they won't make much (if any) money on the cheap ones, so.... They adopted a "high end " strategy in the USA, Just like Apple, they let everyone else slog it out for the meager profits from the bottom of the market, while they go home with healthy profits and only selling a few cars. That fact that most Americans think Mercedes is only a high end manufacturer means their strategy is working.

To a point you are quite correct. They do have relatively cheaper models such as the A120 available. They aren't in the same price bracket as a Dacia, Ssangyong or Škoda but relative to their flagship lines they are positively budget. In this case that would price a budget Rick at about 6-800 usd, possibly more.

 

[GregC]

I agree wholeheartedly - it seems as John is comfortable as he is - he likes the "family business" and is proud that generations of employees work in the shop, and he might just be a guy who'd be uncomfortable is he was really "rich". Coming from a German, working-class family, he may not everyone want to join that rich 1% of the world, especially the headaches that come along with it. I admire John for not selling out and for keeping a dream alive - it takes a certain man to realise that. I do wish he'd spend more time creatively instead of the legal squabbles he seems to enjoy. The fact that he replaced the 4003 tailpiece shows that he does listen to us "little people". An import line could destroy everything he's built in a matter of a few years.

The fact that the bridge still hasn't changed suggests he doesn't listen that much. Also, starting the warranty period from the date of manufacture rather than the date of sale is absurd penny-pinching.

 

[Relayer71]

Considering that Fender's mexican crap used to sell for $399 and now sells for $999 (with no increase in quality),

Maybe there was no increase in quality but there likely was an increase in salaries & healthcare costs for Fender and/or its suppliers and there definitely was an increase in raw materials from the time those sold for $399.

Mind blowing, right?

 

[monsterthompson]

It does make it hard for Chinese factories to bootleg parts when you don’t send them the templates and pay them to practice producing the products.

The fact that the bridge still hasn't changed suggests he doesn't listen that much. Also, starting the warranty period from the date of manufacture rather than the date of sale is absurd penny-pinching.

The bridge on the 4003 has just changed. It now matches the AC model, and is available for purchase. Guess when a doom-metal legend asks for it, the company listens. Or his model was a way to test the waters before revamping the 4003 production.

They also had other models, aside from the 4003, with different bridges. Though I understand most folks don’t know or care about anything other than the 4003 (4001).

 

[Fresh Eddie]

Why no Rickenbacker import line?

That will never happen … why? because they don't want to do it that way

I remember not too long ago when Ernie Ball said the same thing about MusicMan.

 

[micguy]

I doubt the company executives would complain if they became more popular.

I doubt the company is big enough to have "executives".

There's a local restaurant that's really big - seats about 1000 people; on weekends it's always full, with a waiting line out the door. Lots of folks have pointed out that, if he franchised, he'd make even more money. The owner is not interested - he can't guarantee the quality of food and service if there's more than one location - that's his answer to that question, he doesn't even address the topic of money when asked. Ambition and drive isn't always about money or market share - sometimes being the best (your version of best - what matters to you personally) is the thing that drives someone.

 

[Gilmourisgod]

Hall seems to operate on the “If it ain’t broke....” principal, can’t fault him there. I will fault him for shipping a lot of basses with flaking paint and a crap warranty that requires the Buyer to eat shipping one way to CA for ANY warranty repairs, they have NO satellite warranty repair sites. That just plain sucks, and tempers the “honest nice guy” image with a little reality check. If you bought a brand new car, and the paint started flaking off the hood, would you be cool with the salesman saying “um.... yeah... you own shipping it back to Detroit for warranty repairs. Your’e in Florida? Sucks for you, Man, M’Kay, bye”

 

[TexasEdition]

Hall seems to operate on the “If it ain’t broke....” principal, can’t fault him there. I will fault him for shipping a lot of basses with flaking paint and a crap warranty that requires the Buyer to eat shipping one way to CA for ANY warranty repairs, they have NO satellite warranty repair sites. That just plain sucks, and tempers the “honest nice guy” image with a little reality check. If you bought a brand new car, and the paint started flaking off the hood, would you be cool with the salesman saying “um.... yeah... you own shipping it back to Detroit for warranty repairs. Your’e in Florida? Sucks for you, Man, M’Kay, bye”

Part of the Innovations I was speaking about earlier. I think they will always have a fan-boy cult following, but it's things like this that will hurt them when times get tough.

 

[DuluthDank]

Rickenbacker is to basses what Grado is to headphones, for better or worse.

 

[buldog5151bass]

I love these Ric threads. They generally fall into one of the following:

1. Ric doesn't know what they are doing business-wise.
2. Rics are terrible.
3. I want a Ric (or I want something that looks/sounds like a Ric).

We should all be so lucky to own a company that is so inept.