Why would you choose a Fender over a Sire?

[FRoss6788]

Do you consider your Lākland a FSO, but an exception to your Fender rule?

It's a 55-01, so it's a riff on it, yes. Is it trying to be a P or a J? Nope...
My 2009 Jazz and Highway 1 are still better than the Lakland in almost every way.

 

[dabbler]

...
Fender USA pays very good wages, health benefits and probably 401k etc. Does the Asian worker get that? Not likely.

I will not blame folks for buying offshore guitars. They're fantastic these days. Prices are awesome for young folks. But if you can afford a USA (or MIM) Fender, maybe you should assess something larger than your wallet. I call it social responsibility.

Fender also sponsors musicians and events.

But I'm missing your social responsibility point. Are you saying that if we stop buying the more affordable off-shore instruments that those companies will give their workers more salary and benefits and increase their product prices? I don't think so, but like I said, I'm missing your social responsibility point.

 

[squeally dan]

My Fender is 60 years old and has 60 years worth of wear and tear. You can feel this when you play it, you can hear it in it's tone. It's the standard from which all other J style basses are measured. A new Sire, while a really great bass for the money, just doesn't exude the feel and vibe of an original Pre-CBS Fender Bass.

Re-sale value on a piece of equipment that doesn't even cost that much to begin with is totally silly. Unless you're in the business of selling used equipment, this should not be a concern because it's meant to used for fun/pleasure- you buy it because you WANT IT- unlike a car or house which is a necessity. Also, some people use their equipment to earn income (I fall into this category), so re-sale on something that "pays for itself" is a non-issue.

Not trying to be a jerk. We can all have our own unique opinion. However, when you say things like "doesn't even cost much to begin with", that is your opinion and not a fact. What may not be a lot of money to you might be a lot for me. I guess if that makes me "silly", I can live with that.

 

[prom311]

A new Sire, while a really great bass for the money, just doesn't exude the feel and vibe of an original Pre-CBS Fender Bass.

Not exactly a fair comparison. No one in their right mind would compare a Sire to a pre-CBS Fender. More like MIM. You can make the argument against some MIA's. Personally, I'd rather gig a Sire than a lot of the 12lb boat anchors from the 70s & 80s.

Re-sale value on a piece of equipment that doesn't even cost that much to begin with is totally silly.

Houses a necessity? They are, but that didn't stop a few million ppl/private equity firms from looking for 'passive income' by buying up homes

Agreed, that the resale conversation is a little silly. They may not gain a lot of value but they don't lose it either. I bought my Sires used & relatively cheap so I have no doubt I could get back what I paid for them. Anyone who buys a Sire to speculate on price is an idiot. You buy them because they're good, affordable players.

It's actually a positive there is no "vintage" market with collectors, speculators, & price gougers driving up the price of everything.

 

[Smooth_bass88]

26988582[/URL], member: 276828"]Houses a necessity? They are, but that didn't stop a few million ppl/private equity firms from looking for 'passive income' by buying up homes & posting them @vacationer prices on AirBnB. Some cars are definitely bought on spec, too (RIP recent Mercedes-Benz buyers…).

what's your favorite bass?

 

[96tbird]

Fender also sponsors musicians and events.

But I'm missing your social responsibility point. Are you saying that if we stop buying the more affordable off-shore instruments that those companies will give their workers more salary and benefits and increase their product prices? I don't think so, but like I said, I'm missing your social responsibility point.

My point is that we need to begin to rethink buying products made in places where employees are treated like slaves and are not protected by basic human rights laws.

 

[ElectricBass72]

I have a Sire Marcus Miller V5 fretless and it is better quality than my MIM Fenders. The V5 is on the lower end of Sire's line of basses.

 

[LBS-bass]

That's largely because what we consider "seminal" records predate the introduction of Sire. Yes, neither Jaco or Jamerson used a Sire, but Marcus Miller does. Wait a decade or two (Fender had a 60 year head start), that'll change.

Also, I have no idea what was used on 99% of the music I hear, and I imagine that's true for most of us.

 

[Akiyama]

I did some looking at some Sire basses on sale at Sweetwater. Interesting basses with some apparent specification pluses, whatevers, and minuses but I'll keep my Player Jazz. I am not looking for a second electric bass.

 

[PWolverine]

Fender doesn't have any secret sauce that makes them better or worse than anyone else.

I'm way new to bass, and haven't played too many, but going off my observations and watching things like Fender factory tours online, wouldn't some of that "secret sauce" simply be experience in the industry? Selling a product, refining it, hopefully making it better using current technology and still keeping some old methods alive at the same time by using the same tools / machines for decades for some of the processes. Having workers that have been doing a job for decades brings proficiency to the role and it seems there are quite a number of those at Fender factories behind the scenes. I think some of this aspect gets forgotten, or underplayed. Sure newer companies can come in and make some great gear, but there is something to having experience and time to refine or research a product.

 

[Sharko]

But I'm missing your social responsibility point. Are you saying that if we stop buying the more affordable off-shore instruments that those companies will give their workers more salary and benefits and increase their product prices? I don't think so, but like I said, I'm missing your social responsibility point.

No, he's saying give your money to Fender, a company that doesn't exploit cheap Asian labor… oh wait

 

[micguy]

26989508[/URL], member: 383223"]I'm way new to bass, and haven't played too many, but going off my observations and watching things like Fender factory tours online, wouldn't some of that "secret sauce" simply be experience in the industry? Selling a product, refining it, hopefully making it better using current technology and still keeping some old methods alive at the same time by using the same tools / machines for decades for some of the processes. Having workers that have been doing a job for decades brings proficiency to the role and it seems there are quite a number of those at Fender factories behind the scenes. I think some of this aspect gets forgotten, or underplayed. Sure newer companies can come in and make some great gear, but there is something to having experience and time to refine or research a product.

Fender does have some modern stuff like CNC machines, but watching the factory tour, I was shocked by the…antiquity of a lot of their tooling and processes. I worked for a company that has products of similar age - we invested a lot over many decades in newer tooling and processes, and as a result, even our 60 year old products got better and far more consistent. Fender may have a lot of experience keeping old machines and processes running, but that's not typically a good strategy if you want to make good products over the long haul.

The factory tour videos show a company that's focused on doing things the same way, not continuous improvement.

 

[PWolverine]

Fender does have some modern stuff like CNC machines, but watching the factory tour, I was shocked by the…antiquity of a lot of their tooling and processes. I worked for a company that has products of similar age - we invested a lot over many decades in newer tooling and processes, and as a result, even our 60 year old products got better and far more consistent. Fender may have a lot of experience keeping old machines and processes running, but that's not typically a good strategy if you want to make good products over the long haul.

I agree in part. It is about being selective about what gets upgraded and why. Companies can use modern equipment but customers may then complain tone changes and so on. This is especially true if some of these parts impact the tone in some ways - and with vintage gear being sought after using original techniques and machines is a plus for a lot of people. Modernising a process isn't always a good thing, there are lots of variables. However, this doesn't take into consideration the staff experience in doing tasks and decades of research.

 

[micguy]

I agree in part. It is about being selective about what gets upgraded and why. Companies can use modern equipment but customers may then complain tone changes and so on. This is especially true if some of these parts impact the tone in some ways - and with vintage gear being sought after using original techniques and machines is a plus for a lot of people. Modernising a process isn't always a good thing, there are lots of variables. However, this doesn't take into consideration the staff experience in doing tasks and decades of research.

Yes, of course you keep track of the performance - if a new machine or process moves things in the wrong direction, it's not a good thing. However, if you know what makes your product tick, and you're focused on improving the things that control that, it's very rare that you'll find that things have gone the wrong direction.

 

[Smith357]

Because I would rather have the real thing over a copy.

 

[Yahboy]

For Precision bass, i choose Fender or Squier . But, open brand choice for Jazz bass. My Bacchus J play great than Fender player J, with just 1/3 money spend.

For serious money spend for passive Jazz bass, sure Sire V5.

 

[elgranluis]

Apart from talkbass , I don't think I've ever seen a Sire anywhere. Just like SX or even Carvin, they don't seem to exist outside of this forum. That's a good reason to choose a fender.

 

[cdef]

Price being equal, I'd go for the Fender just to get the proper, iconic headstock.

 

[Shawn Luckman]

For me I always wanted to own a genuine American made Fender Precision. The history alone by being the first original commercially made bass guitar to the decades of use from early Rock n Roll to today's music by, thousands of players both professional & hobbyists the world over is a unique thing.

 

[Sauron_]

Apart from talkbass , I don't think I've ever seen a Sire anywhere. Just like SX or even Carvin, they don't seem to exist outside of this forum. That's a good reason to choose a fender.

They're everywhere, heck, they were playing one at the Superbowl...