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Yet another Fender decision question

D

drteeth

Apr 1, 2008
305
0
38
Leuven, Belgium
#1
Hi all,

As I will be buying my second bass and first upgrade from the starter bass I play now, I have managed to narrow my choice down to a Jazz. My question is: is the '08 american standard worth the extra wad of cash compared to a MIM model? I am also considering a Geddy Lee, how does this compare to an american standard?

Drteeth
 
#3
Play them both, and see what you think.

I think the MIAs are good instruments but drastically overpriced, and it'll be worse in a couple of days when the Fender price hike hits. I own an '08 MIA J bass, but only because I got one of the $499 closeouts. To me the MIA isn't worth 2.5 times the price of a MIM, and the Squier CV Jazz is a serious contender- make sure you play one of those, too.
 
#4
The MIA has some finishing touches that make it just look and feel like a finer instrument than the MIM (I know, I own one of each). Things like rolled fingerboard edges, glossy headstock and satin neck both look and feel nice. Pickups are of higher quality too. Different tuners and bridge as well.

That being said, the MIM's are a great bargain right now. The fit and finish quality on them is excellent. I would say the only critical investment you'd have to make in it would be change the pickups. Once you do that, you've got a great workhorse bass for half the cost of an MIA. The rest of the electronics (knobs, pots, wiring, jack) are all equivalent to the MIA stuff. There's nothing really wrong with the bridge - I've still got the stock one on mine, and the tuners are fine too, they're just the large vintage style ones.

Frankly, if you really got your heart set on an MIA, I would suggest buying a used one instead of new.
 
#5
If you have the money and it isn't going to cause a financial hardship for you, buy the one you really want after playing them. All three are good quality basses in their price levels. I think the Geddy is a very nice bass, but it isn't the same Jazz as the other two. The neck alone makes it very different than a standard, MIM or MIA. I just would make sure that you want that particular model.
 
#8
If you are looking for a workhorse bass that is going to be your main bass, I would personally buy a MIM or better. I would go one level above the MIM standards and choose at least an Active Deluxe, 60's, etc. If you can go Japanese, even better. I think the difference between the Japan and USA models is very small, if any. I own one of each. I would also go used as you will get more bang for your buck.

P.S. The Squier CV stuff is a great cheaper solution. But if you're looking to do a significant upgrade, I would one up it. :-)
 
#9
To me, and to many others, the MIA is worth the extra cost. Otherwise, no one would buy them. This is a question that only you can answer...

I would *not* characterize the electronics in a Squier CV, Fender MIM or a Fender MIJ as equivalent to a Fender MIA, nor would I say that the build specs, Quality Assurance, or materials are equivalent. To suggest that they are, to me, is ridiculous.

The Squiers are fantastic *for the money*, as are the MIMs and MIJs. So too are the MIAs... They're all worth their street selling price, if you ask me.

It always seems that when this question gets asked and answered here on TB, people come from all directions talking about how their Squier or Mexican Fender blows away every American Fender they've ever played or owned. Seriously, give me a break...

The Fender American Standards are awesome, and so is every other pre-2008 model that I've ever owned or played. I also really like my Squier Vintage Modified fretless, and my Squier Strat, and my Squier Mini Strat, but I recognize they're not in the same league as my MIA P bass.

Sometimes where the quality really becomes noticable is after gigging the instrument for a couple of years. You'll find that some instruments go out of tune more often than others, things break, screws come out and get lost, bridges fail or need constant attention, caps/pots wear out or even break, some necks need constant adjustment, some instruments just don't sound consistent from venue to venue or season to season, etc. You will find that (in general, there are exceptions in both directions for any brand) a MIA Fender is a lot more consistent and reliable in the long run than a MIM or a Squier.

If you want something that will last you 2-3 years before you swap it out and replace it, go for the Squier. If you want something for 5-7 years, get the MIM. If you want something to keep for the next 25-30 years or more, get the MIA.
 
#10
Thanks for your opinions so far!

From all your opinions I can only tell for sure that I will have to go make this decision for myself :). I'm heading over to a large store the 31th (hoping to beat that price raise) and I'll take it from there. I would have taken some more time before having to pull the trigger but it appears the process has been sped up a bit (not necessarily a bad thing :D)

Budgetwise I can afford the MIA, but I want to make sure I want to spend the extra +/- € 500 on a bass. If buying a MIM or MIJ and upgrading individual parts over time would take me there cheaper I would probably take that route.

As for buying used: it appears that the second-hand market here is rather small. Stores offer only a few used basses in general, and some have no used stock at all. So I believe that is going to be difficult.
 
#11
I tried three Geddy Lees from GC (and that may have been the problem) and found the necks on all three to be less than straight. I seem to remember this problem being mentioned by others on this forum. Anyone else have this experience?
 
#12
BillMason said:
To me, and to many others, the MIA is worth the extra cost. Otherwise, no one would buy them. This is a question that only you can answer...

I would *not* characterize the electronics in a Squier CV, Fender MIM or a Fender MIJ as equivalent to a Fender MIA, nor would I say that the build specs, Quality Assurance, or materials are equivalent. To suggest that they are, to me, is ridiculous.

The Squiers are fantastic *for the money*, as are the MIMs and MIJs. So too are the MIAs... They're all worth their street selling price, if you ask me.

It always seems that when this question gets asked and answered here on TB, people come from all directions talking about how their Squier or Mexican Fender blows away every American Fender they've ever played or owned. Seriously, give me a break...

The Fender American Standards are awesome, and so is every other pre-2008 model that I've ever owned or played. I also really like my Squier Vintage Modified fretless, and my Squier Strat, and my Squier Mini Strat, but I recognize they're not in the same league as my MIA P bass.

Sometimes where the quality really becomes noticable is after gigging the instrument for a couple of years. You'll find that some instruments go out of tune more often than others, things break, screws come out and get lost, bridges fail or need constant attention, caps/pots wear out or even break, some necks need constant adjustment, some instruments just don't sound consistent from venue to venue or season to season, etc. You will find that (in general, there are exceptions in both directions for any brand) a MIA Fender is a lot more consistent and reliable in the long run than a MIM or a Squier.

If you want something that will last you 2-3 years before you swap it out and replace it, go for the Squier. If you want something for 5-7 years, get the MIM. If you want something to keep for the next 25-30 years or more, get the MIA.
Click to expand...

We all got our opinions. :hiding: I think alot of this is true in many respects. Except for one part that I really disagree on. I think Fender Japan and Amercian Standard Fenders are very very close in quality. I would think alot of folks would agree as well. I have owned several in the past and have never had any issues with the quality/parts/etc. The build has always been excellent in my MIJ's. The pickups in certain models are about the only thing I see that could possibly make any difference between them. Some are better than others. Build quality, I really dont see much difference. I have seen MIJ's that have been better than MIA's and vice versa. Play them both and decide which one you like. I have one of each and think they both are great!
 
#13
r379 said:
I tried three Geddy Lees from GC (and that may have been the problem) and found the necks on all three to be less than straight. I seem to remember this problem being mentioned by others on this forum. Anyone else have this experience?
Click to expand...

I have had that experience with most Fenders, especially at Guitar Center where they take them out of the box and hang them on the wall. :scowl:
 
#14
BillMason said:
If you want something that will last you 2-3 years before you swap it out and replace it, go for the Squier. If you want something for 5-7 years, get the MIM. If you want something to keep for the next 25-30 years or more, get the MIA.
Click to expand...

I'm going to disagree with you here.

I have an '82 P-bass (see sig) that I hope someone will be playing long after I'm dead. It's a beautiful instrument and I love it- I'm never giving this one up.

I also have a '99 Squier (Indonesian) P-bass "special" (P/J pickups, jazz neck) that is a solid, playable instrument. I took it to practice last week and it hangs with my MIA basses, stock. Sure it isn't made as well and has cheap pickups, electronics and hardware, but it's still a perfectly playable instrument with a usable sound. I wouldn't hesitate to play out with it if I needed to. After a decent amount of tweaking, it plays just as good as my '08 MIA jazz (it does feel different due to the different neck finishes, though). The MIA Jazz is clearly a better instrument, but to me not 5 times better as the price difference would indicate. It's 10 years old, and it's still stock- nothing has broken or fallen off. It's a good workhorse bass that'll be with me for a long time yet. Sure the pots are a little wobbly and the tuners aren't as silky smooth as the MIA, but you don't hear that stuff out in the audience.

I remember the '80s when everyone said Japanese Fenders were crap, and now everyone wants them because they've realized how good they are. I think something similar is going on with Squiers- everyone assumes they're junk (and some certainly are), but eventually folks will realize that they're actually pretty solid performers, even if they're stripped down and don't have frills like hand-rolled fret ends and super-smooth tuners.

I guess my point is that no one should feel like they HAVE to get an MIA Fender or be stuck with garbage- the Squiers will do right by you for a good long while. Especially the CVs. Man, those things are amazing. I've played a couple that blow the doors off the MIMs, and give my MIA a run for it's money.
 
#15
Overall I am a Fender MIM player. I would say look into the 60's classic Jazz which is built as good as any MIA and sounds awsome for less money. I know some won't agree and stated it here but i do own a modded MIM that i have put right up to MIAs and it is 100% equal in playability /tone. It has a vintage replacement bridge and 62 reissue pups. A good MIM can last forever.

Look used if possible and if not look into the classic line of MIMs. I own a 50's P and love it. On the MIJ line, well i bought my first and have to say i was disapointed. Although i love my 51 P it had bad fret ends the worse i have ever seen on a Fender. The nut was cut to low and later broke at practice in half a few weeks after i bought it. I have had to adjust the neck more than any bass i have ever owned. I finally after a few hours of filing frets, setups and replacing a nut have a great bass. The only reason i kept it was i got it on closeout for 399.00 @ GC and it was the last one they had in stock. Plus i guess its been a labor of love :)
 
#17
If you want an eye opener, Do what i did. Close your eyes, no peeking now, and have a friend start handing you Fenders to play. When you hear and feel the one you want, open your eyes. We just did this the other day. The results were not what I expected. I liked a MIA standard P-Bass the best. He tried to trip me up by handing me the bass back to back twice, but it didn't matter. I still liked it as much as "the bass I just played" and I said I would have to see the colors later. My second favorite was a MIM standard P-Bass. The MIA did have a more adjustable volume, where the MIM had no change until you got about halfway and then a big jump. The neck on the MIA was definately better, the MIM could use a wee bit of fret dressing. The MIA had a bit more "hearable sustain". Is the MIA 900.00 better? I don't know, as of right now I'm sitting on the fence trying to decide. I'll let you know...
 
#18
Beyer160 said:
I'm going to disagree with you here.

I have an '82 P-bass (see sig) that I hope someone will be playing long after I'm dead. It's a beautiful instrument and I love it- I'm never giving this one up.

I also have a '99 Squier (Indonesian) P-bass "special" (P/J pickups, jazz neck) that is a solid, playable instrument. I took it to practice last week and it hangs with my MIA basses, stock. Sure it isn't made as well and has cheap pickups, electronics and hardware, but it's still a perfectly playable instrument with a usable sound. I wouldn't hesitate to play out with it if I needed to. After a decent amount of tweaking, it plays just as good as my '08 MIA jazz (it does feel different due to the different neck finishes, though). The MIA Jazz is clearly a better instrument, but to me not 5 times better as the price difference would indicate. It's 10 years old, and it's still stock- nothing has broken or fallen off. It's a good workhorse bass that'll be with me for a long time yet. Sure the pots are a little wobbly and the tuners aren't as silky smooth as the MIA, but you don't hear that stuff out in the audience.

I remember the '80s when everyone said Japanese Fenders were crap, and now everyone wants them because they've realized how good they are. I think something similar is going on with Squiers- everyone assumes they're junk (and some certainly are), but eventually folks will realize that they're actually pretty solid performers, even if they're stripped down and don't have frills like hand-rolled fret ends and super-smooth tuners.

I guess my point is that no one should feel like they HAVE to get an MIA Fender or be stuck with garbage- the Squiers will do right by you for a good long while. Especially the CVs. Man, those things are amazing. I've played a couple that blow the doors off the MIMs, and give my MIA a run for it's money.
Click to expand...

Ok... but I'm not sure you're disagreeing with me. Your Fullerton *is* MIA, and proves my point. And I never said Squiers were crap - some are, but the CVs and VMs are great - again, for the money. I have a VM, as I said. Two years later, after being treated very well, and gigged, it has lost a screw from one of the tuners, and the stock pickups were replaced shortly after I bought it. Other than that, it has held up well, so far, but it's absolutely not in the same league as my MIA basses have been and is.

I agree that the Japanese Fenders are great quality, but their electronics do not have the same consistency of quality as the MIAs. Arguably better consistency of quality in body fit and finish, compared to 80s-90s MIA Fenders though.
 
#20
I largely agree with Bill Mason, but the lines have blurred somewhat with the higher end MIM models, such as the Reggie Hamilton Standard Jazz, and the Classic series. I've played several of these, both Jazz and Precision basses, and they are excellent. Do they equal the American Standards? In my opinion, no, but they're a lot better than the MIM Standard line, and I could imagine some players preferring the vintage specs of the Classics to the more modern American Standards. You should check them out.
 

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