Yet another Fender decision question

[Sgtthump]

...As for electronics, I'm speaking from the experience of opening up the control plates and seeing the exact same CTS pots and switches that are on my MIA bass. I know that MIM made early 90's Squiers had cheapo pots and switches - but the standards don't. Same stuff under the hood of your MIA as your MIM...

I totally believe you. I was just saying that the early MIM Standards (the guitars, at least) had super small cheapo pots and other electronics in them. I too am speaking from experience. Again, this is with the early MIM Standard guitars, not basses. But I assume they were the same.

I just wonder when all of that changed. Could've been shortly after they were introduced, not sure.

 

[bassbully]

Well i can only go back 7 years to my first MIM and alls good. I have never seen any bass that was taken care of just fall apart and quit working. There are lots of cats gigging and touring with MIMs, squiers, SX and budget basses. Some are modded some fairly stock. To sit there and say anyone wouldnt take a perfectly good and playing MIM on the road cuz they feared it falling apart is stupid (sorry).

A standard MIA is better built, better finished (slightly) better hardware...but is it more trustworthy? As i said ..prove it?
All i know is the money diff from a good MIM to an MIA is not worth it in my book. I have played both and could of owned both and picked a MIM over an MIA everytime. My wallet is all the better and my bands and the crowd think i sound just fine.

BTW For S&G i bought a 5 string this summer cheap($100.00) from a guy who lives in my area who tours close to 360 days a year in a nationally known 80's metal band.The bass is an unknown brand that i would say was up with Rondo or Brice. He has used this all over the world in stadiums etc. He said why pay big bucks for gear....I PLAY for for big bucks

 

[Powdered Toast]

I totally believe you. I was just saying that the early MIM Standards (the guitars, at least) had super small cheapo pots and other electronics in them. I too am speaking from experience. Again, this is with the early MIM Standard guitars, not basses. But I assume they were the same.

I just wonder when all of that changed. Could've been shortly after they were introduced, not sure.

I've got a 1994 MIM Tele with the small "Squier Series" logo. It had cheap little pots and a crappy switch.

I have a 1996 MIM Standard Tele and it has all CTS pots and a standard selector switch.

So... I guess sometime between 1994 and 1996 then?

 

[MtManiac]

I think that's a bit melodramatic. An MIM lasts you 5-7 years? I've got two mid 90's teles and a 2001 Jazz Bass and they're still as good as the day I got them.

Ok, but I'm talking about constant gigging, which I wouldn't do for 20+ years on a MIM or a Squier without replacing a few more parts than a MIA.

 

[Sgtthump]

I've got a 1994 MIM Tele with the small "Squier Series" logo. It had cheap little pots and a crappy switch.

I have a 1996 MIM Standard Tele and it has all CTS pots and a standard selector switch.

So... I guess sometime between 1994 and 1996 then?

I'm not at all familiar with the Squires from that time. I'm only talking about the early MIM Standards.

But yeah, those years could be right? I can't remember exactly but I think my Strat was a 1992. That's my best guess. I didn't realize they upgraded the electronics as early as 1996. Wow.

 

[HMZ]

mia over a mim, you get what you pay for...

 

[mophead]

If you have settled on a Jazz bass to purchase then you must put your hands on one of these before you buy anything. I owned one of these once and it was one incredible jazz bass. Saw it before I knew what it was or where it was made. These can be had used for a good price. Just don't get in a hurry and you will find one at a steal and you will be all smiles. They are that good!

Invalid Link Removed

This bass has already been mentioned in a couple of threads earlier. Listen and find one. You will not be disappointed!

 

[chrisrusty99]

I tried three Geddy Lees from GC (and that may have been the problem) and found the necks on all three to be less than straight. I seem to remember this problem being mentioned by others on this forum. Anyone else have this experience?

that's just the store's fault... mine stays pretty straight - even in seasons with colder weather

 

[MtManiac]

that's just the store's fault... mine stays pretty straight - even in seasons with colder weather

Agreed - humidity control is kind of important in a music store.

 

[Willicious]

Overall I am a Fender MIM player.
I would say look into the 60's classic Jazz which is built as good
as any MIA and sounds awsome for less money.

Just picked up a '60s Classic J in sunburst. My first MIM.
Fit, finish and setup were very good out of the box.
Neck feels great, rosewood is beautiful, and the rolled edges
are super comfortable. This bass is going to last a long time.

With the $600 price, I have some budget for upgrades:
Some stagger-pole Fralins, stack knobs, TI Jazz Flats
and suddenly we're taking the slow train to buttery J goodness.

 

[MtManiac]

I agree that the "special" MIMs are great value for the money, like the Classic 60s P bass and the Classic 60s Jazz bass. They're a little pricier than the Standard MIMs, and both are IMHO worth what you pay for them.

Still would not stack them up against a MIA over the long haul.

 

[Sgtthump]

I agree that the "special" MIMs are great value for the money, like the Classic 60s P bass and the Classic 60s Jazz bass. They're a little pricier than the Standard MIMs, and both are IMHO worth what you pay for them.

Still would not stack them up against a MIA over the long haul.

BillMason, with all due respect, I think you're very much over-exaggerating to make a point that you like the USA stuff better. I do too. But to think that there's a 6-7 year gigging lifespan on the MIM Fenders is just ridiculous IMO (notice I said "IMO").

I can't come up with a single reason to support that claim. Sure, the hardware and whatever else on most USA stuff is better than most of the MIM stuff, but it's a huge leap to say the MIM stuff won't last gigging for 6-7 years.

Just my opinion.

 

[BadB]

To me, and to many others, the MIA is worth the extra cost. Otherwise, no one would buy them. This is a question that only you can answer...

I would *not* characterize the electronics in a Squier CV, Fender MIM or a Fender MIJ as equivalent to a Fender MIA, nor would I say that the build specs, Quality Assurance, or materials are equivalent. To suggest that they are, to me, is ridiculous.

The Squiers are fantastic *for the money*, as are the MIMs and MIJs. So too are the MIAs... They're all worth their street selling price, if you ask me.

It always seems that when this question gets asked and answered here on TB, people come from all directions talking about how their Squier or Mexican Fender blows away every American Fender they've ever played or owned. Seriously, give me a break...

The Fender American Standards are awesome, and so is every other pre-2008 model that I've ever owned or played. I also really like my Squier Vintage Modified fretless, and my Squier Strat, and my Squier Mini Strat, but I recognize they're not in the same league as my MIA P bass.

Sometimes where the quality really becomes noticable is after gigging the instrument for a couple of years. You'll find that some instruments go out of tune more often than others, things break, screws come out and get lost, bridges fail or need constant attention, caps/pots wear out or even break, some necks need constant adjustment, some instruments just don't sound consistent from venue to venue or season to season, etc. You will find that (in general, there are exceptions in both directions for any brand) a MIA Fender is a lot more consistent and reliable in the long run than a MIM or a Squier.

If you want something that will last you 2-3 years before you swap it out and replace it, go for the Squier. If you want something for 5-7 years, get the MIM. If you want something to keep for the next 25-30 years or more, get the MIA.

BillMason makes some excellent points. I have had 2 MIM, 2 CIJ, 2 MIA, and 2 MIA Artist Series. The MIM and CIJ have crappy bridges and tuners, sub-standard shielding, noisy... One MIM neck did the twist in the first position, the other MIM neck did the wave. No problems with either CIJ neck, but they have a different feel. Not a bad thing at all, just different. I have had ZERO problems with the MIA basses. They also feel better to play than the MIM and CIJ. The MIA Artist Series are the better basses, hands down. They will also be the better investment in the long run. It's all about how the phrase "bang for the buck" applies to you.

 

[MtManiac]

Feels like I've opened a can of worms..

Another question: what should I be aware off when trying out basses? (What are signs that an instrument has certain defaults/flaws/.. )?

Sorry, missed this question in all the academic discussion.

Check out the fit where the neck joins the body, should be good and tight without huge gaps.

Sight down the edge of the neck from the headstock to the body, and ensure the neck is straight.

Play it acoustically, and hear how it sounds (and feels of course). Does it sound good?

Plug it into your amp if possible, or something close to your amp if possible, or an amp that you know and like, and hear how it sounds.

Are any of the frets raised up, or sticking out of the edge of the neck?

How is it set up; action, intonation, etc.?

Play each note, every fret, every string and pay attention to sustain and any ringing harmonics - how does the fundamental pitch sound? Any dead spots (there usually is) and can you live with them?

 

[heinpete]

Why don't you take the "best of both worlds" and try a highway 1 and compare to the MIM classic 70ies Jazz? The price of the H1 is in the range of the MIMs and its make is MIA. On the other hand the MIM classic 70ies Jazz is slightly less expensive than the H1 and its quality is above standart MIM.

 

[register2]

Just to throw my two cents in there, I think the difference between the MIA and MIM basses has nothing to do with use - they're both big hunks of wood, and all you are doing with them is plucking at the strings. There's no reason for either one to crap out. I think the difference is in the ability of the instrument to appreciate in resale value, as well as comfort. I think that an MIA is easier to keep set up, has a smoother neck, and probably more resonant wood. I think either one is fine for making music on.

 

[MtManiac]

BillMason, with all due respect, I think you're very much over-exaggerating to make a point that you like the USA stuff better. I do too. But to think that there's a 6-7 year gigging lifespan on the MIM Fenders is just ridiculous IMO (notice I said "IMO").

I can't come up with a single reason to support that claim. Sure, the hardware and whatever else on most USA stuff is better than most of the MIM stuff, but it's a huge leap to say the MIM stuff won't last gigging for 6-7 years.

Just my opinion.

Maybe... but your humble opinion and my humble opinion do not have to agree, and that's ok, we can still be friends. It's not necessarily the case that I like MIA better, I have played several MIMs and Squiers that I like, and in many cases would have bought if funds at the time were otherwise. I own a Squier VM fretless and two Squier guitars, after all. It's not about which I like better, my points are about that there *are* differences, and that the differences are all worth the differences in price. In general, for "typical" examples of a species (MIM, MIA, Squier, etc.) I absolutely believe that - there are definitely exceptions in both directions across all models. I would definitely stack any "typical" MIA up against any "typical" MIM for a long haul, and any typical MIM against and typical Squier.

$300 for a Squier Classic Vibe Oly white Jazz with Tort guard, rosewood fretboard and a high mass bridge to me looks like an awesome deal, regardless of how long it lasts with constant gigging. Would I rather have a MIA Standard, or for that matter a '62 RI? Yes, absolutely. Do I have $1100 or $1600 (or $300 ) at the moment for a new bass? No, I don't. The OP question was whether the difference in price between the different models was worth it, and I believe that it absolutely is.

 

[Disraeli Gears]

I tried three Geddy Lees from GC (and that may have been the problem) and found the necks on all three to be less than straight. I seem to remember this problem being mentioned by others on this forum. Anyone else have this experience?

I think that may just be because it was from GC- they don't usually have good setups. I went in there and played an MIA P-bass a little while back and it had by far the most warped neck I've seen. The strings were literally about a half inch off the board at the 9th fret :scowl:.

That being said, don't be turned away from the Geddy just because of the poor setup at GC- I own one and have played others, all of which are very nice basses. I'd even personally pick it over even the MIA because in terms of overall quality it seems fairly equal, and I like the smaller neck.

And as several others have suggested, I'd recommend you buy used, either way you decide to go.

 

[madbassplaya]

To me, and to many others, the MIA is worth the extra cost. Otherwise, no one would buy them. This is a question that only you can answer...

I would *not* characterize the electronics in a Squier CV, Fender MIM or a Fender MIJ as equivalent to a Fender MIA, nor would I say that the build specs, Quality Assurance, or materials are equivalent. To suggest that they are, to me, is ridiculous.

The Squiers are fantastic *for the money*, as are the MIMs and MIJs. So too are the MIAs... They're all worth their street selling price, if you ask me.

It always seems that when this question gets asked and answered here on TB, people come from all directions talking about how their Squier or Mexican Fender blows away every American Fender they've ever played or owned. Seriously, give me a break...

The Fender American Standards are awesome, and so is every other pre-2008 model that I've ever owned or played. I also really like my Squier Vintage Modified fretless, and my Squier Strat, and my Squier Mini Strat, but I recognize they're not in the same league as my MIA P bass.

Sometimes where the quality really becomes noticable is after gigging the instrument for a couple of years. You'll find that some instruments go out of tune more often than others, things break, screws come out and get lost, bridges fail or need constant attention, caps/pots wear out or even break, some necks need constant adjustment, some instruments just don't sound consistent from venue to venue or season to season, etc. You will find that (in general, there are exceptions in both directions for any brand) a MIA Fender is a lot more consistent and reliable in the long run than a MIM or a Squier.

If you want something that will last you 2-3 years before you swap it out and replace it, go for the Squier. If you want something for 5-7 years, get the MIM. If you want something to keep for the next 25-30 years or more, get the MIA.

+1

i've seen MIM owners talk about how their upgraded MIMs smoke MIAs, but whenever I put an MIA up for sale/trade, I get offers from those people wanting to do a partial trade with the MIMs.

It's all in what you want. I would go MIA over MIM...but then again, now, I probably wouldn't buy a fender. A year ago though, that's all I would buy.

Good luck with your decision!

 

[johnnycat42]

I was in one of the new "Best Buy" stores that are now carrying music equipment. They actually had someone in the store who did setups AND the Geddy Lee Jazz was sitting on the wall new for under $600 on sale. GC may get some more competition soon.