Sometimes you don't have a choice, unless you wish to appear to be a jerkoff to your fans, which I don't.
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Tried the rational discourse approach with some folks. It didn't work with anyone except Joe Nerve. Time for gifs.
you always have a choice,
if people get the impression that im there to hang around and chat after a gig thats their issue my criteria after a gig is how quickly i can pack and get to my car or a cab and im getting better at it by the gig a lot of people prob think i am a jerkoff but what do i have to do with that they can think what they want dont make a difference to me never did never will
OK, well let me rephrase...I choose to have people think I'm not a jerkoff. I actually like most of the folks who come to our shows, although there are a handful I can do without.
Let’s continue.
Joe, here is the deal from the other guy.
I don't defend any particular TB members!
I just tend to express my fundamental beliefs about being a musician/bass player/Entertainer!
How many gigs are you getting a week? A year?
Joe, here is the deal from the other guy.
I don't defend any particular TB members!
I just tend to express my fundamental beliefs about being a musician/bass player/Entertainer!
How many gigs are you getting a week? A year?
From the "other guy".
Joe is one of MILLIONS of musicians in the world, and Joe has his right to express his (ONLY) opinion.
Do you really see JimmyM going around and soliciting hundreds of opinions from the audience like some (like some church offering plate)?
I can tell you numerous stories how a few people from the audience could approach you.
Independently of our wishes/desires (tiredness/boredom/arrogance/etc... - that "interaction with the audience" comes with the "territory".
a lotLet’s continue.
Joe, here is the deal from the other guy.
I don't defend any particular TB members!
I just tend to express my fundamental beliefs about being a musician/bass player/Entertainer!
How many gigs are you getting a week? A year?
edit: slowing it down though need a break
Ok, I'm going to play devil's advocate here instead of a joke. I don't know what I intend to accomplish by doing so. It's early morning, I just woke up, I probably should not be posting this. But this rambling thought occurred to me.
Jimmy's point is that a musician should respect their audience and not assume they are ignorant about music.
The counter argument is that the vast majority of people in the audience don't know much about the nuances of music. They either like it or they don't and few if any can provide meaningful feedback.
For evidence Jimmy offered up the claim that 20 people out of a crowd of 3000 came up to him and commented on his bass tone. By my math that comes out to 0.667%. Now, to be fair, there's an unknown number of folks that noticed, but did not choose to seek out and approach Jimmy to provide feedback. I'm just going to suggest that number may be ten times the original amount (a complete guess based on nothing) which would bring the total up to around 6 or 7%. To further blur the lines Jimmy claims that these were mostly "older" folks. Now, these people have had all their lives to develop musical knowledge and analyze their preferences and their social skills. So I think it's safe to say that this is close to the best case scenario for the phenomenon Jimmy describes to happen. The "average" audience would be somewhat less musical aware. So I'm going to opt for the 6% instead of the 7% as being closer to reality, but I admit there's a pretty big margin of error here since we are talking about things we can't honestly measure.
So by my fuzzy, barely awake logic that's 94% of the audience doesn't know much about the nuances of music and 6% do.
However, that being said. I'm still on Jimmy's side. Because it's not about numbers or being right or wrong. It's about respect.
Your audience is your bread and butter. They essentially are your boss. It's your job to entertain them and make them happy. Happy enough to buy booze in most venues! Bosses and CEO's in many occupations often have very little knowledge or understanding of what their employees actually do. And many employees have little respect for their boss because of it. But they shouldn't because your job is not about feeling understood or appreciated. That's the job of your wife or therapist. An employee who goes around disrespecting his boss is a fool. Nothing good can possibly come from it.
TL;DR: Moral of the story, if you think your audience is ignorant, well you may or may not be right, but keep that negativity to yourself.
Jimmy's point is that a musician should respect their audience and not assume they are ignorant about music.
The counter argument is that the vast majority of people in the audience don't know much about the nuances of music. They either like it or they don't and few if any can provide meaningful feedback.
For evidence Jimmy offered up the claim that 20 people out of a crowd of 3000 came up to him and commented on his bass tone. By my math that comes out to 0.667%. Now, to be fair, there's an unknown number of folks that noticed, but did not choose to seek out and approach Jimmy to provide feedback. I'm just going to suggest that number may be ten times the original amount (a complete guess based on nothing) which would bring the total up to around 6 or 7%. To further blur the lines Jimmy claims that these were mostly "older" folks. Now, these people have had all their lives to develop musical knowledge and analyze their preferences and their social skills. So I think it's safe to say that this is close to the best case scenario for the phenomenon Jimmy describes to happen. The "average" audience would be somewhat less musical aware. So I'm going to opt for the 6% instead of the 7% as being closer to reality, but I admit there's a pretty big margin of error here since we are talking about things we can't honestly measure.
So by my fuzzy, barely awake logic that's 94% of the audience doesn't know much about the nuances of music and 6% do.
However, that being said. I'm still on Jimmy's side. Because it's not about numbers or being right or wrong. It's about respect.
Your audience is your bread and butter. They essentially are your boss. It's your job to entertain them and make them happy. Happy enough to buy booze in most venues! Bosses and CEO's in many occupations often have very little knowledge or understanding of what their employees actually do. And many employees have little respect for their boss because of it. But they shouldn't because your job is not about feeling understood or appreciated. That's the job of your wife or therapist. An employee who goes around disrespecting his boss is a fool. Nothing good can possibly come from it.
TL;DR: Moral of the story, if you think your audience is ignorant, well you may or may not be right, but keep that negativity to yourself.
I'm thinking, if at all possible, and one is awake, it's a positive thing to engage your fans... especially, if they are sober. Probably a little time with the audience ensures a following, instead of one night stands...
... and I guess it doesn't always have to be about the music, either.
I went to an event, where 3 Doors Down was the featured act... I'm sure they were taken care of, financially, but the entire event was free... one of the best concerts I've ever witnessed, as I was about 6-7 rows back, and they brought it... afterward, they stuck around to shake hands, engage in conversation with their fans... I have no idea if they spoke about the bass players tone, or which brand of underwear the guitarist was wearing... I just thought it was cool that they took the time to do it... pretty cool!
Earlier in the year, I played a few gigs on TI flats; I call the resulting scandal "flatsgate." It ended when 8 or 9 regular fans out of a crowd of 100 approached me on set break and told me my bass sound went to crap, a sort of tone intervention, if you will. People do know the difference, especially people who see you all the time. None of these people were musicians. Back to rounds, I went, despite my own personal preference for flats.
yeah just think of ELO, substitute the city for Electric, and they play in Symphony Hall, it all adds up.
Specifically when I found out that Doriot Anthony Dwyer lived where my gf worked, I had a small fanboy meltdown because all my life I heard her ensemble and solo flute playing on TV and radio and never once was there a mistake or even unsure moment. She was the First woman to become the principle chair player for a major orchestra in America. This particular Assisted Living residence is about a mile from Symphony Hall as the crow flies. ...the last piece here is amazing, "Syrinx" solo flute by Debussy
I know your answer already ("I only play a few gigs a year, I'm not a PRO, etc...)
We can find a lot of TB members' opinions about some famous musicians/bass players and how those famous musicians interacted with the TB members.
One of them wrote about seeing/meeting Victor Wooten at some airport and how NICE Victor was even in the "non-concert-wise" (where the audience PAYS money) environment. I'm just trying to imagine if Victor Wooten would have used "your tactics to escape his meeting with the TB member.
Anyway.
I know what it is to play in almost EMPTY venue. I know how I feel if NOBODY in the audience pays attention to our Music, but...
I do not blame the audience.
I always look for answers in my (and my band's) performance.
P.S. I don't want to get into some musician's psychological profile.
All of this.
I’m naturally outgoing, and enjoy mingling with the audience between sets. I always try to be approachable and do more than my share of introducing myself to anyone who is interested. My job as an entertainer doesn’t end at the front of the stage; it continues until I’m driving away at the end of the night.
Our whole band feels the same way.
In about 75% of the venues we play, a green room is available to us, and in about half of those, a runner is provided if we want drinks or food.
We never use them.
Walking around for 20 minutes and shaking hands is an enjoyable way to meet people and frankly, people remember how you treat them as much as they remember your music, which helps to ensure future gigs.
Let me also play that devil's advocate.
I'M SO HAPPY THAT MY MUSIC HAS AUDIENCE!!! (not like some huge empty bedroom space
)Here is my next point.
How many of TB members could go and DANCE while playing the bass like JimmyM?
(Before, anybody tries to answer, please, check some of our "desperate" threads about "how to act on stage").
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