Double Bass 20 year old NS Design CR vs. barely used NXT4a?

[joppo]

Hi Glenn. I think the answer to your question relates to how flexible you are. The NS is similar in that the scale length is the same, but different in that it lacks the reference points of the neck heel and body which help with setting muscle memory and help you play in tune. The NS compensates by putting the intonation markers on so you can always have a sneaky look to make sure you hit the note. I have basses from the tiny Ubass up to a 41 inch stick and have played them enough that I can do a decent job on all off them. The joy for me is I can pick the bass that I think has the best voice for the gig. Other people find changing scale lengths messes with their heads, and I fully appreciate those people who stick with one instrument and truely master it (that’s not me!).

I got an NS cello for the same reason you are thinking of getting a bass. I really enjoyed it and it lead to getting an acoustic cello. I love them both. They are similar but different, and I’m fine going between them. But that decision means I’ll always be an average player on both, and not master the acoustic.

 

[Wasnex]

Hi everyone. In thinking about this little bit more I just have another question, something I would appreciate it if you could clarify for me. I totally understand how an eub can never sound like an acoustic upright, but, when you say that it plays differently, can you please describe how? Is it the physical aspect of not having a body to meet against and feel the notes? Is it the shape of the neck? My logic is, at some point in the future, if this "stick"s, I might consider getting an acoustic upright. Right now I do not want to devote the space and deal with transporting it. So I am figuring an electric would be a good intermediate step. But if it doesn't play anything like an acoustic, then maybe there's no point in this. I would just stick with electric bass at that point.
I'm also being honest with myself, that at this point, I have the money to buy an instrument, but likely not the time to make a full commitment. This could take me years. And that is okay with me, because I don't really have any goals here, it's just looks like something interesting and would be fun to learn. If learning to play an electric upright is truly a waste of time, and I would likely just stick with the electric bass. I don't have any real NEED to do this, it just looks cool and looks like fun.

IMHO the pizz technique and fingering technique you use an a CR4 should be essentially the same as you would use on an acoustic upright. When I say it won't play like an acoustic upright, I mean it won't sound like an acoustic upright. It will have massive sustain and it will sound more like a fretless bass guitar. It does not have the same dynamic thumpy envelope as an acoustic upright. The different way the instrument speaks will impact the touch you use to pull a sound out of the instrument. So there are some subtle aspects of technique an EUB will not expose you to.

Some bow the EUB. I thought my NS Design 6 sounded awful under the bow, but the technique was pretty much the same.

For the record I ordered my bass with the more aggressive string set. Using a set of real upright bass strings will change the sound and feel a bit, but it still would not respond like an acoustic upright.

Also, part of the justification I used to get my organization to the buy the instrument was to help me maintain my upright bass technique. At the time, I was assigned in a cover band where I only played bass guitar. For context, during my career I spent about 50% playing in concert band and big band. The other 50% was in cover bands.

 

[Alfisti]

IMHO the pizz technique and fingering technique you use an a CR4 should be essentially the same as you would use on an acoustic upright. When I say it won't play like an acoustic upright, I mean it won't sound like an acoustic upright. It will have massive sustain and it will sound more like a fretless bass guitar. It does not have the same dynamic thumpy envelope as an acoustic upright. The different way the instrument speaks will impact the touch you use to pull a sound out of the instrument. So there are some subtle aspects of technique an EUB will not expose you to.

Some bow the EUB. I thought my NS Design 6 sounded awful under the bow, but the technique was pretty much the same.

For the record I ordered my bass with the more aggressive string set. Using a set of real upright bass strings will change the sound and feel a bit, but it still would not respond like an acoustic upright.

Also, part of the justification I used to get my organization to the buy the instrument was to help me maintain my upright bass technique. At the time, I was assigned in a cover band where I only played bass guitar. For context, during my career I spent about 50% playing in concert band and big band. The other 50% was in cover bands.

Thanks. that makes total sense. So... Still feels to me like if I can play this reasonably well, I should be able to move to an acoustic easily. Thanks!

 

[Alfisti]

P.s. I'm more likely to want to play rock/rockabilly anyway- so the differences might actually benefit me.

 

[Wasnex]

Thanks. that makes total sense. So... Still feels to me like if I can play this reasonably well, I should be able to move to an acoustic easily. Thanks!

Providing you learn proper technique; IMHO a full-scale EUB should help prepare you to play acoustic upright. Way more than bass guitar at least.

The CR4 neck is even supposed to be contoured like an upright bass. I have not played an NXTa so no idea what the neck is like. However, as an example, the neck on the US Series and EU Series is concave and engages your hand in a different way than a traditional upright bass. I had to build up and maintain different muscles in order to have any endurance.

My perception is that new upright players tend to prefer a thinner neck. However more experienced players often prefer a bit thicker neck. Back when I first started, the thin neck of the Kays felt way better than the thick neck of the King bass we had at my school. But as my hand grew stronger, eventually my preference changed to a bit thicker neck.

 

[Francois Blais]

Thanks. I understand an acoustic is within the budget, but I do not want to have one hanging around the living room and I don't want to take on the care and feeding of a large acoustic instrument... Or have to transport it to lessons.

Which electric would you recommend? I need to stick to the $1500-1700 range.

Thanks

Maybe you could find a second-hand Eminence EUB.

 

[Wasnex]

... Or have to transport it to lessons.

It might be challenging to find someone who will give you upright lesson when you are playing an EUB.

 

[Alfisti]

It might be challenging to find someone who will give you upright lesson when you are playing an EUB.

I never thought of that... Really? Oh boy. I better look around for an instructor. Anyone's know of anyone in central NJ?

 

[DoubleMIDI]

Get an instrument with an endpin and a rigid body support if you want to prepare for a DB.

One thing an EUB is good for is playing with effects units. The acoustically radiated sound of a DB often does not fit to the electrically modified sound which might be strange when practicing.
But I agree that for the same amount of money you get a much better DB than EUB. And all solid body EUBs (and probably even those with small resonance chambers) sound a bit sterile as the body resonance is missing and cannot modulate the string back. Also starting the string with the bow could be a bit more difficult.

For a good DB-oriented EUB you might have a look at the Italian MK EUBs.

 

[eyvindwa]

Hi Glenn. I think the answer to your question relates to how flexible you are. The NS is similar in that the scale length is the same, but different in that it lacks the reference points of the neck heel and body which help with setting muscle memory and help you play in tune. The NS compensates by putting the intonation markers on so you can always have a sneaky look to make sure you hit the note. I have basses from the tiny Ubass up to a 41 inch stick and have played them enough that I can do a decent job on all off them. The joy for me is I can pick the bass that I think has the best voice for the gig. Other people find changing scale lengths messes with their heads, and I fully appreciate those people who stick with one instrument and truely master it (that’s not me!).

I got an NS cello for the same reason you are thinking of getting a bass. I really enjoyed it and it lead to getting an acoustic cello. I love them both. They are similar but different, and I’m fine going between them. But that decision means I’ll always be an average player on both, and not master the acoustic.

I went down a similar path - I really wanted to incorporate arco playing in my songwriting, but the only experience I had was from fretted bass guitar (save for some violin lessons ages ago as a kid, long forgotten). So, I stumbled across the fretted NS Design omnibass. It has a 34" scale length, frets, and can be successfully bowed. I purchased that years ago, and fell in love. I have since transitioned to a fretless version of the omnibass, still with 34" scale length, and I dig it.

Like joppo here, I loved it so much that I just recently ended up getting an NS design cello as well, and that is a great amount of fun too, and I have actually considered getting an acoustic cello down the line (they are less intimidating and more living-room friendly in terms of physical size than the DB )

Anyway, my point is: there are many valid (and fun and thoroughly rewarding!) use cases for an EUB that does not have to be learning how to play the "real" DB.

 

[VictorW126]

Hi everyone. In thinking about this little bit more I just have another question, something I would appreciate it if you could clarify for me. I totally understand how an eub can never sound like an acoustic upright, but, when you say that it plays differently, can you please describe how? Is it the physical aspect of not having a body to meet against and feel the notes? Is it the shape of the neck? My logic is, at some point in the future, if this "stick"s, I might consider getting an acoustic upright. Right now I do not want to devote the space and deal with transporting it. So I am figuring an electric would be a good intermediate step. But if it doesn't play anything like an acoustic, then maybe there's no point in this. I would just stick with electric bass at that point.
I'm also being honest with myself, that at this point, I have the money to buy an instrument, but likely not the time to make a full commitment. This could take me years. And that is okay with me, because I don't really have any goals here, it's just looks like something interesting and would be fun to learn. If learning to play an electric upright is truly a waste of time, and I would likely just stick with the electric bass. I don't have any real NEED to do this, it just looks cool and looks like fun.

1 good solution: Yamaha eub


2 Intersting story for you
My Story -- Everybody has one

 

[Alfisti]

1 good solution: Yamaha eub


2 Intersting story for you
My Story -- Everybody has one

That story is GREAT. Thanks for sharing.

 

[Dana R Gregory]

My first concern with any used bass is the condition of the neck, especially one that is 20 years old. What is the condition of the truss rod and does it have any adjustment left in it? If not, then you are looking at a very expensive repair. You might be better off with a newer instrument. Good luck on what ever you decide.

 

[Alfisti]

thanks, everyone. I bought the NXTa, which is less than a year old. It's "as new" and I'm happy. Big hill to climb now to learn to play it, but that's why we're here!

 

[BassFalcon]

Hi Glenn. I think the answer to your question relates to how flexible you are. The NS is similar in that the scale length is the same, but different in that it lacks the reference points of the neck heel and body which help with setting muscle memory and help you play in tune. The NS compensates by putting the intonation markers on so you can always have a sneaky look to make sure you hit the note. I have basses from the tiny Ubass up to a 41 inch stick and have played them enough that I can do a decent job on all off them. The joy for me is I can pick the bass that I think has the best voice for the gig. Other people find changing scale lengths messes with their heads, and I fully appreciate those people who stick with one instrument and truely master it (that’s not me!).

I got an NS cello for the same reason you are thinking of getting a bass. I really enjoyed it and it lead to getting an acoustic cello. I love them both. They are similar but different, and I’m fine going between them. But that decision means I’ll always be an average player on both, and not master the acoustic.

you can add a heel.
Bass Thumbstop Neck Heel Rest - NS Design