6 String guitarists dictating the bass lines..do they get it?

[MVE]

compromise, talk about it, see things from different angles. After that, find a new band.

This!
Maybe suggest to play a few songs his way and a few songs the way you want to play them.
Ask other members of the band for thier imput as well. Ie. If you and the guitar player disagree about how to play a specific part, ask the singer which way they prefer.

 

[mdlewis]

I think most of us have been here. You're not going to change your guitarist. You have to decide if you can handle his vision of the music or find someone else to play with. I once played with a BL who decided that he preferred the Gary Busey versions (from the movie) of Buddy Holly songs to the original. Wasn't so bad for the bass, but the guitarist, who was quite reasonable, almost quit on the spot. This BL was a drummer, and managed to suck ALL of the soul out of just about any song we played. I played one gig to to give it my best and then quit.

 

[ArtechnikA]

Either you or the guitar player needs to exit. This will not get better.

Yup. I've played the "him or me" card exactly once. You must be prepared to walk. I figure you get to play this card once per project - use it wisely.
Up to that point, I mentioned directly to the person, 'this may not be the right project for you.'

 

[Koog]

If it is your band, let him go. If not, leave. Life is too short to add another frustration, especially doing something you love.

 

[mcnach]

I am in the midst of starting up a band.
Having issues with my guitarist.
He is very rigid and demands I play very simple bass lines.
To the point, I am getting very frustrated.
If I try to add some colour by playing walk up notes to the root, he has a fit.
He demands I just pound the root note.
We are all in our 50’s and 60’s and this is more of a hobby band, with hopes Of playing play local pubs, picnics, etc when get enough songs together.
I discussed this with my bass teacher and his opinion was..
If you are paying me,
I will play it the way you wish.
If not, then, I will play it the way I think it should be.
He also commented that this attitude is common with guitar players.
My thoughts are...
I am bored pounding the root note, it’s not challenging me.
I want the chance to add some colour.
I am not trying play over everyone and be the star.
Any thoughts..

It doesn't sound like fun: get rid off him.
I agree with your teacher. I've played in bands where I didn't 100% enjoy what I was doing, but the money was a good compensation. If there's no (or not enough) money involved, then I do it for my enjoyment. Why would you spend so much time, effort... and also money! if you're not having a good time?

Get rid off him. There's guitarists under every other stone. Find people you get along with musically.

 

[Fingerer]

Is he being nice about his "demands," or is he a douche? If it's the latter, then someone might have to go.

If he is nice about his demands, then I would record the rehearsals and ask him to point out where he thinks you are going off topic. He might be hearing something you're not and he doesn't know how to precisely articulate his thoughts. Get the rest of the band's input. I would also have your teacher give it a listen and make suggestions.

Because of your ages, you should remember what it was like when people actually had polite discussions about your differences instead of the "I'm right, you're wrong" approach we have today. Have a beer, or a few tokes, and talk it out.

I started out on guitar back in the 80s. I personally loved it when bass players (or anyone) went off script (within reason). Those people challenged me to be a better musician. There were a few bass players who inspired me to make the switch.

Good luck!

 

[bassliner50]

Network yourself. Meet other musicians (especially pianists if you can find them). Collaborate with all. Then re assess your present frustrations.

 

[bearfoot]

My 2 cents is to make sure you don't get personal. The discussion is going to get a little heated. I predict a higher chance it's the guitarist who quits when confronted.
But if you confront the behavior, and not the person, you know same old adage about hating the sin not the sinner. That actually works.
Make sure you say some really true praises of his playing before you get to the BUT - I gotta tell you man - hurts me to say this but --

and then say what you have to say, and don't back off or water it down. even if it gets loud, don't call him a jerk or anything like that. If he falls into namecalling, that signals he's lost the argument and knows it. The conversation has to stop at that point, or it may well escalate. But don't give in! This is not an unreasonable request that you have!

Like most rock musicians, you don't want to play note-for-note off a chart, nor be dictated to do so. We all get this. If it's "Day Tripper", you play the riff, obviously. But you don't have to do every hammer-on exactly like Paul. And if the song has no iconic riff in the bassline, you have no obligation to play what was on the record.

Chances are, the guitarist has a school band / orchestra background, and this is a common thing. In college , our musicianship training was brutal. You're flat for 0.04 seconds, some student is going to say "FLAT!" Miss a few notes in wind ensemble, the conductor stops the whole train and berates the whole ensemble for not learning their parts before rehearsal. And we loved him for it. He brought us to higher levels of excellence in that context.

But classic rock covers are NOT orchestra. That attitude has no place in rock and roll, quite honestly.

I truly believe that if you have an adult conversation, this will be resolved, and everyone will respect one another more afterwards. I also believe in unicorns.

 

[nilorius]

No one can say exactly how to play your bass lines. You should consider it yourself, but if you want to be a little bit visible, add a bit, but don't overload the song with bass partitures.

 

[Ostie]

I play in a trio where the communication is good. I will say things like “have you thought about playing it this way? Or “what would it sound like if we did it like this”. If I have positive feedback I will give it, but I would never say “you must play it like this.” I wouldn’t put up with it unless the guitarist was Eric Clapton. And I don’t mean that he thinks he’s Eric Clapton.

 

[Frank77]

Douche-tarists are a thing (and a common one at that). I've met them in every genre, of any age.

Once you find one you enjoy working with, who doesn't insist on playing insanely loud and who accepts taking the backseat when it benefits the song/band, never let him/her go. It took me almost 20 years to find mine.

 

[fhm555]

As long as you goal is to serve the song(s), there is a simple solution, complain about his playing. Doesn’t need to be a valid complaint, just gripe about his playing, find fault with his work on every song and make a point to stop rehearsal and chide him about it.
One of two things will happen, he will get the message and STFU with his whining, or he will rage quit, and as everyone knows, guitarists are common as milkweed so a replacement shouldn’t be a problem.
Otherwise you can obey or quit, but you are not going to shut him up trying to be logical because there is (apparently) no logic in his complaints so it is foolhardy to expect him to respond to logic.

 

[Londo Molari]

 

[sean_on_bass]

Overplaying...I am hardly playing.
I am not playing the wrong notes.
And that is not his complaint.
Songs include..
Brass In Pocket..
Ho Hey
Peaceful Easy Feeling

We are not talking Intrucate arrangements here.

True, we are not, which unfortunately supports the guitarists critiques. Are you doing something different/more busy than the recorded versions of these songs? Brass in Pocket unfortunately does have largely rhythmic root notes with a transitional fill or part between logical 4 and 8 bar phrases. Peaceful Easy Feeling is largely root five playing, again with the occasional fill or transitional part at logical points. I'd really have to hear what you are doing to determine if you are overplaying these tunes. If you are new to playing and trying to add your own "flair" it might be sounding a little messy and not tasteful. But who knows, i'm not there.

I can at least say then when i was at 18 months on the bass guitar, i likely would not have done these songs justice. These tunes actually require a bit of subtlety to nail even though they sound easy on the surface.

 

[bikeplate]

Find another groups of people to play with.

 

[phillipkregg]

I've had this experience pop up several times in classic rock bands.

My solution, I quit playing in classic rock bands and started playing in jazz ensembles. In jazz the guitarist usually has a hard enough time trying to comp and they have no idea how to construct walking bass lines.

 

[shwashwa]

I am playing the lines on the record.
He demands very sparse drumming and bass.
I am thinking about quitting but..
I live in a relatively small town so I am afraid it will be difficult
to find another band to play with.
Being relatively new to the bass (18 months), It is still a positive situation for my growth.

you're outside toronto... probably a million people to play with..

 

[sean_on_bass]

I've had this experience pop up several times in classic rock bands.

My solution, I quit playing in classic rock bands and started playing in jazz ensembles. In jazz the guitarist usually has a hard enough time trying to comp and they have no idea how to construct walking bass lines.

Same. I've never had a jazz guitarist tell me how to play, or any other members of the band. In jazz you just do your thing, and people just need to decide if they like it. If you don't like the way i do my thing, just don't call me back. Likewise, if i don't like the way you play/act i will stop accepting your bookings.

 

[RustyAxe]

I haven't read the thread, just responding to the OP. I am a bassist and a guitarist/vocalist ... and yes, I "get it", probably more than others. Unlike your guitarist I won't tell the bassist what to play, but if you aren't contributing to the whole in a meaningful way, I'll be looking for another bass player. I've been on both sides of the issue, too. If there's no payday, I don't much care what the guitarist thinks, but if he's telling me what to play I'll be looking for new opportunities. If I'm getting paid by the BL, then whatever the man asks for is what I'll endeavor to deliver.

I've said it here on TB before, and I've actually done this ... when the critic tries to tell you what to play, hand him your bass and say "show me". That usually shuts 'em up, at least for that session. I had a bassist do that to me ... once ... because I grabbed his bass and showed him.

 

[rtav]

In every band I've ever been in, the final say was down to the person who wrote the song/section, etc. Their composition is their vision of what it should sound like and I respect that. I might have a suggestion or an idea to change it, but at the end of the day the composer wins no matter what instrument they happen to have at the moment.

It's not an ego thing at all. It's respect for the composer's vision as they wrote it and want it to be played.

Now if it gets excessively out of step with what I expect to be playing (all bass parts are being dumbed down to roots and fourths for instance), I would say something and if it continued, I'd write my own stuff or leave (btdt).