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A small dispute over returning a bass
- Thread starter WarriorJoe7
- Start date
- Status
If for any reason I bought a used bass and wasn't happy (esp. if I thought it was damaged goods) I would gladly pay shipping both ways to return it.
Having dealt with similar situations on both sides before, I 100% agree with the seller here and did from the original post. A potential $30 fix is no big deal, especially when it's fret buzz.... I've set up a bass perfectly then had to leave it in the trunk during a humid Baltimore summer for a work day and it buzzed like hell when I went to rehearsal that night. Even if the issue was something other than buzz, the buyer was way too premature in making such an issue.
I do my own setups too, but for more extreme things I don't want to tackle, like fret levels/crowns, I take it in to the shop, and they only charge me $35 for it.
IIRC Joe has been on the end of a couple of public transaction "issues" on TB in recent history that I can remember (IIRC there is a thread in the lobby and another in OT). Perhaps this thread is a reminder for people to leave honest feedback when buying and selling so people have a good idea as to how past transactions went.
If you guys are open to suggestion for a reasonable solution I say that you both split the cost of getting a local luthier to look at this. If the guy says its an issue with the bass, Joe gets his refund if its merely a set-up issue Joe pays what he owes the seller plus the cost of having it looked it. As the luthier is a third party he shouldn't have any trouble making an honest assesment.
If you guys are open to suggestion for a reasonable solution I say that you both split the cost of getting a local luthier to look at this. If the guy says its an issue with the bass, Joe gets his refund if its merely a set-up issue Joe pays what he owes the seller plus the cost of having it looked it. As the luthier is a third party he shouldn't have any trouble making an honest assesment.
I had this site for a long time and some up here have used it.
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If I didn't misrepresent anything, then yes, the buyer takes care of both ways.
Was the bass misrepresented? Tough to tell, but I haven't had a bass older than 75 that didn't need something to make it have buttery action. Action in my cases, three of them need a shim to get the action where I liked it.
One time I sold an MTD and said it was in immaculate condition, my words. No questions were asked, buyer bought it. Buyer got it and said there was one mark on the back the size of a fine pencil tip, and I don't mean the size of all the graphite you would have if you sharpened it. He wanted his money back, and I had to eat the time and shipping.
I don't ever say mint anymore, nor did I in that instance. Complete waste of my time, next buyer was thrilled.
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If I didn't misrepresent anything, then yes, the buyer takes care of both ways.
Was the bass misrepresented? Tough to tell, but I haven't had a bass older than 75 that didn't need something to make it have buttery action. Action in my cases, three of them need a shim to get the action where I liked it.
One time I sold an MTD and said it was in immaculate condition, my words. No questions were asked, buyer bought it. Buyer got it and said there was one mark on the back the size of a fine pencil tip, and I don't mean the size of all the graphite you would have if you sharpened it. He wanted his money back, and I had to eat the time and shipping.
I don't ever say mint anymore, nor did I in that instance. Complete waste of my time, next buyer was thrilled.
Dr Funk
"If you ain't appearing then you be disappearing"
I just read the complaint that Joe filed with PayPal it's for $50 more refund. With the same misrepresentation bologna.
I took $100 off the price of the bass, gave him a new TKL gig bag (was never in the deal it was no case) but I felt better about shipping it and figured he could use it. Then I carried a $50 balance for him for a few weeks. Now he wants $50 more. Just too much this kid. :scowl:
I took $100 off the price of the bass, gave him a new TKL gig bag (was never in the deal it was no case) but I felt better about shipping it and figured he could use it. Then I carried a $50 balance for him for a few weeks. Now he wants $50 more. Just too much this kid. :scowl:
Quadzilla
Supporting Member
I must admit that I'm a bit shocked that this can't be worked out. Seems like this is down to a squabble over +/- $50 and some pride on both sides. Lotta drama and that makes both of you look bad to a lot of people here.
So do one of two things and call it a day:
1 - Joe returns the bass. If the bass does not work for ya Joe, I guess give in and pay for the shipping both ways (as much as that sucks). Still better than having a bass that is not for you.
OR
2 -Funk - pay for a fret level (+/- $50 - $70) but I would be sure to include the clause that there are NO RETURNS after this no matter how the bass turns out after the work.
Come to an agreement and move on guys. I've been there, but have always been able to work it out.
Fred
So do one of two things and call it a day:
1 - Joe returns the bass. If the bass does not work for ya Joe, I guess give in and pay for the shipping both ways (as much as that sucks). Still better than having a bass that is not for you.
OR
2 -Funk - pay for a fret level (+/- $50 - $70) but I would be sure to include the clause that there are NO RETURNS after this no matter how the bass turns out after the work.
Come to an agreement and move on guys. I've been there, but have always been able to work it out.
Fred
Joe,
You bought a used bass sight unseen without playing it. You shouldn't have purchased it if you were not willing to live with the consequences of the purchase, and unless the seller lied outright, the burden is on you. You should have fully expected it to need a little work to get it where you are happy. Expecting it to be perfect is a recipe for disappointment. If all it needs is a trussrod adjustment or even a fret leveling but is otherwise fine, then consider yourself pretty lucky, as it is a very nice bass.
Just chalk this one up as one of life's little lessons that will pay off for you in the future. You posted on here looking for support, but it seems you didn't really get the kind of response you hoped for. The reason many who have replied to this post have sided with the seller is because with age and experience comes wisdom, giving one a better perspective on life. Many of us have been through similar experiences, and although at the time we were as mad as you are, we can now look back and see the bigger picture and lessons learned and are trying to share that with you, but you don't seem to want to listen. Your perspective seems a bit short-sided, and the way you are going about things now shows a lack of maturity. I'm sorry to sound mean, but I've been down this road a long time ago, and I only wish I had several people to help me work through it like this back then.
The deal is done, and you have the bass already. You bought it for a reason, so why give up on it? You're on your way to loosing some money for shipping if you send it back and will have nothing to show for it, so do yourself a favor and just use that money to get the bass dialed in by a luthier and then enjoy it, as it will be an awesome axe. Frankly, I'd recommend taking it in to be checked out even if it did play with minimal buzzing. Being vindictive and filing a complaint without first giving the seller a chance to make good is not the way to do business. Frankly, I feel he doesn't owe you anything, as a deal is a deal, but if he was going to give you anything to make you happy, then he is going above and beyond in my book.
You bought a used bass sight unseen without playing it. You shouldn't have purchased it if you were not willing to live with the consequences of the purchase, and unless the seller lied outright, the burden is on you. You should have fully expected it to need a little work to get it where you are happy. Expecting it to be perfect is a recipe for disappointment. If all it needs is a trussrod adjustment or even a fret leveling but is otherwise fine, then consider yourself pretty lucky, as it is a very nice bass.
Just chalk this one up as one of life's little lessons that will pay off for you in the future. You posted on here looking for support, but it seems you didn't really get the kind of response you hoped for. The reason many who have replied to this post have sided with the seller is because with age and experience comes wisdom, giving one a better perspective on life. Many of us have been through similar experiences, and although at the time we were as mad as you are, we can now look back and see the bigger picture and lessons learned and are trying to share that with you, but you don't seem to want to listen. Your perspective seems a bit short-sided, and the way you are going about things now shows a lack of maturity. I'm sorry to sound mean, but I've been down this road a long time ago, and I only wish I had several people to help me work through it like this back then.
The deal is done, and you have the bass already. You bought it for a reason, so why give up on it? You're on your way to loosing some money for shipping if you send it back and will have nothing to show for it, so do yourself a favor and just use that money to get the bass dialed in by a luthier and then enjoy it, as it will be an awesome axe. Frankly, I'd recommend taking it in to be checked out even if it did play with minimal buzzing. Being vindictive and filing a complaint without first giving the seller a chance to make good is not the way to do business. Frankly, I feel he doesn't owe you anything, as a deal is a deal, but if he was going to give you anything to make you happy, then he is going above and beyond in my book.
This bass has gone through some pretty heavy climate/humidity changes lately, going all the way from Florida up to almost Canada. My first thought would be that a simple truss rod adjustment is in order. At the very least, I would try making this simple adjustment before escalating the dispute any further (and certainly before having any fret work done).
Just my 2¢.
Just my 2¢.
My understanding of the OP's situation is that the bass, as received, was as described except that it arrived with fret buzz. Kind of a no brainer to get a setup, especially if a fellow TB'r already told you there was no fret buzz when he shipped it.
For $30, IMO, it's not worth my time to fight over such a small amount. I'd have taken the money and applied to a setup. And not waiting for the bass to be checked out by a luthier was really jumping the gun as far as filing complaints and such, especially only 3 days after receiving the bass.
Don't forget that the shipping company used a plane to get the bass to NY. What's the temp at 35k feet in an unheated cargo plane? Heck, the bass could have been on more than one plane, subject to weather conditions/extremes wherever it landed. So not only could there be extremes in temp from the shipping/receiving locations, the flight temps could add another variable to the mix.
I also suggest waiting at least 2 or 3 days to let the instrument settle (w/o adjustment). IMO, the buyer should expect to have a professional setup done to adjust the instrument to their standards and include the price of the setup in the total expected cost of the purchase.
FWIW, maybe a video posted on youtube of the bass being played might alleviate some of the issues that come up when you can't play the bass before buying it.
TB has a thread on taking better pictures of your instruments: http://www.talkbass.com/forum/showthread.php?t=485495
Doesn't necessarily apply here but may be helpful to future sellers.
According to previous transactions I've completed on eBay, the buyer covers shipping both ways for returns.
For $30, IMO, it's not worth my time to fight over such a small amount. I'd have taken the money and applied to a setup. And not waiting for the bass to be checked out by a luthier was really jumping the gun as far as filing complaints and such, especially only 3 days after receiving the bass.
Don't forget that the shipping company used a plane to get the bass to NY. What's the temp at 35k feet in an unheated cargo plane? Heck, the bass could have been on more than one plane, subject to weather conditions/extremes wherever it landed. So not only could there be extremes in temp from the shipping/receiving locations, the flight temps could add another variable to the mix.
I also suggest waiting at least 2 or 3 days to let the instrument settle (w/o adjustment). IMO, the buyer should expect to have a professional setup done to adjust the instrument to their standards and include the price of the setup in the total expected cost of the purchase.
FWIW, maybe a video posted on youtube of the bass being played might alleviate some of the issues that come up when you can't play the bass before buying it.
TB has a thread on taking better pictures of your instruments: http://www.talkbass.com/forum/showthread.php?t=485495
Doesn't necessarily apply here but may be helpful to future sellers.
According to previous transactions I've completed on eBay, the buyer covers shipping both ways for returns.
LilRay
Commercial User
- Dec 27, 2007
- 4,166
- 39
- Disclosures
- Owner: Cockeyed Cow Custom Leathercraft
Musician's Friend (in my experience) pays for the shipping if you send it back. My brother in law purchased a Tele from them about a year ago and didn't like it. He had 30 days to return it. It had a return shipping label in the box. Same thing with Amazon as well.
I'm not saying I side with one or the other, but in my limited experience with Musician's Friend, they actually refunded the full amount.
BurningSkies
CRAZY BALDHEAD
- Feb 20, 2005
- 27,956
- 20,350
- Disclosures
- Endorsing artist: Dingwall Guitars
I got ripped off with someone selling an amp with the "all sales final" bit. They shipped the amp unprotected in a cardboard box. Tubes destroyed, transformer ripped out, etc. When I called them on it guess what they told me? ASF! All to save a couple of bucks for a oversized box and some bubble wrap.
They do it without a gun!
IME, if you buy something "All sales final, no returns", get it in writing how it will be packed, shipped and insured. Get close up pictures from every angle and the seller's statement that it is working condition or not. Or their statement as to what problems the item has. I've also bought items where the camera was just far enough away from the item and the picture was quality was such that it hid a multitude of sins. Ask for macro pictures. If none are forth coming, run the other way. Get the return policy in writing, whether it's and individual or business. Both should have one.
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