+1 Other than the low end extension, I'm not hearing much similarity between my FullRange and my old B210's. The more aggressive midrange response, and the stronger treble response is an entirely different thing.
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Acme Full Range Series III 112
- Thread starter KJung
- Start date
+1 Other than the low end extension, I'm not hearing much similarity between my FullRange and my old B210's. The more aggressive midrange response, and the stronger treble response is an entirely different thing.
Hey Ken, great review. I am running a streamliner 900 and these cabs have really peaked my interest. Do you find the lows unwieldy at all? If memory serves me, you used to run a bag end s15 stack, a pair of these would be replacing the same stack. The acmes have a much lower sensitivity, but I am assuming that their drivers also have a much higher displacement. Would this lead to a higher overall spl output over the bags or just better low end extension? I play rock and like to dial in a fair amount of low mid punch, do you feel that these cabs would work?
Hello. In my opinion, you would get massively more low end from a stack of these versus your Bag Ends, but you would not get an overall increase in volume. The Bags are very mid voiced, and as a result, really high SPL, so they are very loud, and nice and punchy/tight.
These, as you suggest, are low overall SPL since all that power is going to crank out that big low end.
Regarding your question about the low end, it is quite manageable, and punchy and fat all at the same time. A fullrange/flatwound stack with the Streamliner 900 would be pretty awesome (especially with a P Bass) for a really fat tone, and IMO it would be loud enough for most gigs with the Streamliner.
Jazzdogg
Less barking, more wagging!
Just when I was thinking a Thunderchild would be my next cab...
...what does your spidey-sense tell you about a fullrange/flatwound stack being pushed by an iAmp800, Ken?
Ken thinks the super-deep, super-wide voicing of the iAmp, combined with the super-deep, super-wide voicing of the Acmes, would probably amount to "too much of a good thing".
Right, Ken?
MM
Would you expect the overall volume to decrease, or stay similar?
I am in fact playing a P bass with chromes(flats) which is why I am especially interested in this stack.
When running my bags with a LMIII they would start to compress before the volume got to noon, and I found myself looking for a bit more (only on very loud stages). I havent gigged the streamliner through them yet, as it has been pushing an 810. I am still searching for a light loud low modular stack that will fit my needs and mate well with my Pbass and streamliner.
OK, I've just gotta jump in here...
Based solely on what I've gathered from Ken's input in this thread, plus the extensive information in the two-three other Acme Flatwound/Full Range threads floating around here - mostly from TalkBasser Bluesy Soul - it seems very clear that if you're strictly a "P Bass with flats" kind of player - and you're using Streamliner 900 too - that the Streamliner + dual Acme Flatwounds might just be your dream rig.
Almost certainly you're not going to need the upper mids & highs that the Full Range provides - because your P Bass is unlikely to ever generate that information in the first place. As for volume, it really ought to be ample for any venue seating up to 500-600 people or so...even without bass in the PA. And if you're in the PA, of course, then your rig poses no limitations to being heard in the house anyway...
By all means, probe away; get more opinions, complete your due diligence, etc. But once you finally circle around from all of that, you may just find that this one was the ideal rig for you all along...
MM
OK, I've just gotta jump in here...
Based solely on what I've gathered from Ken's input in this thread, plus the extensive information in the two-three other Acme Flatwound/Full Range threads floating around here - mostly from TalkBasser Bluesy Soul - it seems very clear that if you're strictly a "P Bass with flats" kind of player - and you're using Streamliner 900 too - that the Streamliner + dual Acme Flatwounds might just be your dream rig.
By all means, probe away; get more opinions, complete your due diligence, etc. But once you finally circle around from all of that, you may just find that this one was the ideal rig for you all along...
MM
It just may be. I have read every post from every thread, but $500-600 a pop is alot of coin (at least for me) to throw at a cab that may not have enough output to carry my gigs(even x 2). I have yet to find anyone who is playing the acmes in a rock setting competing against 2 100 watt half stacks. They may be out there, I just haven't caught any posts saying as much. It almost seems like I would be asking too much for just 2 12s to keep up, but a man can dream!
I believe acme has a 2 week trial period(minus return shipping), but I still wouldn't be able to try it in a gig context.
Well, since you put it that way...
It seems your problem isn't a sound coverage problem. It's a "wild guitard" problem...
No, this isn't the optimum solution if you need massive volume in a rock context. If you can't prevail upon them to swap out their 100-watt amps for a more reasonable 50-watt amp per guitard, then I guess you're just going to have to ramp up (amp up?) your own arsenal...
A pity that these kinds of situations so often deteriorate into a brute "arms race"...
MM
It seems your problem isn't a sound coverage problem. It's a "wild guitard" problem...
No, this isn't the optimum solution if you need massive volume in a rock context. If you can't prevail upon them to swap out their 100-watt amps for a more reasonable 50-watt amp per guitard, then I guess you're just going to have to ramp up (amp up?) your own arsenal...
A pity that these kinds of situations so often deteriorate into a brute "arms race"...
MM
Jazzdogg
Less barking, more wagging!
<SNIP> a cab that may not have enough output to carry my gigs(even x 2). I have yet to find anyone who is playing the acmes in a rock setting competing against 2 100 watt half stacks. They may be out there, I just haven't caught any posts saying as much. It almost seems like I would be asking too much for just 2 12s to keep up, but a man can dream!
I share your concern that two low-sensitivity 1X12 drivers may not deliver enough loud & clean SPL for the occasional high volume outdoor gig on 5-string electric.
After reading several TB accounts of Acme 10" cabs with creased cones, I'm waiting for good reports about gig worthiness before I plunge in.
My dream is to sell all of my cabs except two that can handle any DB or electric gig I'm likely to play. Haven't found 'em yet, but I'm willing to continue the search.
I gigged the wonderful LMII for a couple years as my primary gigging head. The volume of the LMII is pretty much at maximum with the master at noon and the input gain set optimally (i.e., just below the clip light comes on). So, the compression you are hearing at those very loud volumes might very much be coming from that head.
A first step MIGHT be to try a more powerful head with your current stack (Streamliner, Genz Shuttle Max 9.2, GK MB800, or whatever).
I share your concern that two low-sensitivity 1X12 drivers may not deliver enough loud & clean SPL for the occasional high volume outdoor gig on 5-string electric.
After reading several TB accounts of Acme 10" cabs with creased cones, I'm waiting for good reports about gig worthiness before I plunge in.
My dream is to sell all of my cabs except two that can handle any DB or electric gig I'm likely to play. Haven't found 'em yet, but I'm willing to continue the search.
I don't get the sense that the 12's will have the same issues as the original 10's, but of course, I have no data on that at this point. I'm going to really push the cab (within reason) next weekend on a gig to get a feel for what it can do. I've done similar gigs with the Thunderchild and a single Acme 210, so I'll at least have a better feel with your concern, which is a valid one. I'll post up!
Ken thinks the super-deep, super-wide voicing of the iAmp, combined with the super-deep, super-wide voicing of the Acmes, would probably amount to "too much of a good thing".
Right, Ken?
MM
Interstingly, that is EXACTLY what I would have thought with the Streamliner, which is also quite big down low, but the low end voicing of the Acme seems to be able to use that low end without getting tubby. So, the EA combo might be great. I would be more worried about the very clean and, to some, somewhat clinical midrange and top end of the EA with the FullRange, which is pretty transparent and ungforgiving up top. The Streamliner is very 'sweet' way up top... warm and organic.
Well, since you put it that way...
It seems your problem isn't a sound coverage problem. It's a "wild guitard" problem...
No, this isn't the optimum solution if you need massive volume in a rock context. If you can't prevail upon them to swap out their 100-watt amps for a more reasonable 50-watt amp per guitard, then I guess you're just going to have to ramp up (amp up?) your own arsenal...
A pity that these kinds of situations so often deteriorate into a brute "arms race"...
MM
+1 There is a reason that the guys playing in those sort of contexts use those big sealed 810 cabs. If you try to compete with that massive volume with true, deep low end, you are going to lose (short of using a massive rig).
My gut feel is that the OP would be better off with an amp with a touch more headroom with his current, punchy, mid voiced cabs if 'absolute maximum volume' was the primary goal. It is a amazing how much power those little Bag Ends can actually use, and again, my bet is he can get a few more DB out of them with a different head, which MIGHT solve (or at least help) with is absolute volume issue. Since the LMII would not be optimal to power the Acme stack anyway, he wouldn't be 'out' anything if he eventually decided to try the FullRange/FlatWound stack.
You may be right about the compression I was hearing coming from the LMIII. I ran the STL through the bags and I didn't hear the same thing even when I was pouring the watts on ( the bass was dialed back, but still took pretty much all I could give it). Really my only gripe with the bags was the lack of true low end and the seem to be finicky on placement in relation to the port. If its too far from a wall I get VERY little bottom, and outdoors with no back wall is even worse. I was hoping these cabs could solve that problem and I could dump the 810 and the bags. 
You may be right about the compression I was hearing coming from the LMIII. I ran the STL through the bags and I didn't hear the same thing even when I was pouring the watts on ( the bass was dialed back, but still took pretty much all I could give it). Really my only gripe with the bags was the lack of true low end and the seem to be finicky on placement in relation to the port. If its too far from a wall I get VERY little bottom, and outdoors with no back wall is even worse. I was hoping these cabs could solve that problem and I could dump the 810 and the bags.
You might be able to. There is just no way of knowing, since one person's loud is another person's soft.
I'm pretty sure that the Acme stack with the Streamliner900 would be as loud as your Bag End stack with the LMII, and with more low end. Just not sure it would be louder, but it SURELY would be lower and less compressed in the low end.
I guess the only way to tell will be to bite the bullet and put in an order. Would a side by side comparison with one s15 work? The coupling effect of two acmes should be just as much as the two bags I would think. I will probably just order one to start incase I don't care for the result.
Jazzdogg
Less barking, more wagging!
