Agreed, fretless with lines feels « weird » to me.
But to each their own I guess.
Just don’t bring a fretless to big band practice and it ends up being a sight reading session of new charts.
Been there, still hurts.
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Ambient/Post-Rock/Textural bass playing thread
- Thread starter ttasselm
- Start date
But to each their own I guess.
Just don’t bring a fretless to big band practice and it ends up being a sight reading session of new charts.
Been there, still hurts.
I've never even played one, but I suspect it would feel weird to me, too. Yeah, but whatever works and who the hell cares what Jaco did, right?
I’m huge Jaco fan, he could make anything sound good during his prime.
Fretless has always been a « side project » since I haven’t had many opportunities to play it live.
Loud stages and correct intonation is one of the hardest things I’ve ever « tried » to pull off. Add lousy monitoring and it’s a recipe for disaster. Good thing crust punks and metal boneheads can’t hear $h!t
Still waiting on that R n B soul band my karma has probably earned me!!!
Maybe I should dedicate a few months this year strictly on fretless??
Well then why didn't he?
Just kidding. He certainly had talent. But I hate his tone, don't like his music, and in general I never liked the sound of fretless electric.
I'd rather listen to CCR. Now give me a minute to put on my flameproof suit...
I felt a great disturbance in TalkBass, as if millions of voices suddenly cried out in terror...
When I was but a wee lad 20 something who wanted to play fusion and prog but at that point had blues chops and not much more, Jaco blew the doors off for me. I liked his tone, and the first 10 years of me playing fretless was me struggling with me continuously emulating him.Well then why didn't he?
Just kidding. He certainly had talent. But I hate his tone, don't like his music, and in general I never liked the sound of fretless electric.
I'd rather listen to CCR. Now give me a minute to put on my flameproof suit...
I have a more nuanced perspective of him now. I think he was a great player, I don't think he was the 'best' by any metric, and I've always been somewhat baffled by the props he got as an innovator, as though Stanley Clarke and a few others weren't already pushing the limits of what one could do on a bass. Percy Jones, anybody?
I've heard all of his work, and compositionally/productionwise, I really dislike a lot of it. I remember hearing the hype over WP's Heavy Weather and it sounded like smooth jazz to me. Might be sacrilege in some parts, but Birdland is pure cheese (even though the harmonics are cool). I like what Alphonso Johnson did in WP more, actually.
I really used to be into the J-bass fretless tone. I like a little more meat now, so that's why I have that Stingray coming. I'm more into people like Mick Karn. Steve Bailey, Michael Manring and folks like that who just sound so damn unique and don't have a bunch of imitators.
You're not alone. Never had one, never will. The Stingray will always be Leo's greatest invention, and nothing touches my Wal, by the way.
Should I start a "Noise freaks and ambient weirdos dissing P's and Jaco" thread? Probably make the hot 10 pretty quickly.
There was a time where I might have wanted a J but that's way in the past. I like bigass humbuckers.
All good by me if people don’t like Jaco but at least recognition is given.
I don’t really care about best or whatever, I just think he did some really cool stuff. His self titled album imo is still beautiful to me.
I’ll gladly take the loser that uses a P bass 99% of the time among the regulars over here. But I smack it like it owes me money and use it pretty « weird » ways.
And no CCR!!!!!!!
Jazz bass sounds really thin to me now.
On mine I play neck pickup only or both pups when playing hip hop or soul/rnb
Addendum
My fretless is a jazz, if I dig in and out major time in it I will definitely mod.
With what… have no idea.
Single P and leave open hole in the bridge probaby
Not a joke btw
I guess we I feel the same about the Stingray as you the P bass
It was my main for about 5years but never got it to work for me
@lordradish
I don’t really care about best or whatever, I just think he did some really cool stuff. His self titled album imo is still beautiful to me.
I’ll gladly take the loser that uses a P bass 99% of the time among the regulars over here. But I smack it like it owes me money and use it pretty « weird » ways.
And no CCR!!!!!!!
Jazz bass sounds really thin to me now.
On mine I play neck pickup only or both pups when playing hip hop or soul/rnb
Addendum
My fretless is a jazz, if I dig in and out major time in it I will definitely mod.
With what… have no idea.
Single P and leave open hole in the bridge probaby
Not a joke btw
I guess we I feel the same about the Stingray as you the P bass
It was my main for about 5years but never got it to work for me
@lordradish
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I like P bass tone, I just don't care much for the P bass design overall. It's okay, not like I hate it. If you gave me a nice one I'd play it for sure. But to get P bass tone I have a Jaguar with a P pickup in it. Same sound, but more comfy to play, plus it looks cool.
Also, I'm not a Stingray guy, either. Another design I don't care for. I like Rickenbackers, of course, but I always come back to my old 80s Westone Spectrum, which is its own animal. Too bad the Matsumoku factory is gone, now.
So I have 3 different basses, none of which is anything like the others, and none of which are TB traditional favorites. My dad said I always do everything the hard way.
Also, I'm not a Stingray guy, either. Another design I don't care for. I like Rickenbackers, of course, but I always come back to my old 80s Westone Spectrum, which is its own animal. Too bad the Matsumoku factory is gone, now.
So I have 3 different basses, none of which is anything like the others, and none of which are TB traditional favorites. My dad said I always do everything the hard way.
I don't hate P basses, just to be clear. Just not my thing... I tend to like more modern hifi sounds.All good by me if people don’t like Jaco but at least recognition is given.
I don’t really care about best or whatever, I just think he did some really cool stuff. His self titled album imo is still beautiful to me.
I’ll gladly take the loser that uses a P bass 99% of the time among the regulars over here. But I smack it like it owes me money and use it pretty « weird » ways.
And no CCR!!!!!!!
Jazz bass sounds really thin to me now.
On mine I play neck pickup only or both pups when playing hip hop or soul/rnb
Addendum
My fretless is a jazz, if I dig in and out major time in it I will definitely mod.
With what… have no idea.
Single P and leave open hole in the bridge probaby
Not a joke btw
I guess we I feel the same about the Stingray as you the P bass
It was my main for about 5years but never got it to work for me
@lordradish
@steubig — yeah the hybrids have this weird zing on the high end I couldn’t get past and the steels were good steels but steels are not my thing. Purely taste. I will say when I wanted a .150 low A, they delivered and it played well and in tune up the neck.
I love the sound of a P bass pickup. It was a weird compromise between humbucker and single coil when it was invented and works well for me. I prefer advances in body design from G&L, Music Man and Ibanez.
Seeing Jon Munson of Trip Shakespeare got me into fretless. He did the bridge pickup J thing but it sounded nothing like Jaco. An unlined precision fretless was my main instrument for years but now I pick it up and I’m like “wow I need to practice.”
As for Jaco, it’s clear he developed lots of new techniques on bass. Credit is due. But apart from Venetian Snares I enjoy very little music that is a barrage of notes.
I love the sound of a P bass pickup. It was a weird compromise between humbucker and single coil when it was invented and works well for me. I prefer advances in body design from G&L, Music Man and Ibanez.
Seeing Jon Munson of Trip Shakespeare got me into fretless. He did the bridge pickup J thing but it sounded nothing like Jaco. An unlined precision fretless was my main instrument for years but now I pick it up and I’m like “wow I need to practice.”
As for Jaco, it’s clear he developed lots of new techniques on bass. Credit is due. But apart from Venetian Snares I enjoy very little music that is a barrage of notes.
Venetian Snares is soooo cool but I can just take him in small doses, his last album « traditional synthesizer music » is one of my favourites.
But for sheer bat$h!zz’e craziness « songs about my cats » is hard to beat.
Shame he doesn’t get the recognition he deserves like his peers such as Squarepuhser.
Organized Chaos at its best.
@JES: the hybrids are a little zingy for me as well, but i beat them so mercilessly and keep them on so long, it kind of works out. and the fact that they do a lot of variations in gauges means i can do different tunings with balanced sets—and where else can i get a 12-string set (6x2) made to my specs?
******
j-bass vs. p-bass pickups.
according to a comment made to me by carey nordstrand, the sound is in the design: p-bass pickups are made like they sound, squat and fat; j-bass pickups are tall and skinny. (my guess is that this is also the difference in the strat vs. tele vs. jazzmaster pickups.)
i used to be a j-bass guy, but now that sound doesn't work for me. i like the short/fat sound of the p-bass pickup up, but dislike the split pickups, so i tend to do p winds in a vaguely j-bass configuration. (fwiw, afaik, a lot [most?] of dual coil pickups are based on the j-bass design. the nordstrand big rig is *not*.) i do like a p90 style. of course, my main basses right now have variations on musicman pickups—go figure.
btw, the best thing about the rear j-bass pickup/placement is that it gets the harmonics, which imo p-basses do not.
******
seeing rick danko and then reading about alphonso johnson getting one built (plus obsessing about the fender catalog ca 1970) were what made me get my first fretless p-bass in 1973 (72?). then i swapped the neck with a jazz bass (1974?) and voila, fretless jazz bass. (btw, alphonso was playing fretless in weather report *before* pastorius; look up weather report in berlin 1975 on youtube, he's killing it.)
there were others before pastorius as well: boz burrell, bill wyman, the guy in van morrison's band, the bass player in l.a. psych band the united states of america (fretless ampeg with fuzz)—and probably many more.
all of which is to day that mssr pastorius gets a lot of credit for starting stuff that he probably didn't—and people who should know better who create more legend than truth. (would he even have gotten a solo deal if stanley hadn't already done two solo albums?)
the first solo album was really cool. i just cannot deal with the hagiography.
fwiw, i consider bailey and manring to be extensions of the pastorius tradition—not completely "original" (assuming that it's even possible to be original.) karn is his own beast . . .
******
j-bass vs. p-bass pickups.
according to a comment made to me by carey nordstrand, the sound is in the design: p-bass pickups are made like they sound, squat and fat; j-bass pickups are tall and skinny. (my guess is that this is also the difference in the strat vs. tele vs. jazzmaster pickups.)
i used to be a j-bass guy, but now that sound doesn't work for me. i like the short/fat sound of the p-bass pickup up, but dislike the split pickups, so i tend to do p winds in a vaguely j-bass configuration. (fwiw, afaik, a lot [most?] of dual coil pickups are based on the j-bass design. the nordstrand big rig is *not*.) i do like a p90 style. of course, my main basses right now have variations on musicman pickups—go figure.
btw, the best thing about the rear j-bass pickup/placement is that it gets the harmonics, which imo p-basses do not.
******
seeing rick danko and then reading about alphonso johnson getting one built (plus obsessing about the fender catalog ca 1970) were what made me get my first fretless p-bass in 1973 (72?). then i swapped the neck with a jazz bass (1974?) and voila, fretless jazz bass. (btw, alphonso was playing fretless in weather report *before* pastorius; look up weather report in berlin 1975 on youtube, he's killing it.)
there were others before pastorius as well: boz burrell, bill wyman, the guy in van morrison's band, the bass player in l.a. psych band the united states of america (fretless ampeg with fuzz)—and probably many more.
all of which is to day that mssr pastorius gets a lot of credit for starting stuff that he probably didn't—and people who should know better who create more legend than truth. (would he even have gotten a solo deal if stanley hadn't already done two solo albums?)
the first solo album was really cool. i just cannot deal with the hagiography.
fwiw, i consider bailey and manring to be extensions of the pastorius tradition—not completely "original" (assuming that it's even possible to be original.) karn is his own beast . . .
Some of my pre-Pastorius fretless faves are:
Francis Moze (Magma, Gong)
Freebo with Bonnie Raitt - specifically on the album Give it Up, which I discovered in my dad's CD collection after he passed - I didn't realize a fretless could be played and sound like that - Jaco, & maybe Mick Kara seemed like the template for what it would sound like.
Francis Moze (Magma, Gong)
Freebo with Bonnie Raitt - specifically on the album Give it Up, which I discovered in my dad's CD collection after he passed - I didn't realize a fretless could be played and sound like that - Jaco, & maybe Mick Kara seemed like the template for what it would sound like.
