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America's got some catching up to do!
- Thread starter stratovani
- Start date
A lot of the views expressed here make me think about what education is actually for, There are three main schools of thought on this.
1) Educating the individual serves to produce useful employees.
2) Educating the individual produces a better society.
3) Educating the individual enables their own self-fulfilment.
It's perhaps worth bearing in kind that all three of these have their own validity, none of them to the exclusion of the others. I'm sure that folks on this forum (being artists and musicans and all) will understand this totally.
1) Educating the individual serves to produce useful employees.
2) Educating the individual produces a better society.
3) Educating the individual enables their own self-fulfilment.
It's perhaps worth bearing in kind that all three of these have their own validity, none of them to the exclusion of the others. I'm sure that folks on this forum (being artists and musicans and all) will understand this totally.
I agree completely.
There are some courses that do require further study in the university manner (sciences for instance).
There are a lot of university and college courses which just shouldn't exist IMO.
And I agree that there should be more apprentice programs. My brother and I are pretty chalk and cheese, I've been into science for as long as I can remember, my brother has been into cars and repairing things for as long as he can remember. I've followed the academic route, he followed the apprentice route. We both love what we do, and we are following the routes that our careers require
I think it's a great shame that having a trade, or being an apprentice somewhere along the line became a 'lesser' thing to be doing than going to university (particularly seeing so many university courses are pretty useless).
I see my education as a way to further my knowledge and allow me to pursue a career that I'm interested in (self-fufilment) and a career which I believe will allow me to do my little bit to help move society forward. So, 2 & 3 are fairly mutual and, well, 1, hopefully!
Philosophy, yes. Psychology, HELL NO. mind you, i speak as someone who is currently in school for psychology and counseling. when we're done, we're doctors without the medical degree.
not surprised about that result. The cost is so low for Post secondary education, especially in the province of Quebec. Even if the cost are lower than the others, Quebec University score well in the country and in sport look at the "rouge et Or" football that win the Canadian championship almost every year in the last decade... The rule that less you pay, less you have quality, is not a factor in Canada...
actually, i've already done some work in my field. it's one of the fastest growing atm, thanks to stress causing various problems in people's lives. is it the most well paying field? certainly not. but does it need to be done through education? hell yes. there is no way an uneducated person would ever be prepared for what you'll encounter in a counseling session.
I'd like to see Universities get rid of the courses you don't need in order to be a soil & water engineer, or whatever.
The cynical part of me thinks universities make you take these extra fluff courses to pay for the incredible buildings!
Just imagine the cost to build and maintain some of those 'mansion-like' behemoths. Someone has to pay for them and it isn't the university.
As for school in general, I think much more focus should be put into relationship skills and financial budgeting/planning.
One look at the divorce rate tells you we don't know how to communicate. And one passing glance at the personal debt stats tells us people don't know how to manage money.
The vast majority of people are never going to use functions & relations and calculus skills in the real world. Yet they get priority. Something is very wrong.
The cynical part of me thinks universities make you take these extra fluff courses to pay for the incredible buildings!
Just imagine the cost to build and maintain some of those 'mansion-like' behemoths. Someone has to pay for them and it isn't the university.
As for school in general, I think much more focus should be put into relationship skills and financial budgeting/planning.
One look at the divorce rate tells you we don't know how to communicate. And one passing glance at the personal debt stats tells us people don't know how to manage money.
The vast majority of people are never going to use functions & relations and calculus skills in the real world. Yet they get priority. Something is very wrong.
My father went to a school called Automotive High School. Stuff like this is what we need now-a-days. Schools that teach an actual skill.
Re- Divorces, I think that is a social change, nothing to do with universities. Divorce is less taboo these days than it was 20-30 years ago. So, instead of trying to maintain a dying marriage, many people will cut it. I would also say it is part of the "instant gratification" culture these days.
Re- Debt, soaring costs (food, fuels, keeping a roof over your head), limited borrowing potentials (thanks to banks giving too much to the previous generation), massive student debt from the cost of studying (at least in the US), current economic climate etc etc. Also, the previously mentioned "instant gratification" culture is part of this.
If you are studying them at university, chances are they are relevant to your field. Certainly have to use mathematics on a fairly regular basis with my line of research, I know plenty of engineers who also need to use such knowledge regularly.
You are right, something is very wrong. But this isn't one of the issues with universities. University is to learn about a subject and expand your horizons, it shouldn't be there to babysit you and teach you basic life skills, earlier education and good parenting should be teaching you that!
Just my $0.02.
But I think apprentice programs are more beneficial than specific schools. Folk who have entered apprentice programs over here seem to be more successful than those who go to colleges to study the same skill sets.
actually, there are schools that do both. For example: UTI has a couple campuses out here, where you learn basics in a class, and promptly go out and actually work on cars exhibiting those problems you just studied. They then try to set you up in a job with a dealership, so you've actually got a career. pretty freakin' sweet gig.
It is pretty sweet, I'm just giving my experiences
When doing an apprenticeship, you end up doing work for a company with some college time mixed in too. So, maybe 4 weeks with the company/journeyman, 2 weeks in college, as your years progress, you spend less time in college. You'll come up with real situations and real problems. You often have a portfolio style log to keep so there is a record of all the problems you work on, just so there is evidence of broad coverage. Finish up your apprenticeship and they'll almost certainly keep you on.
In colleges they give teach you and give you mocked up problems to deal with. IMO, a mocked up issue is a bit artificial. I can't really think how to quantify it other than that, if it makes any sense? Though I will say they don't seem to be overly helpful with getting you work over here, more interested in getting you qualified and out the door!
As said, just my observations as an outsider, seeing other folk going through the system.
