Ampeg PF500/350, part 4

[ryanfenderbass]

Well, this is new. I guess I used up all of my service swaps. Email from Ampeg support:

Thanks for the update.

The PF-500 bass head employs a proprietary limiter circuit for the purposes of preventing the squaring of output signals during clipping – most Class-D amplifiers don’t clip as naturally as other amp types. While there have been no specific revisions to this part, it is possible that normal component variances could stack up so that the limiter isn’t as aggressive as in other units. However, this certainly hasn’t been anything that has caused alarm during our quality assurance procedures or we would take the appropriate action to modify the design and offer official fixes for warranty service, etc. We talk with tons of PF customers in support and in nearly all cases, adjustments to achieve proper gain structure has eliminated any cut-outs they were experiencing. Our advice for players experiencing the occasional cut-out would be to back off the bass control and turn up the mids a bit to better cut through the mix. Players looking for additional low end should consider a ported cabinet design like the PF-115LF or PF-410HLF.

However, to diagnosis the source of what is causing your PF500 to cut out, the best thing is going to be to have the amp looked at by an authorized warranty service center. And after talking with my supervisor, while we can’t cover the packing material, we can generate a UPS call tag to get the amp into the closest authorized warranty service center.

We submitted the request for the UPS call tags to be generated and you should receive them in about three business days.

The unit will be sent to the following service center:

(Some place 30 miles away from me)

Also, here is your Field Service Request Number: XXXXXXX

All you need to include with the entire unit is a copy of the sales receipt, along with the above number and your personal contact information written on the back of that receipt. When you send it to the authorized service center, as long as the amp is within warranty, and the failure is due to a manufacturer’s defects, it should be covered under warranty.


Now I have to find a replacement amp to use while this is being serviced? I think I'm over this amp. Love the sound... except when there is no sound.

 

[Freddels]

After seeing all these failures, and now this lack of support for them, I'm glad I didn't buy one.

 

[garythenuke]

Well, this is new. I guess I used up all of my service swaps. Email from Ampeg support:

Thanks for the update.

The PF-500 bass head employs a proprietary limiter circuit for the purposes of preventing the squaring of output signals during clipping – most Class-D amplifiers don’t clip as naturally as other amp types. While there have been no specific revisions to this part, it is possible that normal component variances could stack up so that the limiter isn’t as aggressive as in other units. However, this certainly hasn’t been anything that has caused alarm during our quality assurance procedures or we would take the appropriate action to modify the design and offer official fixes for warranty service, etc. We talk with tons of PF customers in support and in nearly all cases, adjustments to achieve proper gain structure has eliminated any cut-outs they were experiencing. Our advice for players experiencing the occasional cut-out would be to back off the bass control and turn up the mids a bit to better cut through the mix. Players looking for additional low end should consider a ported cabinet design like the PF-115LF or PF-410HLF.

However, to diagnosis the source of what is causing your PF500 to cut out, the best thing is going to be to have the amp looked at by an authorized warranty service center. And after talking with my supervisor, while we can’t cover the packing material, we can generate a UPS call tag to get the amp into the closest authorized warranty service center.

We submitted the request for the UPS call tags to be generated and you should receive them in about three business days.

The unit will be sent to the following service center:

(Some place 30 miles away from me)

Also, here is your Field Service Request Number: XXXXXXX

All you need to include with the entire unit is a copy of the sales receipt, along with the above number and your personal contact information written on the back of that receipt. When you send it to the authorized service center, as long as the amp is within warranty, and the failure is due to a manufacturer’s defects, it should be covered under warranty.


Now I have to find a replacement amp to use while this is being serviced? I think I'm over this amp. Love the sound... except when there is no sound.

Boy, that REALLY blows:scowl: Ampeg is dropping the ball here....

 

[60bass]

We talk with tons of PF customers in support and in nearly all cases, adjustments to achieve proper gain structure has eliminated any cut-outs they were experiencing. Our advice for players experiencing the occasional cut-out would be to back off the bass control and turn up the mids a bit to better cut through the mix. Players looking for additional low end should consider a ported cabinet design like the PF-115LF or PF-410HLF.

Tons of customers? IMO That's as much as admitting "tons " of users are having problems. OK I agree that mids cut through better but to tell you to turn down the bass or use a different cab? Sorry but that's again IMO pure BS! Sounds like a run around to me. I'm surprised Ampeg would tell anyone that.

First they say to adjust gain and compressor a certain way and now they tell you to set your tone a certain way too? Very confusing to say the least!

 

[peddles]

i am really worried. Just got the pf500 and 2 15" cabs in the mail and I had some weird cutting out thing going on sometimes. I can just return this head if it persists in the following days if people are still getting this problem. I like the cabs but i am really sad that this is happening. I was about 12 a clock on the gain and same with the volume and had some weird cutting out issues. If I really played lightly it would not cut out but i don't know anyone who would play like this all the time...

 

[garythenuke]

Well, this is new. I guess I used up all of my service swaps. Email from Ampeg support:

Thanks for the update.

The PF-500 bass head employs a proprietary limiter circuit for the purposes of preventing the squaring of output signals during clipping – most Class-D amplifiers don’t clip as naturally as other amp types. While there have been no specific revisions to this part, it is possible that normal component variances could stack up so that the limiter isn’t as aggressive as in other units. However, this certainly hasn’t been anything that has caused alarm during our quality assurance procedures or we would take the appropriate action to modify the design and offer official fixes for warranty service, etc. We talk with tons of PF customers in support and in nearly all cases, adjustments to achieve proper gain structure has eliminated any cut-outs they were experiencing. Our advice for players experiencing the occasional cut-out would be to back off the bass control and turn up the mids a bit to better cut through the mix. Players looking for additional low end should consider a ported cabinet design like the PF-115LF or PF-410HLF.

However, to diagnosis the source of what is causing your PF500 to cut out, the best thing is going to be to have the amp looked at by an authorized warranty service center. And after talking with my supervisor, while we can’t cover the packing material, we can generate a UPS call tag to get the amp into the closest authorized warranty service center.

We submitted the request for the UPS call tags to be generated and you should receive them in about three business days.

The unit will be sent to the following service center:

(Some place 30 miles away from me)

Also, here is your Field Service Request Number: XXXXXXX

All you need to include with the entire unit is a copy of the sales receipt, along with the above number and your personal contact information written on the back of that receipt. When you send it to the authorized service center, as long as the amp is within warranty, and the failure is due to a manufacturer’s defects, it should be covered under warranty.


Now I have to find a replacement amp to use while this is being serviced? I think I'm over this amp. Love the sound... except when there is no sound.

By the way, how many have you had replaced? How many times have you contacted them?

 

[ryanfenderbass]

By the way, how many have you had replaced? How many times have you contacted them?

Original PF-500 - cutting out issues
1st replacement - had improperly drilled mounting holes (screw wouldn't thread without stripping)
2nd replacement - current amp, cutting out issues.

I've owned 3 total in the last 6 months. I obviously had to contact Ampeg to get the replacements, so I've contacted them 3 times, including this round.

 

[garythenuke]

Original PF-500 - cutting out issues
1st replacement - had improperly drilled mounting holes (screw wouldn't thread without stripping)
2nd replacement - current amp, cutting out issues.

I've owned 3 total in the last 6 months. I obviously had to contact Ampeg to get the replacements, so I've contacted them 3 times, including this round.

I'd sure like to know what is going on with them. I would REALLY like to have "AMPEG FOREVER" tattooed on my forearm, as the sound is perfect, IMHO, but dang it's hard to swallow the whole hook. Maybe the SVT8 Pro is the way to go... Of course I could buy five or seven 500s for the price of one 8pro.

 

[Freddels]

I've had no problems with my 7 Pro. It's definitely not as expensive as the 8 Pro.

 

[ryanfenderbass]

Someone please tell me keep the faith with the PF-500 and not get a Terror Bass. I am so tempted after all of these problems

 

[60bass]

Someone please tell me keep the faith with the PF-500 and not get a Terror Bass. I am so tempted after all of these problems

Don't do it! Sell the 500 after it comes back and just move up to the 7 pro! A guy that plays with a friend of mine went through 3 of the Orange heads then dumped it for a GB.

 

[ryanfenderbass]

Don't do it! Sell the 500 after it comes back and just move up to the 7 pro! A guy that plays with a friend of mine went through 3 of the Orange heads then dumped it for a GB.

You caught my attention: 3 of them? What happened? I'm intrigued by the 7 pro, but I think I'm pulled into the ultra-portable market which is why I LOVED my PF-500 so much.

What about the Aggy Tone Hammer 500?

 

[60bass]

You caught my attention: 3 of them? What happened? I'm intrigued by the 7 pro, but I think I'm pulled into the ultra-portable market which is why I LOVED my PF-500 so much.

What about the Aggy Tone Hammer 500?

I hate to say it but his TT500 was cutting out everytime he dug in or picked hard. He couldn't even gig with it. When he contacted Orange they told him that it was in the protection circuit, they were aware of it, and had a fix for it. They advised him to send it in, which he did.

When he got the amp back it was a new one which ended up doing the same exact thing. He called them again, they shipped him another one again, which did the same thing.

He called them back yet again and was told something along the lines of the amps are designed that way to stop voltage spikes (aka limiter) which might cause the class D amp to have bad distortion issues.

Sound familiar ?

He sold the TT500 and moved on. This was back in late 2010 or early 2011 I think. Maybe they have them worked out by now. I haven't played one since his so I can't say.

You might head over to the Aggie Tonehammer thread and lurk around there.

Honestly, if you like the Ampeg tone the SVT 7 Pro really isn't a lumbering beast to haul around. The thing only weighs 15.5 lbs roughly 4 pounds heavier than the 500. Toss it in a rack case and go.

 

[JimmyM]

I'm starting to think that high wattage is the best way to go with micro technology if you plan on being loud. Like maybe you should overbuy. I've found them to run well for me but I don't use much volume from my rig.

 

[Bass 45]

Yes^

Ampeg tech told me that himself when I called to talk about my PF500 cutting out issues.

I explained to him that I have done the same gigs for many years - without issue - with a B15R (100 watt all tube), a V4 (100 watt all tube) an SVT II and a Korean made SVT IV (which I think is the best piece of equipment I have ever owned).

Don't give up on Ampeg - they offer plenty of great products - but if you play loud and fast and slap - I don't know about the lower powered class D amps.

 

[ddbassGA]

Yes^

Ampeg tech told me that himself when I called to talk about my PF500 cutting out issues.

I explained to him that I have done the same gigs for many years - without issue - with a B15R (100 watt all tube), a V4 (100 watt all tube) an SVT II and a Korean made SVT IV (which I think is the best piece of equipment I have ever owned).

Don't give up on Ampeg - they offer plenty of great products - but if you play loud and fast and slap - I don't know about the lower powered class D amps.

So the "500 Watt" amp can't deliver the volume of the 100 or 300 watt amps? If it's 500 Watts on a test signal, but you have to keep it below 1/2 of full volume (sound, not knobs) to keep from cutting out then is it effectively only a 50 watt amp?

 

[Bass 45]

So the "500 Watt" amp can't deliver the volume of the 100 or 300 watt amps? If it's 500 Watts on a test signal, but you have to keep it below 1/2 of full volume (sound, not knobs) to keep from cutting out then is it effectively only a 50 watt amp?

I usually play without P.A. support in what I consider an average rock band volume wise. In my situation, the PF500 cuts out momentarily when I slap my upright (occasionally it will cut out with a passive electric also). When I explained this to an Ampeg tech, he told me that I may need a more powerful amp if I am going to go lightweight - and without tubes. Everything I had ever used in the past 20 years has been all tube - (or 1,560 watts with a tube preamp in the case of the SVT 4). He explained that tubes handle being pushed differently than a class D amp. He suggested running my SVT DI between my PF500 and my bass - to get a tube in line. I have tried this at home and I have not been able to get it to cut out - but I have not tried it at a gig yet - as it is difficult to not bring one of my reliable amps to the gigs I have been playing lately - in a band that I recently joined.

He also suggested I bring the PF500 to the local Ampeg authorized service center so they can check if it is running up to spec. I think this is fair - I just have not done it yet.

 

[Bass 45]

and as far as the 50 watt analogy: my B18 would not go as loud as my PF500 - but it would never stop trying

 

[Bass 45]

Me again.

I forgot to mention I also own an Ampeg BA300/115 (I know - I spoil myself) which is a class D combo rated at 300 watts with a tube preamp. This amp has also been flawless. I owned it before the PF500 - but the problem with the BA300? - you cannot use an extension speaker. I use one fifteen inch speaker for my gigs without a drummer, and two with a drummer. So when the PF500 came out, my logic was buy it with two PF115HE's (plus I am a Portaflex fanatic).

I think if I were in charge at Ampeg, I would leave the PF350 alone - and put a tube pre in the PF500 - for the people who will be pushin' that some-b.

 

[coreyfyfe]

I know everyone's definition of volume is different but you guys must be running these things hard if the PF-500 isn't cutting it. With my loudest band - two guitarists with Marshall half stacks and a fender twin between them and a heavy handed drummer - I'm running my gain at about 2:30 and master just below noon though a 4 ohm 2x15 and it's plenty for the room. Yes, We all wear ear plugs. Mine hasn't complained yet. It is odd, as said above, that for some of us we have had zero trouble while those with problems seem to have them repeatedly.