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AMPEG QC

Discussion in 'Amps and Cabs [BG]' started by specplyrz, Nov 23, 2005.


  1. specplyrz

    specplyrz Banned

    Nov 11, 2005
    Have other Ampeg owners had as many problems as I with Ampeg products? I will list the products and their problems/outcome.


    Bought SVT Pro3...top rattled when fan came on...took top off and put foam tape on top to prevent rattling. Sold it.
    Bought BXT410hl4...was the "boomiest" bottom I ever owned. Sold it.
    BA115 Combo Amp....overheated and "farting" sound. Returned for BA210.
    BA210, arrived with one speakers voice coil rubbing against the gap. Had to repair this myself.Also had 20 guage!! wiring for two 10" speakers with 220 watts rms. Sold it.
    SVT350 head. Fan was replaced and it still sounded like a jet engine. Finally rubber mounted it to get rid of the noise.Used it with 210 bottom on a 410he bottom.Traded head in on SVT1000.
    Sold both bottoms, 210 was rear ported "boom box"
    Bought the 810e.
    Svt1000...good loud clean amp...but wanted a Classic. Sold the SVT1000 and bought the SVT CL. Defective, right out of the box. Sent it back to store, got a replacement which works great!!
    810e cabinet...very poor insulation. Ordered various insulation and installed foam insulation on the bare wood spots, and there were a lot of these spots. Sounds slightly deeper and warmer now.

    As you can see, I have had more than my fair share of problems, but finally I am happy. I have stuck with Ampeg for 20 years, off and on. I do notice a decline in quality control. These problems should have been caught before they left the plant.

    I have spent a lot of time with home audio, and have never recieved a defective product. One company I dealt with, ran their power amps at full power for 48 hours before they released it.

    When I pay 1000.00 for a bass bottom, I expect it to have ample insulation in it. I expect a 1600.00 head to arrive working. There was NO damage to the box. I figure a 600.00 bass head should not sound like a jet or rattle trap.

    Any other stories out there, like the overheatring amp problems so many have had?
     
  2. Well, that sucks, ive only got my SVT II, all it needed was a revalve, and at the price i got it it was still cheaper after the revalve than most second hand
     
  3. David Vega

    David Vega

    Aug 28, 2002
    Puerto Rico
    SVT4PRO, working fine for now, some noise on the XLR line out
    SVP-BSP working fine for now, too much treble, lack of control mid in the clean channel, but working

    BXT210M-excellent 210, for smal projects i like this
    BXT410HL4, well not boomy for me, lack of balls, farting

    Waiting a SVP-CL preamp, I will let you know how is this
     
  4. getz76

    getz76

    Apr 3, 2005
    Hoboken, NJ
    Let us be fair...

    That doesn't sound like a QC issue, that sounds like personal taste. I personally think Eden cabinets are some of the boomiest cabinets around, but I wouldn't call that a QC issue.

    Did the amp actually shut down from overheating? Were you clipping the power section? Were you EQing a lot of bass boost?

    See above, that sounds like personal preference.

    Where were the bare-wood spots? What type of insulation? The proper batting-type? There is a rhyme and reason to filling a cabinet, and it really is not for insulation purposes (see kick-drum). Increasing the amount of fill will (correct me if I'm wrong someone) increase volume (loudness) but decrease low-end response. That is what you might be experiencing.
     
  5. godraphonic

    godraphonic

    Jun 6, 2005
    With the exception of the SVT cl, everything else sounds like operator difficulty (cranking the bass on a ported cab), unrealistic expectations, and just generalized looking for faults where none exist. Fan noise on an amp that produces 100+ DB's? if you're actualy playing bass, you won't hear it.

    Speaker gauge and insulation? both engineered with a level of expertise you are not qualified to call into question. :bawl:
     
  6. slugworth

    slugworth Banned

    Jun 12, 2003
    So. Calif.
    Sounds like the problems I've had with David Eden stuff:

    212XLT cabinet-Horn DOA out of the box. I also wrinkled
    4 speaker cones. Replaced with Eminence speakers.
    1-15T-Speaker Blown, replaced with JBL VGC.
    410XLT-Horn control L-pad caught on fire-part replaced.
    WT800- cold solder joint on thermostatic fan control
    circuit causing fan to shut down; amp overheated and
    blew output transistor. Repaired.
    D-210MBX wedge, both cones wrinkled, replaced with Eminences. :(

    Mostly abuse on my part......

    Slug
     
  7. specplyrz

    specplyrz Banned

    Nov 11, 2005

    Actualy, I am qualified...two degrees in electronics.. :cool: This was a discussion on another site...amp that got hot and made "farting" sounds started to smell, so I turned it of. I did not overdrive the amp. Both bottoms I sent back had very little insulation in them. Ported bottoms MUST be well insulated, or they boom. Fan noise was cheap noisy fans. My svt cl for instance, has the fan in front...it is very quiet.

    As for the 20 guage wiring...current needs copper....look it up on the web...these bottoms should be using at least 14 guage wire in my opinion, but heavy guage wire costs more...so does insulation. Remember, there is the ability to throw 10-15 amps of current with some amp heads...into 18-20 guage wire?? You do the math.

    Insulation replaced with comparable insulation, matted/foam kind. Insulation in one of the 810 chambers was hanging down. Was not stapled correctly.

    Could be worse, I have pics of not one but two different Hartke cabs with the internal bracing broken. Hartke said it was because it was their "first run".???!!!
     
  8. At least you admit it, must take a hell of alot to kill that many speakers :scowl:
     
  9. specplyrz

    specplyrz Banned

    Nov 11, 2005
    "Increasing the amount of fill will (correct me if I'm wrong someone) increase volume (loudness) but decrease low-end response"

    Actually, depending on what you use, you could experience both. I belive the percentage is 10-15 that added damping "fools" a speaker into thinking it's in a bigger enclosure.
     
  10. haujobb

    haujobb

    Dec 16, 2004
    Wallaceburg
    It doesn't fool the speaker into "thinking" anything. The idea behind damping material is that it prevents standing waves from hitting the rear of the cab and deflecting back at a reverse phase to the waves being produced at that moment.
     
  11. specplyrz

    specplyrz Banned

    Nov 11, 2005

    That is in part true, and probably the main use for the damping, however it can alter the highs/mids, lows and volume by the amount and TYPE used.
     
  12. haujobb

    haujobb

    Dec 16, 2004
    Wallaceburg
    True, and it all has to do with how the waves travel through the batting. In a cab without any batting, standing waves can cause cancelation effecting the overall output and the frequency response of the cab. In extreme cases it can increase flex in the cab walls leading to a total loss of efficiency in the cab.
     
  13. specplyrz

    specplyrz Banned

    Nov 11, 2005
    Originally Posted by etnops
    great question.

    here's what's happening, technically.

    by adding the acoustic stuffing (polyfill, fiberglass, foam, etc) to the degree of 24-30oz per cubic ft (in sealed cabinet), you effectively lower the resonance of the system by about 15%. theoretical gain is to the tune of 30%, but it's never really attainable.

    a resonance, is the point where the system (driver, cabinet) is at it's most efficient. technically, a resonance is described as a transfer of two energies - kinetic and potential. it's where the forces from the acoustic suspension of the mechanical parts of the speaker (spider, surround, and volume of air in cabint) are in perfect harmony with the electrical part of the system (motor [ permanent magnet] and voice coil).

    the way the polyfill lowers the system resonance, can be expressed with thermal dynamics. simply, the compression of the volume of air in the cabinet requires energy (from driver). when the air compresses there is obvious friction of the air molecules, and this friction generates heat (energy in itself). by replacing part of the volume of air in the cabinet with a better thermal conductor (polyfill, fiberglass, foam, etc) you essential "trick" the system into "thinking" it's in a larger enclosure. because the air/polyfill combo can store energy (heat) more efficiently. now, as with actually increasing the physical box size to achieve the same effect (lowering of the resonance), you gain overall system efficiency. by adding polyfill, you do not increase efficiency, only benefit from the acoustic response as if you were to have a more efficient system.

    obviously, when you lower the resonance, it plays deeper. but also some other things happen.
    the type of resonance makes an impact on acoustic/sonic signature.
    how much energy the system stores at resonance, will dictate the amount of "ringing" the driver will exhibit when playing at resonance. imagine an inflatable rubber ball with 0.040" thick material, and if you hit it, how it goes "boooooooing". now imagine the same ball, but with 0.100" thick material, and how it would sound if you hit it -> "bong". this analogy describes the amount of "damping" the system has. how fast it is to return to it's rest state, after the signal isn't present. or how much the driver keeps moving after the signal is gone.
     
  14. haujobb

    haujobb

    Dec 16, 2004
    Wallaceburg
    I'm not denying any of that, my point was the speakers don't think :)
     
  15. specplyrz

    specplyrz Banned

    Nov 11, 2005
    An EXCELLENT point!! :) Some stereo speaker designers use little or no internal bracing in their speakers. They claim the "resonance" of the cabinet adds to the warmth of the speaker. Then you have designers who brace the @#$% out of their cabs.

    Thats why there's vanilla and chocolate.....different tastes :confused:
     
  16. Crockettnj

    Crockettnj

    Sep 2, 2005
    North NJ


    yeeeOUCH.
     
  17. specplyrz

    specplyrz Banned

    Nov 11, 2005

    Yes, was rather rude, but we all have opinions.
     

  18. How do you know that? There are plenty of people on this board well qualified to call any technical issue into question. How do you know that specplyrz isn't one? ;)

    As for Ampeg QC, from my experiences and the experiences of my repair technican buddies, Ampegs are just as reliable and have just as good QC as any other mass produced amplifier. You hear more stories about Ampeg simply because there are more of them out there than most other brands.
     
  19. specplyrz

    specplyrz Banned

    Nov 11, 2005
    You are probably right on both points. :cool:
     
  20. getz76

    getz76

    Apr 3, 2005
    Hoboken, NJ
    Good point.

    I expect gear to fail; I care more about how it is handled and fixed.

    I've had good customer service experiences from Carvin, Peavey, GK, Eden, and Acme.