Are my shim and bottomed out saddle screws putting too much pressure on my bridge?

[Stagelab]

I just got a fretless and after setting the neck relief to about 0.012 and adjust the string height, the action is still a bit high for my taste. I usually string my basses with 4/64” on the G, D and A and 5/64” on the E, all measured at the highest frets. So I put a business card shim in the neck pocket and am able to set the action lower but to get the action to my liking—and not too low—I had to lower the saddle screws about as much as they can go down. As a result, some of the saddles are a little lopsided now and I think there’s more pressure on the bridge. Pic attached. Is this an issue? If so I could try a shim made of a piece or two of copy paper instead of a business card.

 

[Bruce Johnson]

I just got a fretless and after setting the neck relief to about 0.012 and adjust the string height, the action is still a bit high for my taste. I usually string my basses with 4/64” on the G, D and A and 5/64” on the E, all measured at the highest frets. So I put a business card shim in the neck pocket and am able to set the action lower but to get the action to my liking—and not too low—I had to lower the saddle screws about as much as they can go down. As a result, some of the saddles are a little lopsided now and I think there’s more pressure on the bridge. Pic attached. Is this an issue? If so I could try a shim made of a piece or two of copy paper instead of a business card.

Lowering the saddles doesn't increase the down pressure on the bridge. If anything, it lowers the pressure, because of the lower break angle of the strings over the saddles. But only a little bit.

 

[Killing Floor]

Lots of basses have shims. Not to worry.

 

[KenD]

No, you're not putting any additional pressure on the bridge plate but if you still need more height adjustment room you could put in a slightly thicker shim. BTW Stewmac sells maple shims either sized for a Fender neck pocket or blank.

Stewmac shim

 

[fretno]

If you are already shimming then I recommend using a full pocket shim from stew mac. They have a few thickness options. It looks a little wacky but that’s not a deal breaker but I would suggest another setup check, especially the intonation. 12th fret harmonic, open and 12th fretted all should be the same +/-

 

[Reedt2000]

We're the saddles always at an angle like that? Looks like the bridge might be misaligned. If this is a metroexpress bass that was a major complaint about the first run of them.

 

[J-Bass RMR]

I had to lower the saddle screws about as much as they can go down

Just to clarify;
when you lower the screws, you raise the saddle creating more of a break angle.
On top of that, it looks like the saddles are pulled back rather far - I assume for "proper" intonation, which adds to the break angle.
(my '78 Fretless P is like that because the bridge was installed slightly closer to the nut that what was "typical")
With the saddles cranked back, it exasperates the "side pull" I'm seeing. What's ultimately causing that is hard to say without further inspection.

But, yes, if that's the case, (screws lowered/saddles raised) your shim is too thick. Sometimes, it takes a little trial and error.

One other thought;
Remove the shim all together, and use a razor blade to remove the silk enough so the bare metal of the string is sitting on the saddles. You might be surprised the difference that can make.
I've had to do that occasionally, especially with EB Cobalt flats. I use a drop of CA to keep the silks from unraveling further.

 

[2thAche]

Something looks wonky about those saddles but it's not the height. Is the bridge not square with the string path?

 

[JRA]

also: fretless necks can be almost (if not) perfectly straight. lots of folks want to set them up with the same relief they'd use with frets...a fretless is a different kind of tool.
and: after you take the time to get the lowest possible action for yourself = don't forget to play with a lighter touch...it's a fretless, no fences to jump!

congrats on your fretless, good luck with your setup!

 

[Stagelab]

We're the saddles always at an angle like that? Looks like the bridge might be misaligned. If this is a metroexpress bass that was a major complaint about the first run of them.

No, the saddles weren’t at an angle till I added the shim. Mine is a second run and I haven’t ID’d any QA issues, thankfully.

 

[Stagelab]

Just to clarify;
when you lower the screws, you raise the saddle creating more of a break angle.
On top of that, it looks like the saddles are pulled back rather far - I assume for "proper" intonation, which adds to the break angle.
(my '78 Fretless P is like that because the bridge was installed slightly closer to the nut that what was "typical")
With the saddles cranked back, it exasperates the "side pull" I'm seeing. What's ultimately causing that is hard to say without further inspection.

But, yes, if that's the case, (screws lowered/saddles raised) your shim is too thick. Sometimes, it takes a little trial and error.

One other thought;
Remove the shim all together, and use a razor blade to remove the silk enough so the bare metal of the string is sitting on the saddles. You might be surprised the difference that can make.
I've had to do that occasionally, especially with EB Cobalt flats. I use a drop of CA to keep the silks from unraveling further.

Ok, this is what I suspected. I was a little surprised when the others said there’s no issue here. I’ll try a thinner shim — a couple sheets of copy paper. Not keen on messing with the strings.

 

[Stagelab]

Something looks wonky about those saddles but it's not the height. Is the bridge not square with the string path?

Are you referring to the saddles being lopsided, like I pointed out? They shifted after I added the shim and raised the action.

 

[DanDBassist]

Are you referring to the saddles being lopsided, like I pointed out? They shifted after I added the shim and raised the action.

A photo of the strings path between the nut and the bridge might be helpful. We would be able to see the alignment along the neck and then provide some more help.

 

[Stagelab]

A photo of the strings path between the nut and the bridge might be helpful. We would be able to see the alignment along the neck and then provide some more help.

Here you go. I replaced the business card with two sheets of paper from an envelope. Probably half the thickness of the business card. Checked relief and adjusted the action. One saddle screw sticks out more than I’d like. these screws hurt when I palm mute so maybe I should file this one down. Saddles are still crooked. String spacing is consistent and strings run in between the pickup coils. I checked my Mustang and the saddles on it are a little crooked too, actually.

 

[Stagelab]

Are you referring to the saddles being lopsided, like I pointed out? They shifted after I added the shim and raised the action.

Edit: I checked a pic the seller took and the saddles were always kinda crooked. Could this just be an issue with the bridge’s construction? As long as it won’t cause any issues, I’m fine with leaving it be. Would rather not need to buy a new bridge.

 

[digmeout]

It looks to me like the saddles are installed on the bridge incorrectly. The E string saddle should be on the G string side and the G string saddle should be on the E string side. That why the string path on the E string alignment is off and the E sting tension is pushing the other saddles to the G side. At least that's what it looks like to me.

 

[smurfco]

yea I think the saddles are in the wrong order / upside down

 

[Stagelab]

It looks to me like the saddles are installed on the bridge incorrectly. The E string saddle should be on the G string side and the G string saddle should be on the E string side. That why the string path on the E string alignment is off and the E sting tension is pushing the other saddles to the G side. At least that's what it looks like to me.

What is different about these two saddles? I’ve never heard of saddles corresponding to specific strings.

 

[DanDBassist]

If you were to loosen the strings to where there is very little tension, do the saddles then line up with each other? like this? I have seen saddles that don't fit the bridge. And are you adjusting the height screws so the saddles are parallel to the bridge plate? Sometimes different height of the screws on one saddle can have strange effects on the way the strings pull it. Also, I noticed that the way the E and G strings have to travel outward to be in their groove suggest that this bridge may not be the best fit.

 

[silky smoove]

What is different about these two saddles? I’ve never heard of saddles corresponding to specific strings.

Look at the placement of the adjustment screw and spring on each from your bass and compare them to the photo posted by @DanDBassist. The E and G on yours appear to have swapped places.