Double Bass bass reflex situation?

[XSterling]

I've a Markbass Mini CMD 121P and I think that I need a bigger cab for louder gigs.

Once I tried the Traveler 121H extension cab but I can't notice a hugh change... then I thought that maybe a 4x10" cab would be better for my purpose but another question went to my mind...

What kind of cab would be better for a double bass, with the bass reflex at the front side (Invalid Link Removed) or rear side (Invalid Link Removed) ?

I can't try both, so I need your experience/wisdom/help!

Just a note: I think that I'll go for a 4 Ohm cab to get the full amp capacity. Getting off the apm from the combo when I'd need that.

Suggestions?

 

[HolmeBass]

The take-home I got from another thread where Duke Lejune chimed in was that there is no real difference between front port and rear port as long as you can place a rear ported cabinet at least twice the port diameter away from the back wall, and as long as you're not close micing your cabinet as the port exit is a sound radiator for the low frequencies coming from the port.

 

[XSterling]

The take-home I got from another thread where Duke Lejune chimed in was that there is no real difference between front port and rear port as long as you can place a rear ported cabinet at least twice the port diameter away from the back wall, and as long as you're not close micing your cabinet as the port exit is a sound radiator for the low frequencies coming from the port.

Then the one with the bass reflex at the backside will be better in this case: same power (800W) same range of frequencies (35Hz-20KHz), 13.5 cm smaller and 4.4 Kg less!

Is it simply like that? Unless it was stuck to the wall there is no difference in the sound that it projects? Then, why are they making frontside bass reflex cabs?

 

[Mike Arnopol]

I'm a convert to rear firing ports. I don't think that there is a big difference. Even if you're close to the rear wall it can work to your advantage as far as lowering the tuning. I think that the bigger cab might have a flatter low end response and a lower -3db point. I personally don't like 4 x 10 cabs as much because there is some weird midrange cancellation. I think that the single 15's or dual 12's sound better than 4 x 10's. Used to be that the prevailing thought was that a 10 is punchier than a 12 which is punchier than a 15. With the new drivers available with either 6" midrange drivers or horns crossed over low enough that there is little difference. Lots of good choices out there.

 

[playbass0410]

Personaly, I would go for a NEW YORK 122 - same SPL sensitifity and watts. Would place it upright for a small tower.
It could be an option to ask if you can get the cab as 8Ohm version and drive it parallel to the combo. Thus having 3x12" in action. Should be enough to break the back of the bass

 

[XSterling]

Personaly, I would go for a NEW YORK 122 - same SPL sensitifity and watts. Would place it upright for a small tower.
It could be an option to ask if you can get the cab as 8Ohm version and drive it parallel to the combo. Thus having 3x12" in action. Should be enough to break the back of the bass

It's not possible. The NEW YORK 122 is a 4Ohm cab. Impossible to run it in parallel to the combo!
That's why I'm looking for a 4 Ohm 4x10" and run it alone when it was necessari for large gigs!

 

[playbass0410]

Say not "that's not impossible".

Once I ordered a 1x15 cab from Peavey - the 1x15 Black Widow.
This speaker was only available as 4Ohm version.

They took the cab from the assembly line by hand and mounted another chassis - just for me.
Costs me 25$ extra what I was happy to pay. And that was big Peavey!!

Don't know how customer oriented Mark Bass is - but contact a good service oriented dealer or contact them by yourself. Just argue! Say big Peavey once has done this for you. You may wonder what talking is capable of ;-)

 

[XSterling]

Say not "that's not impossible".

Once I ordered a 1x15 cab from Peavey - the 1x15 Black Widow.
This speaker was only available as 4Ohm version.

They took the cab from the assembly line by hand and mounted another chassis - just for me.
Costs me 25$ extra what I was happy to pay. And that was big Peavey!!

Don't know how customer oriented Mark Bass is - but contact a good service oriented dealer or contact them by yourself. Just argue! Say big Peavey once has done this for you. You may wonder what talking is capable of ;-)

Ok. I've just sent an e-mail to them asking for a NewYork 122 cab but 8Ohms. If they answer me I'll let you know!
Although I think that 4x10" would me more punching mixed with bottom end, more air in movement...

I've read the official explanation that they say in their web page:
"The HF (front-ported) and HR (rear-ported) models have a different character of bottom end due to the location of the ports (also called reflexes). Front-ported cabinets are physically larger, and are generally preferred on bigger stages, venues where the bass doesn't go through the PA, and in musical situations where you want big, full, round bottom end. The HR (rear-ported) models tend to have a tighter, more controlled bottom end. They tend to be preferred in situations where the bass sound is needed to be punchy and focused, with more emphasis on melody and detail, for example in pop, jazz fusion, etc. When using two cabinets, many players choose to use one HR and one HF cabinet."

My doubt is because a doublebass has it's own natural bottom end, but when amplified it's not easy to control that... which one would be more accurate sounding with the bottom end but tone defined???

 

[playbass0410]

Well, from the frequency range of the cabs I assume that the port tuning is somewhere above 40Hz (that the cabs go down to 35Hz with remarkable sound pressure is nonsense anyway). In the frequency range of 40Hz bass is radiated omni. Means there is virtually a 360 degree radiation of bass waves as long you do not put a rear ported cab directly to the wall and thus prevent free air flow.

Everything else stated on their web page about audible differences in port location is just nice product marketing blablabla to give you something to read and consider.

From a 3x12" speaker configuration you will (theoretically) not get less air to move than with a 4x10". Soundwise your ear is the ultimate judge of what is to your taste.
10" speakers are not to my personal taste as I'm missing low end power and do not like the punchy mids for DB - but that's my taste (just to not raise the 8767th 12" vs. 10" discussion ;-).

 

[XSterling]

Well, from the frequency range of the cabs I assume that the port tuning is somewhere above 40Hz (that the cabs go down to 35Hz with remarkable sound pressure is nonsense anyway). In the frequency range of 40Hz bass is radiated omni. Means there is virtually a 360 degree radiation of bass waves as long you do not put a rear ported cab directly to the wall and thus prevent free air flow.

Everything else stated on their web page about audible differences in port location is just nice product marketing blablabla to give you something to read and consider.

From a 3x12" speaker configuration you will (theoretically) not get less air to move than with a 4x10". Soundwise your ear is the ultimate judge of what is to your taste.
10" speakers are not to my personal taste as I'm missing low end power and do not like the punchy mids for DB - but that's my taste (just to not raise the 8767th 12" vs. 10" discussion ;-).

Markbass has answered me just now; they can not make an 8Ohm 2x12".
Nothing more about the rear or front-side bass reflex... and I can't try both!

Just one question: Do you know where has an Aguilar 4x10" the bass reflex situation?
Once I heard one (with a doublebass) and it sounded nice!!

 

[playbass0410]

Markbass has answered me just now; they can not make an 8Ohm 2x12".
Nothing more about the rear or front-side bass reflex... and I can't try both!
Once I heard one (with a doublebass) and it sounded nice!!

That's the flexibility I wish from a vendor Peavey could.

As I wrote in my post above - the bass frequencies transported by the port radiate omni directional. THERE IS JUST NO AUDIBLE DIFFERENCE ONLY by port location unless you have to put the cab against the wall. On small stages this can be the case. But sometimes it is for good as it flatten the very low bass frequencies and that's just fine with small rooms.

I just looked up the Markbass Cabs - quite expensive - for the same bugs and same size I personally would prefer the Glockenklang Double 2x12 8Ohms - they really have a great sound for DB.