Best super fast cabs for hifi/transparent sound

[groovaholic]

Last year, I picked up a used Goliath III for $179; the tweeter was blown and the crossover was hacked - I replaced both.

I also had to address "cone crease" on all 4 of the PAS woofers - the simplest answer would have been to replace the woofers with something less prone to crease, but the same characteristics that make them sound fast and snappy also make them prone to folding their paper.

Since recone kits aren't available, and my plan for the cab was just to leave it at my drummer's house, I wanted to limit how much I was spending on it.

So I cobbled together a band-aid for the cone crease as best as I could. (essentially, I put weights on the cones so that the tension would pull the creases straight, soaked the creased areas of the cones with watered-down PVA glue to make papier-mache, and left the weight on for 24 hours until the glue was fully cured)

As @agedhorse will tell you -

• my fix did nothing to correct the issues that led to the drivers creasing in the first place, and
• what I did changed the acoustical properties of the drivers

But since my band doesn't play very loudly, the cab isn't getting pushed hard, and it's sounded good and been solid for weekly rehearsals this past year.

 

[gmarcus]

I would listen to @agedhorse. Given his description of a very bright cab with high mid emphasis and not a lot of bass response I would look at Shroeder cabs. I've had 2 and hated them both because i like a lot of deep bass, but they did have that hyped up midrange.

Cabinets | Schroeder Cabinets | Bass Cabinets | California

 

[StereoPlayer]

My speakers respond before I even play a note…now that's fast…

 

[sawzalot]

I used to play the original SWR Goliath and the original Eden D410T (essentially the same cab) and what sort of shocked me was how much the frequency response fell off below 80 Hz. But I loved the two of them stacked together, what an amazing sound.

 

[chadds]

My speakers respond before I even play a note…now that's fast…

Oh Yeah?! My speakers responded at the store before I got there to demo!

 

[PB2578]

My Gallien-krueger cabs have always been super clear - used a NEO 410 in the past, and a 210 CX currently

 

[darwin-bass]

Definitely banana plugs are the best terminals for high velocity.

Dude, you are on a roll.

 

[darwin-bass]

I think part of what the OP is looking for is fast and well damped transient response. Honestly I don't know how much that varies from one well built speaker box to the next.

 

[Lo-E]

The original Goliath cabs were designed by David Nordschow.

He parted ways with SWR and designed his Eden "David" series (David slew Goliath, get it?). They were basically improved Goliaths. They had a very similar voicing.

Since selling Eden, Nordschow has worked under his own DNA brand (David Nordschow Amplification) and his current, further improved cabs still have the general voicing his cabs are known for. It's in his…. er…. DNA. If you're looking for lightweight cabs with a similar sound to the Goliath series, that would be the place to look.

Another place would be LDS. Don's a big fan of the early Eden sound and has used it as his design goal in several of his cabs. He'll custom build whatever you like and he's a very nice guy.

 

[arbiterusa]

If you can find a used SWR GoLite cabinet, that might be an option.

I have two and they are stunningly good cabs on their own merits. They are close, but they don't have that very bottom end slam that my old Goliath did. They have everything else. I think my old G2 with the PAS drivers was the best sounding bass cab anyone has ever made.

 

[brianrost]

To my ears, Bergantino cabinets are very snappy. The upper midrange is important to get that sound, before the Bergs I had a pair of Epifani 1-12 cabs and they sounded "pillowy" with reduced mids. Worth trying out if you can find one.

My Peavey 210TX cab was like the Epifanis, too...until I bypassed the crossover and disabled the piezo tweeter...suddenly there were all the missing high mids. It didn't sound as good as my Bergantinos, but hey it was only $200. I'm not sure how much of the scooped mids of my Epifanis was the crossover.

 

[agedhorse]

I have two and they are stunningly good cabs on their own merits. They are close, but they don't have that very bottom end slam that my old Goliath did. They have everything else. I think my old G2 with the PAS drivers was the best sounding bass cab anyone has ever made.

The GoLites are also considerably smaller cabinets, and much more robust, The will take a little bit of low end eq which will get them closer.

 

[mcrawfordmusic]

I usually recommend Bergantino whenever people want cab suggestions, but in this case, I think as @agedhorse has suggested, the newer SWR Golight should be right up your alley!

 

[mmbongo]

The original Goliath cabs were designed by David Nordschow.

He parted ways with SWR and designed his Eden "David" series (David slew Goliath, get it?). They were basically improved Goliaths. They had a very similar voicing.

Since selling Eden, Nordschow has worked under his own DNA brand (David Nordschow Amplification) and his current, further improved cabs still have the general voicing his cabs are known for. It's in his…. er…. DNA. If you're looking for lightweight cabs with a similar sound to the Goliath series, that would be the place to look.

Just as a side note, DNA has been out of business for a little while and of course are no longer produced.

 

[J-Bass RMR]

I played an SWR800 & Goliath II for over 2 decades.
IMO, the TH700 / SL series cabs are the antithesis of the SWR.
That's why I like my Aguilar so much.
Never looked back.

I'd look at the Genzler 410 array.
It's not going to sound like the SWR (nothing is) but it will be more "transparent" than the SLs.

 

[dbsfgyd1]

I was going to hijack my own recent post on the relative benefits on a pair of 210s VS a single 410, but I figured it might be better to start clean and reformulate my thoughts. (I've searched all over but haven't found quite the info I'm looking for, at least not for 2023.)

My rig = Aguilar TM 700 into either an Aguilar SL210 or SWR Goliath III 410, depending on the situation. (I've had the SL210 for a few months, and the Goliath since 2000.)

The more I play it and become familiar with the SL210's response, the less favorably it compares to the Goliath.

To my ears, in a nutshell: The GIII is my all-time favorite cab. Those drivers are lightning fast, punchy as hell, and really make my bass sing. Whatever you want to call it –hifi/transparent – that's the sound that made me want to play bass in the first place. I love love love it. The platonic ideal of a bass sound for me.

In comparison, the SL210 gets the job done, but isn't the dream cab I'd hoped for. It feels relatively flabby, wooly (love that word), and just lacks the "snap" of the G3. Sort of "anti-hifi" to my ears. Would probably be perfect for someone with a different style.



But...the GIII is SO much bulkier than contemporary neodymium cabs! I was hoping the SL210 might be my solution, but it seems not to be.

So it boils down to this...

Are there any 410 or 210 neo cabs out there that approach the hifi/transparent sound and blazing speed of my GIII? Or is that just impossible, based on the physics?

What about the much smaller Goliath Jr III? Never played one, but would consider one if the tone & response were pretty similar to the GIII.

If I added a second SL210, would that just magnify the issues of flabbiness I have, or would the response change?

Thanks for bearing with me in my pursuit for a smaller rig that matches the GIII's performance!

Eden D-210-XST IMO is the best cab I've played through. Not a neo, and is heavy by today's standards as is was designed to be on the road right down to the thick steel grille. As for the sound, is would be every thing you want. It has a great frequency range, rated at 500 watts and it is very efficient. Wasenex did a calulation for me that when powered at 400 watts it will put out 129 dB. But, like SWR, Eden is no longer in business.

That is the technical side of the equation. On the job the cab just sounds right. it is responsive, clear, solid low end and for a 210 cab, 129 dBs is no joke. I play in a 12 member vocal horn band. Trying to cut through 4,000 watts of vocal monitors pointed at the singers ankles ( they are all over seventy and probably deaf anway) but focused right where I stand is a challenge, but it cuts through.

 

[arbiterusa]

I will leave some advice for the OP if they decide to go hunting for GoLights.

The 15s actually sound the most like the SWR Goliaths. The mids are perfect.

It took me five years to find my second 410 after I got my first. They are rare and hard to find.

Don't get the Marcus Miller 410 version, it is sealed.

Also buy from a place that has a return option. You can still get the drivers, but sometimes unscrupulous people will steal the speakers out of them and replace them with something heavy and not suited for the cabinet. So you want to have that return option.

The cover Tuki makes for them is an inch too short.

 

[TonyP-]

My Gallien-krueger cabs have always been super clear - used a NEO 410 in the past, and a 210 CX currently

I was going to suggest the 210 CX (not just because I'm a GK artist) I don't suggest them for everything, however the ceramics of the CX series most certainly respond differently then the NEOs for sure. I like the CX 210 a lot.

 

[Rip Van Dan]

I was going to hijack my own recent post on the relative benefits on a pair of 210s VS a single 410, but I figured it might be better to start clean and reformulate my thoughts. (I've searched all over but haven't found quite the info I'm looking for, at least not for 2023.)

My rig = Aguilar TM 700 into either an Aguilar SL210 or SWR Goliath III 410, depending on the situation. (I've had the SL210 for a few months, and the Goliath since 2000.)

The more I play it and become familiar with the SL210's response, the less favorably it compares to the Goliath.

To my ears, in a nutshell: The GIII is my all-time favorite cab. Those drivers are lightning fast, punchy as hell, and really make my bass sing. Whatever you want to call it –hifi/transparent – that's the sound that made me want to play bass in the first place. I love love love it. The platonic ideal of a bass sound for me.

In comparison, the SL210 gets the job done, but isn't the dream cab I'd hoped for. It feels relatively flabby, wooly (love that word), and just lacks the "snap" of the G3. Sort of "anti-hifi" to my ears. Would probably be perfect for someone with a different style.

But...the GIII is SO much bulkier than contemporary neodymium cabs! I was hoping the SL210 might be my solution, but it seems not to be.

So it boils down to this...

Are there any 410 or 210 neo cabs out there that approach the hifi/transparent sound and blazing speed of my GIII? Or is that just impossible, based on the physics?

What about the much smaller Goliath Jr III? Never played one, but would consider one if the tone & response were pretty similar to the GIII.

If I added a second SL210, would that just magnify the issues of flabbiness I have, or would the response change?

Thanks for bearing with me in my pursuit for a smaller rig that matches the GIII's performance!

If you can find them (DNA recently closed its manufacturing) the DNS-210 and DNS-410 would be a good choice. I have both and they are not only the clearest, clearest sound but also are the most articulate cabs I've ever had or used. And the bottom end is not week at all. It is tight, focused, and full. The 410 will play the fundamental down to 37Hz and the 210 will play it down to 34Hz.

If you can't find one of those look at the Eden D410XST and D210XST. Not quite as clear, clean, and articulate but still with a very solid bottom end. They were the last cabs David Nordschow designed at Eden before he left to found DNA. So they are the previous generation to his DNA cabs. Their main drawback is that the D410XST is heavy at 95-lbs. Good news is that there were/are a lot of them sold throughout the years and you can find often them used for around $500 or less.

 

[Shawntastic]

I was going to hijack my own recent post on the relative benefits on a pair of 210s VS a single 410, but I figured it might be better to start clean and reformulate my thoughts. (I've searched all over but haven't found quite the info I'm looking for, at least not for 2023.)

My rig = Aguilar TM 700 into either an Aguilar SL210 or SWR Goliath III 410, depending on the situation. (I've had the SL210 for a few months, and the Goliath since 2000.)

The more I play it and become familiar with the SL210's response, the less favorably it compares to the Goliath.

To my ears, in a nutshell: The GIII is my all-time favorite cab. Those drivers are lightning fast, punchy as hell, and really make my bass sing. Whatever you want to call it –hifi/transparent – that's the sound that made me want to play bass in the first place. I love love love it. The platonic ideal of a bass sound for me.

In comparison, the SL210 gets the job done, but isn't the dream cab I'd hoped for. It feels relatively flabby, wooly (love that word), and just lacks the "snap" of the G3. Sort of "anti-hifi" to my ears. Would probably be perfect for someone with a different style.

But...the GIII is SO much bulkier than contemporary neodymium cabs! I was hoping the SL210 might be my solution, but it seems not to be.

So it boils down to this...

Are there any 410 or 210 neo cabs out there that approach the hifi/transparent sound and blazing speed of my GIII? Or is that just impossible, based on the physics?

What about the much smaller Goliath Jr III? Never played one, but would consider one if the tone & response were pretty similar to the GIII.

If I added a second SL210, would that just magnify the issues of flabbiness I have, or would the response change?

Thanks for bearing with me in my pursuit for a smaller rig that matches the GIII's performance!

Well, I Don't know how you feel about Ampeg, but I use similar sized speakers as you but Ampeg brand. I have a ported 410 cab I use with a high powered hybrid head for bigger gigs and I just bought a solid state 150 watt micro head paired with a great sounding 210 cab for smaller gigs and taking back and forth to practices.. The Ampeg 210AV has a pronounced midrange and great highs even though it has no high frequency driver. It's a sealed cab. It's rated at 200 watts.
Everything is subjective, so try one out if you get a chance. Personally, I was shocked at how good this silly looking amp sounds. It's not SUPER loud, but it IS loud! I mean it's 150 watts, what do you expect, right? It's definitely worth a test drive though. We played a large restaurant and it easily filled that entire place with clean, defined bass. It's on my best purchases list for sure. Oh, and it's ridiculously light and easy to throw in the car!
Best of luck!
Shawna