Enjoy the benefits of a premium membership!
Upgrade Account
-
TalkBass has been independent since 1998. Add your voice.
Create a free account to reply to discussions, view embedded media, and browse with fewer display ads.
Join free Log in
Want zero display ads or expanded classifieds tools? Compare plans.
Best wood for bass?
- Thread starter Aidan Engel
- Start date
Lighten up Francis........ Don't take life so seriously!
The topic for discussion is Wood, not pickups, not strings, not, well, you get the idea!
Let's get back on topic, please.
Gotta love wood..................
Lighten up Francis........ Don't take life so seriously!
I only take others lives, seriously...
yo
it is all subjective and ruled by emotions not science.
ur dealing with art, not science. many portraits are on canvas but others are on other media. Some are charcoal, some are oil... You get the picture.
it is all subjective and ruled by emotions not science.
Beautiful! I've always wanted to try an ironwood neck. Can ironwood be left unfinished or does it have to be sealed?
...and enjoy the holiday season!
Now back to the topic at hand (that the OP doesn't seem to have been a part of since the original post). Hmmmm?
A guy I knew back in the '70s made a guitar with a nice chunk of ironwood for a body; his father was a sculptor and had lots of cool stuff around the shop we'd use for projects. The neck was from a Telecaster he had and the pickups were Gibson humbuckers from.......I don't recall where we got those! Hmm....... It was a heavy but very toneful monster. 
I sanded the neck in increments all the way down to 1400 grit, then used boiled linseed oil. It's best if you don't seal it with poly or coating, just rubbed oil. The natural wood can be polished to a glass-like finish. It's tough on tools and you have to be patient but I think the two woods sound and feel amazing together. I spray lemon oil on the ebony once in awhile, maybe twice a year.
The finish colors are different depending on what board you start with. Here's a shot of 2 other Ironwood necks I made along with the one installed. Granted the one on the right has been sanded and polished much more with the BLO along with many hours of oil from my hands but the color is the same as when I first made it.
Some of us are talking past each other. Few if any are saying that wood doesn't matter at all. I've owned identical instruments that sounded different, and I tend to have a preference for alder over swamp ash... etc. So as I've said, wood does matter to some extent: not just tone, but (even more important to me) dead spots.
However some exaggerate the differences. It's all well and good if you hear a striking difference between your ash/maple and alder/rosewood J-basses, but your bandmates probably won't. They are FAR more likely to notice the difference in tone if you switch from soloing the neck pickup to soloing the bridge pickup on the same J-bass. Likewise, they are more likely to notice the difference between flats and rounds (unless you like to roll off a lot of treble).
Many also discount the variable nature of wood. They believe that Wood A always gives Tone X, Wood B always gives Tone Y. When I was young I went with the common generality of "maple fingerboard bright, rosewood fingerboard warm". It's never that simple because each species of wood can have a range of tones (as many who have ordered instruments can attest). After awhile I realized that there were so many exceptions to the rules (even within the same make and model) that I discarded my preconceptions and did my best to listen with my ears rather than with my eyes. The fact is that if you strongly believe something is true, then your brain will do its best to confirm that belief, including manipulation of your senses.
As purist as some are about wood, there are some great sounding instruments made of Lucite, "Luthite", graphite/composite, metal, etc. Not to mention really oddball woods (such as ironwood) that few would consider using for a musical instrument!
However some exaggerate the differences. It's all well and good if you hear a striking difference between your ash/maple and alder/rosewood J-basses, but your bandmates probably won't. They are FAR more likely to notice the difference in tone if you switch from soloing the neck pickup to soloing the bridge pickup on the same J-bass. Likewise, they are more likely to notice the difference between flats and rounds (unless you like to roll off a lot of treble).
Many also discount the variable nature of wood. They believe that Wood A always gives Tone X, Wood B always gives Tone Y. When I was young I went with the common generality of "maple fingerboard bright, rosewood fingerboard warm". It's never that simple because each species of wood can have a range of tones (as many who have ordered instruments can attest). After awhile I realized that there were so many exceptions to the rules (even within the same make and model) that I discarded my preconceptions and did my best to listen with my ears rather than with my eyes. The fact is that if you strongly believe something is true, then your brain will do its best to confirm that belief, including manipulation of your senses.
A guy I knew back in the '70s made a guitar with a nice chunk of ironwood for a body; his father was a sculptor and had lots of cool stuff around the shop we'd use for projects. The neck was from a Telecaster he had and the pickups were Gibson humbuckers from.......I don't recall where we got those! Hmm....... It was a heavy but very toneful monster.
As purist as some are about wood, there are some great sounding instruments made of Lucite, "Luthite", graphite/composite, metal, etc. Not to mention really oddball woods (such as ironwood) that few would consider using for a musical instrument!
Yep, when it comes to the tone of a bass, wood matters.
How MUCH it matters depends on a lot of things, namely...
What types of wood used
How the bass is constructed - plank body, hippie sandwich, bolt on, neck through
How well the player can distinguish tonal differences
How well others listening to it can distinguish tonal differences
What environment it's being played in while trying to spot the tonal difference - solo, studio, on stage in a mix
What media is being used to try and spot the difference - in person, headphones, YouTube on an iPad
What method is being used to try and spot the difference - player, blind test, double blind test
I'm obviously in the wood matters camp but even I would agree that a hippie sandwich type build with multiple layers of multiple wood types and a multi layer multi wood neck through construction played in a loud frantic metal band in a crowded bar would make it impossible for a random audience member that has been blindfolded to hear the difference if the bass was swapped out for a similar one but with different woods.
Heck, in that setting I'd bet the random blindfolded audience member couldn't tell if a bass pickup was swapped out from a Bartolini humbucker to an EMG single coil or the strings were swapped out from chrome rounds to stainless rounds or if the amp was swapped out from a Mesa to an Eden. Yet we all know and agree without question that pickups, strings and amps have a huge impact on the tone of a bass.
How MUCH it matters depends on a lot of things, namely...
What types of wood used
How the bass is constructed - plank body, hippie sandwich, bolt on, neck through
How well the player can distinguish tonal differences
How well others listening to it can distinguish tonal differences
What environment it's being played in while trying to spot the tonal difference - solo, studio, on stage in a mix
What media is being used to try and spot the difference - in person, headphones, YouTube on an iPad
What method is being used to try and spot the difference - player, blind test, double blind test
I'm obviously in the wood matters camp but even I would agree that a hippie sandwich type build with multiple layers of multiple wood types and a multi layer multi wood neck through construction played in a loud frantic metal band in a crowded bar would make it impossible for a random audience member that has been blindfolded to hear the difference if the bass was swapped out for a similar one but with different woods.
Heck, in that setting I'd bet the random blindfolded audience member couldn't tell if a bass pickup was swapped out from a Bartolini humbucker to an EMG single coil or the strings were swapped out from chrome rounds to stainless rounds or if the amp was swapped out from a Mesa to an Eden. Yet we all know and agree without question that pickups, strings and amps have a huge impact on the tone of a bass.
I was talking to the luthier at my local shop a few years back when I was buying an acoustic guitar. I found one That I really liked the sound of. He was saying how interesting it was to hear the slight tone difference due to the player. Not just the style, but the actual person. A fat guy with stubby fingers might sound different than a skinny girl with slim fingers. I'm sure it is more noticable on an acoustic instrument, but I bet there is something there on an electric as well. I wonder if there is some science on the effects of bodyfat on tone?
Well, if you're going to be "that guy", I believe you mean "accurate" rather than "precise."
Not to pile on, but I can't seem to find the pronoun in your first sentence.
Remember, TB has a broad demographic. There are amateurnouns as well as pronouns that post here.
As far as the science goes, when you adjust the tension on a string you are setting it's resonant frequency i.e. the the frequency that a material vibrates at, different materials have different resonant frequencies, and will only vibrate through eachother if the frequencies are the same. These vibrations create two types of waves, Transverse waves and Compression waves. Compression waves are what everyone hears, they are the soundwaves exiting through your amp or cabinet or whatever is producing your sound, bouncing off the walls of the room (and in the case of acoustic instruments, through the body) and into your ear drum where it is interpreted, but pickups aren't microphonic, they only measure the movement of the strings (transverse waves), which are the way the strings vibrate. So even if the body wood does have the same resonant frequency as the string your are plucking (which you realistically couldn't control) then it most likely wouldn't even get through the bridge or nut. If it did, it would only affect one specific frequency or overtone (perhaps not a good thing.)
On top of all of that there usually hundreds of variables that affect the way a tree grows, i.e. species, weather, nutrient/resource levels, etc. that affect the way that the grain forms. So even if you wanted specifically alder for example you could only get a general set of almost random characteristics.
That's not to say wood doesn't matter though, players can feel the way that different woods vibrate (although from compression waves), the weight of the body wood does matter, there is a strong argument for psycho-acoustics (I feel that it is different, therefore it is), and hell, perhaps the minimal acoustic sound of the instrument you are playing flavors the electric sound in some way (depending on the scenario of course.)
So really the bottom line for looking at basses, is whether or not it sounds and feels good, and whether or not you could realistically stand while holding it for an extended period of time (at least for players who play/gig standing up.)
On top of all of that there usually hundreds of variables that affect the way a tree grows, i.e. species, weather, nutrient/resource levels, etc. that affect the way that the grain forms. So even if you wanted specifically alder for example you could only get a general set of almost random characteristics.
That's not to say wood doesn't matter though, players can feel the way that different woods vibrate (although from compression waves), the weight of the body wood does matter, there is a strong argument for psycho-acoustics (I feel that it is different, therefore it is), and hell, perhaps the minimal acoustic sound of the instrument you are playing flavors the electric sound in some way (depending on the scenario of course.)
So really the bottom line for looking at basses, is whether or not it sounds and feels good, and whether or not you could realistically stand while holding it for an extended period of time (at least for players who play/gig standing up.)
There's theory and there's reality, sometimes the two don't align perfectly. Usually when that happens it's because the theory is based on incorrect or incomplete data. My actual first hand experience (which is data you don't have) indicates that different woods can impact the tone of a bass. Therefore, I'll continue to believe in my reality vs your theory. But thanks anyway!
