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Better with age?

Matt Dean

Matt Dean

Supporting Member
Jan 2, 2007
11,746
21,356
SF (North) Bay Area
#1
I wanted to post this on an older thread... classic old cabs, but it didn't turn up in my search...

Anyway, we quickly concluded at one point in the thread that speakers did not get better with age because of the wear and tear caused by use eventually wears out the speaker components.


However, I was thinking tonight that maybe the changes in the wood cabinet over time might make a classic old cab sound better...

What do you think?
 
#2
Eh, I don't think so. The wood's purpose in a cab isn't to provide acoustic properties like it is in a bass. I've got three identical 15" cabs, one made in 64, two made in the last year. They all sound exactly alike to my ears.
 
#3
although the speakers becoming aged and wearing causes them function wise not to be better. Maybe certain speakers designs create unique characteristics as they are worn and deteriorate that some may consider desirable.

Such as say how some may like the sound of old tubes with weaker outputs.

Disclaimer: My advice was worth what you paid for it. (Which you may pay me however much you like)
 
#6
Matt Dean said:
Anyway, we quickly concluded at one point in the thread that speakers did not get better
Click to expand...
'We' are incorrect. As drivers are used their resonant frequency continues to go down for years, even decades, and bass response improves with age. OTOH driver technology also improves with each new generation of drivers, so the very best of 20 years ago are at best fair to middling today.

However, I was thinking tonight that maybe the changes in the wood cabinet over time might make a classic old cab sound better...
Click to expand...
Those changes would only be damage, rot and failing joinery, none being desirable.
 
#7
JimmyM said:
Eh, I don't think so. The wood's purpose in a cab isn't to provide acoustic properties like it is in a bass. I've got three identical 15" cabs, one made in 64, two made in the last year. They all sound exactly alike to my ears.
Click to expand...

First off.... A cab made in 64 will NOT be "identical" to one made last year.

I'll have you know, Wood does mature after it's cut from the tree. So if you look after your cab propper, over years to come, you will hear a difference. Just because they sound the same to YOUR ears, doesn't mean to say they sound the same to mine, or anyone else on here.

Sorry to p*** all over your bonfire, but it's a know fact that wood matures and in time will sound warmer. Put the same speakers in a 60's cab made of the same wood as one today (it does take a good few years) and tell me they sound the same...
If you do, i suggest you get your ears cleaned.
 
#8
DanFold said:
First off.... A cab made in 64 will NOT be "identical" to one made last year.

I'll have you know, Wood does mature after it's cut from the tree. So if you look after your cab propper, over years to come, you will hear a difference. Just because they sound the same to YOUR ears, doesn't mean to say they sound the same to mine, or anyone else on here.

Sorry to p*** all over your bonfire, but it's a know fact that wood matures and in time will sound warmer. Put the same speakers in a 60's cab made of the same wood as one today (it does take a good few years) and tell me they sound the same...
If you do, i suggest you get your ears cleaned.
Click to expand...
OK, genius. Whatever you say. Bill Fitzmaurice said the exact opposite, so I guess you know more than him.
 
#9
I don't know about cabs, but I've been using 2 JBL E140's for 20 years in different 2x15 cabs and they still sound pretty good to my ears. Maybe I should get my ears cleaned, too?
 
#11
MNAirHead said:
I know this may be out of line with the question..

Most good sound guys go direct to the board.. "new" amp setups are sounding good for a single player in a bedroom and collide with a overall band sound.
Click to expand...
You're right...it IS out of line with the question...also not true. They'll take my cab mic out of my cold dead fingers, pal.
 
#12
Wow... strong opinions. Civility anyone?

Anyway...

'We' are incorrect. As drivers are used their resonant frequency continues to go down for years, even decades, and bass response improves with age.
Click to expand...

Interesting... Bill, can you tell us what causes the driver's resonant frequency response to deepen over time and through use?

Thanks!
 
#14
Now that I'm well past 50, I think I will use that "The WOOD is warmer with age" thing... Maybe if I say it enough somebody will believe me.

PS, I pealed the tolex off my oldest 810 cab yesterday to prep it for a LINE-X truck liner treatment and I wasn't very impressed with the AGING of the "wood like substance" used in that cab. BOB
 
#17
My 22 year old Peavey 2x15 cab with the original Black Widows, the ones with the silver dust caps, sounds as fat and full and wonderful as ever. It definitely has that nicely broken in tactile response that comes from a good older cab. I also wonder when the day will come that one or both speakers give up the ghost. I like the the tone for what it is in the way of a bigger cab of the type, and have no desire to reload as them old BW's sound mighty fine.

This thread is interesting as I find guitar players to worry a lot about speaker break in, let alone flogging some ancient Celestions or Jensens, etc, more so than we bass players talk about the subjects. I do know some guitar amp tone geeks that worship at the altar of botique speaker cabs made out of 100 year old aged pine pulled from scrapped barns and such. Anyways I do smile at the comment that one wag made when they said ' When guitar players look for a new amp rig they go to garage sales. We bass players go to the science fair instead.'
 
#18
Matt Dean said:
Interesting... Bill, can you tell us what causes the driver's resonant frequency response to deepen over time and through use?

Thanks!
Click to expand...
The same thing that makes shoes get more comfortable with age: flexing of the suspension continues to soften it. An EVM12L I bought in 1974 had an Fs of 53 Hz after break-in. With each successive cab I used it in it measured a bit lower. The last time I measured it, about 1998, Fs was down to 48Hz.
 
#19
Since board wood is entirely unsuitable for bass enclosures you can pretty much forget the "tone wood" goofiness some guitarists with too much money seem to be into. For bass it's generally about plywood with lots of plys, and rigidity. One can go with quality lighter-wood-derived ply like Italian poplar, or denser plywood like Finnish or Baltic birch if you want longevity and quality.

Old plywood? Check the bracing, and the glue.
 

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