Big E Speakers Part 4 - Quadraphenia

[lelandcrooks]

Yes, I seem to recall us looking at these guys before. I've read articles about them and what they do. I believe we have two different definitions of vortex, or at least how to apply it. They attempt to destroy it utterly IIRC, and we harvest it. Don't hold me exactly to that, it's been a year or two.

 

[kesslari]

"Use the Vortex, Luke..."

 

[MarkA]

@tombowlus I am guessing that you utilize the crossover in the sub -- that is, you run your speaker cable out of the amp, into the sub, out of the sub and into the 66? I know the sub crosses over pretty high, and it seems counter-intuitive that the 66 cab doesn't contribute to the low end.

Actually, I've been running it mostly into the 66 first, and then into the sub.

Using the 46 + Flex sub, I had been running into the sub first, but you guys got me to try it both ways. There is a difference. Into the 46 first is more even and hi-fi, into the sub first is less even, more dark and meaty. Gotta try it live, but those are my impressions goofing around with it at home just now.

While on the subject of the 46 + sub, I've mentioned before that Mike recommends elevating the stack (it's a small enough stack). Flat on the floor, I feel I've got to cut some bass - depending on how your bass control is voiced, this might not be ideal. Elevated, there is still plenty of bass with the knob (tried this with a KXB 500 and a Mesa Walkabout) set flat and the overall sound is more clear, with room to boost if you want to. I also tried the stack with a foam Ampwedge shoved underneath, angling it up a good amount (15-20 degrees), and like the balance and clarity that way. You can hear the sound changing as you angle it up - kind of like dialing down a sub bass control. (Possibly useful outdoors?) I even tried the sub on top briefly -- don't recall exactly what that was like except that it, also, was different. . I haven't explored any of these phenomena in depth, yet.

46 + sub elevated still has more native bass than the 112. Takes a little boost to get the 112 EQed roughly the same, but the cabs still have their own distinct characters.

 

[prikkers]

I'm very intrigued by these MAS vortex cabs and am interested in the lighter ones like the mas45.5, m 109, mas109 or 46.
can anyone compare them sound wise with more mainstream 1x12 cabs like aguilar Sl112,Berg CN112/hd 112, Epifani, Glockenklang ?
I know these cabs quite well or owned them and would be interested how they compare ( also know the tc112 as only super 12).
Play both electric and upright , bowed as well.
My current cab is a Glock space Art , very nice but quite heavy and not super powerful.

 

[thumbs&fingers]

I suggest you find someone near you that owns one of the mad cabs. there thi there is nothing, in my opinion, like these cabs. If u compare them side by side you will detect the obvious differences. Comparing MAS cabs to each other, differences are more subtle. Some MAS cabs work differently depending on the type of amp (solid state, tube, hybrid), there are MAS cabs designed to work best with each.

 

[kesslari]

I'm very intrigued by these MAS vortex cabs and am interested in the lighter ones like the mas45.5, m 109, mas109 or 46.
can anyone compare them sound wise with more mainstream 1x12 cabs like aguilar Sl112,Berg CN112/hd 112, Epifani, Glockenklang ?
I know these cabs quite well or owned them and would be interested how they compare ( also know the tc112 as only super 12).
Play both electric and upright , bowed as well.
My current cab is a Glock space Art , very nice but quite heavy and not super powerful.

What part of the country are you in? As thumbs said, best to hear and compare for yourself.
TomBowlus is probably the person who can best "compare" them to other high end speakers. Most of the rest of us just don't have the full range of gear to try.

 

[tombowlus]

What part of the country are you in? As thumbs said, best to hear and compare for yourself.
TomBowlus is probably the person who can best "compare" them to other high end speakers. Most of the rest of us just don't have the full range of gear to try.

I have a MAS-210Flex, as well as a 66/110 rig, and I was able to spend some time with three different iterations of the MAS-112. In general, the MAS cabs seem to go deeper than most conventional cabs, and they are smoother than most conventional cabs. Some other high quality bass cabs, like Invalid Link Removed, can sound a bit more full in the mids and can have a bit more "attack" to the note.

At this level, it's definitely a matter of "different flavors of great."

 

[prikkers]

Thanks for the replies! I live in the netherlands/europe, until now I know nobody who plays them over here but if someone does please pm me
I like the deep and smooth thing but do they cut through the mix as well?
Amp is a Glock Blue Sky , I reckon that it should be sufficient powerful for a medium loud gig with a 46/109....

 

[tombowlus]

Thanks for the replies! I live in the netherlands/europe, until now I know nobody who plays them over here but if someone does please pm me
I like the deep and smooth thing but do they cut through the mix as well?
Amp is a Glock Blue Sky , I reckon that it should be sufficient powerful for a medium loud gig with a 46/109....

Some cabs cut through a mix because of a peak or bump in a given region. This can be helpful if your amp doesn't have the juice to compete in the mix from top to bottom. My experience with the MAS cabs is that they don't really have these peaks or bumps; they have a solid stance in the mix, from top to bottom. If you are competing with a loud mix - as I often do - this does mean that your amp needs to be able to keep up. No cheating because your cab has a spike that will cut through, no matter what! But you don't need gob tons of power to do this. Just a competent amp, IME/IMHO. Your Blue Sky should be more than up to the task.

Personally, I prefer the "solid, balanced presence in the mix" to dealing with a peak or bump (which can be hard to get rid of, if it happens to interfere with another instrument).

 

[MrBEAR]

Snipped

I like the deep and smooth thing but do they cut through the mix as well?
Amp is a Glock Blue Sky , I reckon that it should be sufficient powerful for a medium loud gig with a 46/109....

I am still living in the median world of signature 1x12 MAS Cabinets.
I have used up to three with a HeartRock II.
One and two with a Bass Art Classic.
Same for the Blue Sky.

You will be fine with your Blue Sky and your final decision on a MAS Cab with the tone profile/output of your liking.

If you like to manage lists. Here are the amps I have run MAS Cabs with.

The aforementioned Glockenklang amps.

Schroeder, Matchless, and Satellite Tube amps.

Aquilar TH 350 & 500, Warwick LWA1000, Ashdown. These are the class D amps.

Without reservation they all sounded very good, some more so than others.

Least favorite?
Aguilar TH series

Favorite?

SS - Glockenklang HR II for live, Bass Art Classic in studio.

Tube - Schroeder Dozer & DB7

All the best with your quest.

 

[31HZ]

@MrBEAR , that's about the first mention I've seen of a Schroeder Dozer on TB. Been wondering what it's like, as my guitar-playing business partner has a Schroeder head and raves about it. He's gotten to know Tim a bit and insists that he is one of those guys with golden ears (and is a good guy to boot).

 

[MarkA]

I agree with what Tom wrote, above. I do think that the different cabs have their own voices, but there's nothing ganky or obnoxious unless you put it in.

My original reason for looking into the MAS cabs was out of frustration with not being able clearly to hear what I was doing in loud, busy mixes and they have been better for this than anything else that I've played. I base this both on my own experience playing them and on hearing them from the audience when other players have sat-in with my rig.

 

[MarkA]

By the way, nice review, Tom. Read it through (for the second time, I think), including all the geeky bench stuff.

 

[tombowlus]

By the way, nice review, Tom. Read it through (for the second time, I think), including all the geeky bench stuff.

Thanks!

 

[spiritbass]

My original reason for looking into the MAS cabs was out of frustration with not being able clearly to hear what I was doing in loud, busy mixes and they have been better for this than anything else that I've played.

Amen. Specs don't matter. Looks only matter if you're in a period-correct cover band. The crux of the biscuit is how well you and others can hear what you are playing! Mike has mentioned it to me more than once, and I agree, that with electric bass, your cab is part of your instrument.

 

[nostatic]

crux of the biscuit

I can't wait for their new album.

 

[MarkA]

Mike has mentioned it to me more than once, and I agree, that with electric bass, your cab is part of your instrument.

I largely agree with this sentiment - I've mentioned that one of the things that attracted me to the cabs is their ability to bring to electric playing some of the sense of tactile connection that I associate with acoustic instruments. The sonic presentation is reminiscent of acoustic instruments as well - more open/less "boxy" than most cabs, particularly at gig volumes.

I can't wait for their new album.

Like, you're into all these obscure bands, lately.

 

[spiritbass]

Another excellent summation, Mark. I totally agree, but could not have said it as well. The immediacy of response/tactile feel of playing these cabs is what has to be heard and felt to be appreciated - nothing else IME compares.

 

[MrBEAR]

@MrBEAR , that's about the first mention I've seen of a Schroeder Dozer on TB. Been wondering what it's like, as my guitar-playing business partner has a Schroeder head and raves about it. He's gotten to know Tim a bit and insists that he is one of those guys with golden ears (and is a good guy to boot).

DB7, SA9, or Formula 50 head?

I seriously recommend that you do not plug into his head and wire up your bass cabinet.
I have a DB7 and the Dozer. The quietest tube amps I have ever owned.

Golden Ears on Tim for sure.

 

[prikkers]

A lot of very useful information! and very positive adjectives; not boxy, open, tactile presentation, responds like an acoustic instrument ...
All the things I'm looking for in a great bass cab.
I'll contact mike arnopol to figure out which one is best suited for me and then go on with the painful part of shipping and importing to Europe
Big thanks to all of you for your replies!!!