Upon their introduction, decades ago, blond DBs -- not just Kay/Engles but Epiphones as well --were marketed to jazz/big band bassists as the top of the line show instrument. But that was decades ago.
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Double Bass Blonde Basses in Jazz
- Thread starter vanderbrook
- Start date
Here in Northern AZ I've found the stability of plywood really handy. And while I can't claim to have the most exacting ears, I and my renters have been very happy with the Realist on the ES-9. I liked the Full Circle, too, until it broke. Again, a good setup is super-important on these basses, very likely including a neck reset to firm up the joint.
Just to clarify, I do have two more shops to visit before I'll have seen all that Denver has to offer. One is a reputable luthier who is also a Shen dealer. The other is a newer shop with which I am unfamiliar, but which my maybe-teacher recommends.
I've seen Dave Holland with Sam Rivers' Trio and Robert Hurst play blonde basses. I think many would be more turned off by an Englehardt, in general, as they aren't especially highly regarded among pros and don't seem like a bass for a serious bassist. IMO, play what sounds and plays well for you.
Eric, some of the early ones are pretty decent, if a little stiff and overbuilt. But you can make sounds that approximate music on a good Engel if you find one.
I know plenty of people playing for their supper on Engelhardt basses, and lower forms of bass life.
I know plenty of people playing for their supper on Engelhardt basses, and lower forms of bass life.
I had been wondering when this comment would crop up... it being more about the maker than the finish. It's a little sad; with Lemur's upgrades and setup, it's really not a bad bass (unless one intended to use it in an orchestra). But the prejudice is real...
would this one be considered blonde? its my main bass (for jazz)
New Bass: new Schnitzer/de Sola model
New Bass: new Schnitzer/de Sola model
Not about the maker, per se, but their product! Yeah, they can sound pretty good, although one dimensional as many plys do, and a couple of tweaked ones I've played were nice for what they are, but... They are still inexpensive ply basses with mediocre appointments (tuners, endpins, some with flatish painted fingerboards, weird neck shaping, etc. But, play what makes you feel good.
Nobody's going to care that it's blonde.
+1 on the wait til you get to SoCal. A big bass will be a PITA to haul around when you're moving a bunch of stuff and trying to make sure the instrument is not going take some damage. That and that I've always been impressed with the SB80's. If I were to get an inexpensive ply, that's always my first choice.
+1 on the wait til you get to SoCal. A big bass will be a PITA to haul around when you're moving a bunch of stuff and trying to make sure the instrument is not going take some damage. That and that I've always been impressed with the SB80's. If I were to get an inexpensive ply, that's always my first choice.
I've got a couple of blonde basses ('48 Epi, '45 Swingmaster) and can definitely say that the color of the instruments is the least of my issues...
okcrum
in your chest
I was thinking the same thing when I started looking last year, but found a great deal on a Krutz hybrid in Flagstaff. So far, so good with basic humidity control and keeping it out of direct sun. It sounds quite nice mic'ed for recording too, even without the pickup track blended in. That was a big consideration in going with a carved top.
Can you rent the blonde bass until you move?
If you're firmly attached to it, buy it later.
If not, return it. You won't have to ship it, & you can go shopping later in SoCal (or along your way there
).
Ask to hire-purchase it, where rental costs get taken off the total cost. Win-Win.
You'll also need some time to sell your EB's if you want to get the best price for them.
If you're firmly attached to it, buy it later.
If not, return it. You won't have to ship it, & you can go shopping later in SoCal (or along your way there
). Ask to hire-purchase it, where rental costs get taken off the total cost. Win-Win.
You'll also need some time to sell your EB's if you want to get the best price for them.
I assume that one of your stops will be at Bob Ross' shop in Denver. He carries Shen basses and whenever I've been in there, has several on hand. Bob is very well regarded; does excellent work and is a really nice guy to boot.
One of the first basses I looked at (and brought home on trial) was an SB88. Luthier had three of 'em; I picked the one that sounded best with hybrid strings, and had him put Spiros on it. Brought it home ...meh. Took it back.
The Swingmaster is in the hands of a private seller, who no longer plays and wants to sell because he's getting ready to move. I don't foresee a rental situation here.Can you rent the blonde bass until you move?
If you're firmly attached to it, buy it later.
If not, return it. You won't have to ship it, & you can go shopping later in SoCal (or along your way there
Ask to hire-purchase it, where rental costs get taken off the total cost. Win-Win.
You'll also need some time to sell your EB's if you want to get the best price for them.
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It has occurred to me that any prejudice against an Engelhardt I might encounter would likely come from other bassists. I doubt that guitarists, pianists, horn players, etc. are likely to care what the label inside says. So I'm thinking having an Engelhardt might cost me, at the worst, some sub jobs.
Either way, I should be looking at a Shen SB150 before I make the call...
For sure. Bob let me try an SB88, and I'll be looking at an SB150 he has. Will also be visiting Mi Vida Strings per a recommendation from a fellow who may become my teacher.
A couple of comments: Once again, I'm in agreement with Eric. Among DB players, the negative opinions regarding Engels are not the result of prejudice-- as in (according to Google), a "preconceived opinion that is not based on reason or actual experience." Au contraire! Those negative opinions tend to very much be based on experience. Engels are basses that, unless heavily modified, have weak, poorly-designed neck joints, thin necks that lead to substantial left-hand fatigue, low overstand and flat fingerboard projection that make the upper registers difficult to access, and overall poor sound. Although sharing a design, IME, they are a far cry from the best of their Kay ancestors. IMO, they are, except for BSOs, one of the poorest choices one can make in a ply bass.
My second comment concerns carved vs. ply tops. Throughout this thread I've sensed an undercurrent with which I've disagreed in the past. That's the notion that for jazz-- especially when playing amplified-- there's not much benefit to a carved top. While most of us understand and recognize the critical difference for arco playing, I find to be misguided the notion that it just doesn't matter for jazz pizz. There's good reason that most of our jazz pizz. idols play and played carved basses. Now, even in a situation when the amplification masks most of the sonic benefits, there will still be the difference in the feel and response of the instrument to the player. That difference, even with my own limited skills and talent, has always been quite apparent to me.
My second comment concerns carved vs. ply tops. Throughout this thread I've sensed an undercurrent with which I've disagreed in the past. That's the notion that for jazz-- especially when playing amplified-- there's not much benefit to a carved top. While most of us understand and recognize the critical difference for arco playing, I find to be misguided the notion that it just doesn't matter for jazz pizz. There's good reason that most of our jazz pizz. idols play and played carved basses. Now, even in a situation when the amplification masks most of the sonic benefits, there will still be the difference in the feel and response of the instrument to the player. That difference, even with my own limited skills and talent, has always been quite apparent to me.
I tried a 150 in his shop and really liked it. I'm one of those who has a fully carved bass and am thinking of trading down because of the issues with living in the dry west (I live in Grand Junction).
