Blown SWR Goliath Dilemma

[agedhorse]

I don’t recall the box being tuned very low at all.

 

[MIMico]

For anyone who might be following this thread, here’s an update:

I’ve focused more on the SM400 for now and experimenting with the tone for a trial period to see how well I get on with it.

I’m running it with a Broughton HPF+LPF to protect against low frequency issues and compressor to see how I like it for slap sounds. I’m using it through another cab I have and sometimes just direct sound (lpf helps this a lot).

As for the Goliath III - I’m keeping an eye on my local listings for another busted Goliath or a JR so I can maybe have enough parts to put together one working stock cab.

Pending the SM400 trial results over a few months, I’ll either a) go to a pro to get the Goliath III functioning (aka repaired with reasonably proper replacement drivers fitting the cab tuning, subject to cost constraints) or b) sell the whole rig in “as is” condition for the cab (if I decide to offload the SM400).

I’m in no particular hurry and might change my mind but I’ll try to update this thread for posterity if anything interesting happens. In all likelihood, if there’s no update after this it’s probably because nothing has happened and it’s sitting with other gear projects I have on the backburner.

 

[MIMico]

It's not like Toronto is a backwater, though. Lots of great speaker shops around, from budget to bling.

If it's me, I pay someone good to first test the other two to make sure they're still serviceable, and if so, repair the blown ones with the least crappy kits they can find.

Then be happy with the results as a budget banger, without any expectations of it being an acoustic marvel on the order of some fEarful or whatever is latest and greatest. It's an SWR, they have a sound that folks loved for a long time, even if it fell out of vogue. A 410 isn't an ideal layout anyway, so don't be too fussed about it being acoustically imperfect. My favourite amp/cab combo that I own is a noisy old Acoustic 370 on a weird vintage 215 cab with ancient Altec 421a speakers. It is a mess but sounds absolutely fantastic, especially in a room with guitar and drums. Minimal lows, minimal highs, nothing flat about it, but lots of middy 'presence'...

(About 15 years ago I picked up a Super Redhead with two blown drivers. I paid a speaker shop to rebuild them and mod to 8 ohms, an idea I stole from Brian Beller's blog, so I could stack it on a Goliath Jr 8 ohm and have a 410 running at 4 ohms to keep the amp cooler. Worked a treat and sounded like pure Redhead, but better able to keep up with others. Added a HPF to the loop to protect the speakers, though, as the SWR amps apparently didn't filter the lows at all, which supposedly contributed to many Goliath cabs blowing at reasonable volumes.)

They’re not kidding about the lack of HPF. My SM400 is early (long before the SM400S, with the fan, came along). I found when I first got it (early 2000s) that it sounded quieter than it ought to and didn’t keep up very well with the band. Adding a HPF really seemed to deal with subtracting all the low frequencies drawing energy from the core (audible range) sound.

Unfortunately I didn’t learn this before it was used as main amp for a social gathering we were playing and a friend of a friend maxed the bass and low frequency EQ sliders to compensate for the thin sound and killed a cone on the cab I had at the time.

I like your idea of considering it more as a banger than a hifi sound… I was originally thinking of this as a restoration project to its glory days but am leaning towards it being a nostalgic garage band rig like your Acoustic. After all, I initially got the SM400 because it was cheap and we were jamming lofi alt/grunge type stuff at the time.

If I ever make it a jam room fixture though, I’ll be putting a lock knob or building a cage around the master and the EQ section so no one else tries to put it up to “11” again. It also helps that I no longer play with the type of drummer who only knows how to hit the snare as hard as he possibly can (and nothing less).

 

[pepj]

This is why bespoke drivers in cabs can be a bad idea if you can't get them repaired.
Replacing PAS is not easy or cheap.
The 2510's which many go for aren't a good fit, imv.

The choice is to write the cab off and 'hope' the unfried chassis' have resale value.
And then buy a cheaper working cab.

Or, buy 4 replacements and take your chances..hence crap shoot.

 

[MIMico]

This is why bespoke drivers in cabs can be a bad idea if you can't get them repaired.
Replacing PAS is not easy or cheap.
The 2510's which many go for aren't a good fit, imv.

The choice is to write the cab off and 'hope' the unfried chassis' have resale value.
And then buy a cheaper working cab.

Or, buy 4 replacements and take your chances..hence crap shoot.

My downfall in this plan was not realizing that there was a lack of aftermarket recone kits (of significant quality). I did a basic search online before buying it and saw some recone kits… but even those became hard to find even in the few months I was researching this project. And I’ve not yet even seen an actual driver up for sale locally.

I’ve contacted a few local listings of Goliath Juniors… however the sellers haven’t been willing to entertain a reasonable price. Low supply doesn’t mean high demand but some people can’t recognize it. That’s their prerogative but I wish sellers like that would list their prices as firm.

 

[agedhorse]

The PAS 10” drivers are not an easy driver to recone either, even with factory parts.

 

[MIMico]

The PAS 10” drivers are not an easy driver to recone either, even with factory parts.

Not asking you for a deep dive into this if you don’t want to, but why are the PAS specifically hard to recone?

Asking because this project was part of several I started to “learn new things.” About wiring cabs and guitars, trying out various mods, etc. I wasn’t dead set on reconing them myself but it was something I wanted to research if it would even be feasible.

I’d still like to try my hand at reconing something sometime in the future but I’m curious what makes a specific driver easier or harder to recone.

I’ve also been researching cab tunings and driver design more generally. Do you have any offhand suggestions for a good source (online or even a book)? I’m finding lots of info in searches but filtering the signal from the noise (so to speak) is a challenge and am trying not to misinform myself.

 

[agedhorse]

The surround flange is pretty small (similar to the JBL K-110), and there’s not a lot of room to work with.

I don’t know any good resources, but a lot of what’s on the internet is terrible to downright wrong.

 

[MIMico]

Good to know! Thanks for the explanation on the specifics.

Also, yeah the amount of confusion and bad advice and voodoo on these topics that I’m finding on other sources online is obvious (even to me as a layperson). And the stuff I’m finding that seems reasonably credible is about 10,000 feet over my head or incomplete for me to grasp (e.g. good discussion of a specific use case but not handholding on the basic underlying principles).

If I do find a good reference resource, I’ll probably start a new thread to bring it to others’ attention.

 

[crazyBassClown]

I’ve also been researching cab tunings and driver design more generally. Do you have any offhand suggestions for a good source (online or even a book)? I’m finding lots of info in searches but filtering the signal from the noise (so to speak) is a challenge and am trying not to misinform myself.

A book is far more likely to be informative and correct than something random on the internet. You get what you pay for as they say.