• TalkBass has been independent since 1998. Add your voice.
    Create a free account to reply to discussions, view embedded media, and browse with fewer display ads.
    Join free Log in
    Want zero display ads or expanded classifieds tools? Compare plans.

Double Bass Bowing on Gut Strings

S

ShawnM347

May 22, 2024
5
4
#1
I’m in the market for a new bass bow and I’ve come across a few older models that are supposedly better with gut strings. I’m mostly a jazz player looking to use the bow for practice, however I was wondering what makes one bow better for gut strings than another. I am only interested in German bows, and I don’t want to buy one that would be impractical if I end up switching back to steel strings. Also, is there a significant difference between a round stick and octagonal?
Thanks.
 
#2
Not an easy question.
In my experience and for my taste and with my application of gut strings (early music), gut strings work best with a bow that can easily leave the string. That doesn't mean, the bow has to be light. Bows that sit very firmly and evenly on the string can potentially dampen or crush gut strings, while bows that have a lighter contact, bows that grab the string and then let go, potentially get more resonance and clearer, more varied articulation from gut strings.
There are light, modern bows that can work, quite heavy Dragonetti style bows, baroque bows.

Same criteria go for rosin. Grabby attack, then open and resonant. I like Leatherwood. Pops for example has a grabby attack but then tends to keep on sticking, which can sound noisy and muffled on gut strings, while not letting the string ring in a nice and open way.

If you need a modern (post 1900) bow, that works with great with gut strings, I would look for a bow that has a straighter stick or less camber than usually and not too heavy. So kinda the opposite of a typical soloistic bow. These can be found cheaply, quite often.
 
  • Like
Reactions: AGCurry
#3
It may be that those "older bows" are baroque bows or Dragonetti bows or violone bows. They are really for baroque-music specialists. There is no reason to get one unless you're interested in ancient music and authenticity.

Otherwise, older bows aren't inherently better for gut strings. Better bows are better for gut strings - and any other kind of string. Unless you have money to burn, just get a good bow.
I would use my best bow for any kind of strings.

The thing is... a BAD bow, regardless of design, can make even practicing scales difficult, or at least no fun. It's easier to identify a bad bow than it is to quantify what makes a good one. Unfortunately, as an arco novice, you don't have the experience to evaluate bows. The best advice IMO is to ask for help from an arco player, try a bunch of them with that person, and do not buy if the seller doesn't offer a trial period.

Round versus octagonal? One is not better than the other.

P.S. If you can't get to a well-stocked shop in person, String Emporium is a good online seller. Steve, the proprietor, is a bassist and will talk to you about your needs. I (and my teacher) are fully satisfied with the Dorfler I bought from that shop.
 
Last edited:
  • Like
Reactions: crd, Jeff Kissell, John Chambliss and 1 other person
#4
I play plain gut GDA in a (modern) amateur orchestral setting. I've found that bows in the 124-132 gr range worked best (for me) and the Arcus and Musing bows (same company) and the Chinese/Vingo Rainbow Bouncy are good options. Rosin is an issue (and very climate sensitive). I've used the Petz range 1-4, but have started to like the 050 rosin (I've tried just about everything else), but as mentioned above you want to note to "bite" but not stick and not have a lot of rosin static in the sound.
 
  • Like
Reactions: JBarz
#6
I didn’t know what love was (in terms of bows) until I got a @LouisF branded French/german hybrid rainbow bouncy vingo bow. I’m going to be buried with the thing because good luck prying it from my cold dead hands.
 
  • Like
Reactions: John Chambliss
#9
LouisF

Double Bass Post in thread 'Vingobow “Rainbow bouncy”'

Several years ago, I asked the folks at VIngo to make a copy of my Prochownik hybrid "Alsatian" bow (French/German frog; see attached). They did and several other TBers have order the model. I asked them if they could make a lighter version for me and they suggested using the Rainbow Bouncy with the Alsatian frog. The bow came about a week ago. It's length = 76cm; weight = 120.5g; and it's terrific. It pulls a remarkably full sound, bounces well and the small frog (as a German bow) is very comfortable. The balance point is more on the German than French side, and if I were primarily a...
  • Like
 
#11
JBarz said:
LouisF

Double Bass Post in thread 'Vingobow “Rainbow bouncy”'

Several years ago, I asked the folks at VIngo to make a copy of my Prochownik hybrid "Alsatian" bow (French/German frog; see attached). They did and several other TBers have order the model. I asked them if they could make a lighter version for me and they suggested using the Rainbow Bouncy with the Alsatian frog. The bow came about a week ago. It's length = 76cm; weight = 120.5g; and it's terrific. It pulls a remarkably full sound, bounces well and the small frog (as a German bow) is very comfortable. The balance point is more on the German than French side, and if I were primarily a...
  • Like
Click to expand...
This looks interesting, but is it a German bow or French bow? I’ve been using a smaller German bow and I find the small frog uncomfortable. Is this the same bow you are talking about?
 
As an eBay Associate, TalkBass may earn a commission from qualifying purchases.
#12
The ebay bow pictured has a Viennese or Streicher frog. I order the first of these several years ago. The design was based on a Pfretzschner bow, and had a normal German bow from. When the folks at Vingo shipped it to me, the original frog somehow cracked in shipping. They offered to replace the bow and I suggested instead that they just send a new frog -- and I asked for the Viennese frog to go along with a Kolstein Zimmerman model bow I was using in those days. The frog was a good fit (for me) and since they've been selling the German "bouncy" bow with the Viennese frog.

The from on the bow that JBarz is talking about is based on a Prochownik model that can be used as either a French or German bow (look up the thread under "Alsatian"). I've attached a photo of the original bow. Thanks
 

Attachments

  • Alsatian bow copy.JPG
    Alsatian bow copy.JPG
    607.3 KB · Views: 14
#13
LouisF said:
The ebay bow pictured has a Viennese or Streicher frog. I order the first of these several years ago. The design was based on a Pfretzschner bow, and had a normal German bow from. When the folks at Vingo shipped it to me, the original frog somehow cracked in shipping. They offered to replace the bow and I suggested instead that they just send a new frog -- and I asked for the Viennese frog to go along with a Kolstein Zimmerman model bow I was using in those days. The frog was a good fit (for me) and since they've been selling the German "bouncy" bow with the Viennese frog.

The from on the bow that JBarz is talking about is based on a Prochownik model that can be used as either a French or German bow (look up the thread under "Alsatian"). I've attached a photo of the original bow. Thanks
Click to expand...
Thanks for your help. I will inquire soon.
 

Latest posts

Top Bottom
Back