Bring back the old form.

[backin82]

I frequent TB and one other forum with a similar format, so consider how limited my scope is… The other forum I’m on looked and felt like TB, and did a similar update a few years back. I believe they are using XenForo like TB. That transition felt much easier and the updated format felt more consistent with the old format. I was expecting that the TB update would be as smooth as it was on the other forum but that hadn’t been the case so far.

I have no idea how similar or different the forums are on the back end and in terms of user traffic. There could be a variety of contributing factors far outside of my awareness.

I don’t hate the new TB, but it’s not feeling natural or comfortable yet, particularly on my phone. My desktop experience in dark mode isn’t that bad, but I do a fair amount of browsing on my phone.

I built a forum for my workplace last year, and I actually had some great discussions with one of the staff here before I did it. At the time, they were running an older, self-hosted XF software version, which allows more control over updates and things like that. However, there is a lot of time involved in making updates that stray from the basic software, and TB staff had obviously invested such time to make the site what we all experienced. Seeing what they did compared to the out-of-box software, I was amazed at the time it would have taken to create and manage all of it, especially given the number of users on this site.

I weighed the options, and decided to use the XF cloud-based software, which looks really similar to this site, but saved me countless hours of research, support, coding, etc....

I'm guessing they will slowly add in some of the organization and core features we all liked before, but I'm also guessing some of the look/feel and even basic functions may go away entirely, because they'll be too time-consuming to achieve.

 

[iiipopes]

The fact that the site is running is the biggest step forwards; you just don't realize that.

Would you rather have no talkbass or would you rather have to get used to a new user interface with the understanding that many features will return in the future?

Please don't ask pedantic questions. There was a time when there was no talkbass; there may be a time when there is no longer a talkbass. I know the mods are doing their best. To help them do their best, I provide respectful feedback.

 

[KapnK]

Dark Theme with button at the bottom of every page is all you had to say! I like it. I'm an I.T. guy and it's not going back. I've been on forums and cough, cough newsgoups for 30 years. I'm just glad that forums still exist. I much prefer them to f.b. groups where they have no desire to search or google at all. Change is inevitable. "Be water, my friend."

 

[hrodbert696]

I appreciate when change is necessary. I am finding the new format awkward to navigate. That may just be familiarity with what was before, but I find I have to make more keystrokes to get to the particular forum to review threads than before. To me, that is a step backwards, not forwards.

It may vary by browser, but on mine (Chrome on a PC), there's a drop-down menu when you click the arrow next to "Forums", where one of the choices is "Forum List," and that takes you to whatever particular forum you like. I believe that's the same number of clicks as on the old site, and it's always on the top banner, which I believe was not the case before.

Where are the dark options? Care to share?

There's the toggle at the bottom of the page, but I believe that only works during your present session and you'll need to redo it each time. To make it permanent, go to your profile, select "preferences," and right at the top is an option for "Talkbass 2024 dark" or something like that.

What is this "Achievement" nonsense? I feel like I'm being patted on the head for...nothing, really.

That existed on the old site too. It's just that those of us who have been around awhile long since blasted through all the "trophies" or whatever they were called and forgot about them. Now that we're on a new platform we're racking up "awards" again.

The one thing I wish is that the crack button, er new posts button, floated with the banner at the top of the page and I didn't have to scroll up to get to it. Small problem.

On mine (again, Chrome on a PC) New Posts is the first option in that "Forums" drop-down I mentioned earlier, and it's always at the top of the page.

I think with a lot of these things, it's only rarely that a function has actually disappeared and more often that it's just located somewhere different than we're used to it. Click around for a few days and you're likely to find most of what you thought was missing. For example, as a mod, one thing that I noticed is that the Rules/Terms of Service/FAQ that some of y'all really need to read more have disappeared from the top banner. They still exist, though - just now they're at the bottom of the page next to "Contact Us" and all that. There are some actual glitches (like the ad thing, and some issues in Classifieds) that I know Paul is working with the software vendor on fixing.

We went through all this before, I think around 2014 or so, and I remember hearing (and myself thinking) all the same things, about how terrible the "new" TB was and how we wanted the old one back. Honestly, I don't even remember what the old - the OLD old - TB looked like any more. Eight or ten years from now when this platform gets retired and we move to something current, everyone will be complaining about how THIS 2024 version of TB was so great and they hate the new one. Plus ca change...

 

[WG Plum]

On mine (again, Chrome on a PC) New Posts is the first option in that "Forums" drop-down I mentioned earlier, and it's always at the top of the page.

Yeah, it's there in the drop down on mobile, but that's now a two-click process, and it scrolls up with the thread list instead of staying at the top with the header/banner in the desktop environment. It would be nice if neither was the case and it was always there at the top of the screen. No biggy, however.

 

[ardgedee]

There's the toggle at the bottom of the page, but I believe that only works during your present session and you'll need to redo it each time. To make it permanent, go to your profile, select "preferences," and right at the top is an option for "Talkbass 2024 dark" or something like that.

When I tested it, flipping the switch affects your account on all devices.

 

[TheArchitect]

I eliminate the unnecessary things so there is no struggle.

Sounds like you may be pretty deep down your list if you are worried about this place

 

[Jack Butler]

Yeah, Paul likely had limited options. That said, fixing the security vulnerabilities does not require the user interface experience to get worse, that was a choice by someone. Not Paul, but someone in the design aspect of this. Someone that obviously is good at the technical and security part, and not good at the UI/customer experience part.

There was also a security issue. Applications like this are built using components (libraries and widgets) that are used in common across many other applications and platforms. Over time, those components become vulnerable to hacks as attackers learn and probe their weaknesses. Eventually, the creators of those components stop patching the old versions as newer more secure versions are released, or the operating systems they run on no longer support the older libraries and widgets. At that point, there's no option to continue other than upgrading.

It's somewhat analogous to the reason that certain amplifiers, pedals, etc, are no longer manufactured; either the parts that were used to make them are no longer available, or they are unable to meet newer consumer safety product requirements.

 

[logdrum]

What could have been done unless the cost was prohibitive was run 2 versions of talkbass, so users can migrate slowly. This is what I would have done but probably the cost was too high. If the the database tables and schema had to be revamped completely and not compatible for both versions, who knows. But this is not a financial website, or an online merchant or something critical to one's life like a health app or prescription web site.

It is an ENTERTAINMENT web site. I paid to support with no expectations., NOT because I have to sell stuff here. I have only done 20 or so transactions here. Member for 22 years.

Maybe if more of us supported either monetarily or using your expertise (many said they were hotshots and had the skills and experience) they could have done a smoother migration, wrote a proper requirements document and all the 6 sigma process stuff.

But you know what, with our big GOMER population, the same amount of complaints will still be there probably.

Did you complain to Fidelity and IRS when they revamped their websites and threatened to not pay your taxes and withdraw all of your 401-K?

 

[ardgedee]

Yeah, Paul likely had limited options. That said, fixing the security vulnerabilities does not require the user interface experience to get worse, that was a choice by someone. Not Paul, but someone in the design aspect of this. Someone that obviously is good at the technical and security part, and not good at the UI/customer experience part.

I strongly doubt this site got a custom design. It is probably a template modified with talkbass color choices.

Designing (UX and graphics) a bulletin board system from scratch would be a massive undertaking.

 

[Slevage]

Sounds like you may be pretty deep down your list if you are worried about this place

Second to last.

 

[Slevage]

When you buy a new car, do you intend to insist that the dealership sell you the new car, but modify the new car to look and feel exactly like your 1997 Buick LaSabre? When they scoff at you, do you intend to take your business elsewhere?

I shop until I find the car that fits my needs.
If I don’t like the car, I don’t buy it.
If I don’t like TB, I don’t buy it.

 

[DWBass]

It's just getting used to the new GUI. It's gotten better for me. Weird though, I got a message that I'm now a 10 year member but I've been a member since 2003!

 

[red_rhino]

That said, fixing the security vulnerabilities does not require the user interface experience to get worse

Changes affecting the UI are the result of the entire application stack being migrated; UI, database, backend, everything. Whether it's subjectively worse or not is just that; subjective. Patching the backend without affecting the UI is exactly what they've been doing up until now. That was no longer possible.

FWIW, I think they've done a very good job of matching the overall feel of the old TB and, for me at least, even improved it in some ways. (Works way better on my iPhone than it used to.) Over time, I'm sure there will be further enhancements and fixes, and maybe some new features that this application framework might possibly be able to support.

 

[GreyBeard]

The old platform- the software that actually instantiates the site- was end-of-lifed. This new platform is supported and will get regular updates to keep the security tight.

How about updating it to perform like the old platform

 

[Hand slap]

Yet you are still here complaining about it.

Yep, I rarely post.

 

[Jack Butler]

I strongly doubt this site got a custom design. It is probably a template modified with talkbass color choices.

Designing (UX and graphics) a bulletin board system from scratch would be a massive undertaking.

I agree. That is what I was trying to say, even if I missed the mark. You basically get "the upgrade" for the more general bulletin board and all that it entails, with minimal/no customizations.

 

[ImTheOnlyOne]

How about updating it to perform like the old platform

If my house burnt down, I'm certain I wouldn't have it rebuilt from the same blueprints.

However, I hope I'd have learned what the family and I liked best about the former home then incorporate that into the new design.

Maybe there were polls and threads seeking user commentary in advance of the move that I missed.

 

[Minimalist]

I'm in charge of our EEP systems at work. Here is the things I learned with updates:

1. It rarely goes as expected.
2. Lots of people know how it should have been done but nobody wants the job next time.
3. People will initially complaint about everything. Even if it is just that the font of the menus has changed.
4. That complaining will die down and user discover new features that they really love.
5. Bugs will get fixed.
6. Some people in the background are really stressed out. They are overworked and underpaid. Nobody is getting filthy rich with a site like talkbass.

So I raise my glass to all the people working hard to keep this site up and going. Thank you! I'm looking forward to discovering more new features that I will love.

 

[HolmeBass]

How about updating it to perform like the old platform

That is entirely out of the hands of the people who run Talkbass.

You would have to convince the developers of the platform to allow that kind of styling in their product, and then TB management to make use of those features. It is more complex than a simple reskinning.

I think the look and feel of this site is now more in line with what is seen as the current state of the art. So you are trying to convince someone to “make it worse” in their mind.

Maybe just try embracing change and putting a positive spin on it. Within a few weeks you will be used to it. The chance of you talking someone into 10’s of thousands of dollars of software dev work, if not more, is slim to none.