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Budget "Foderas"
- Thread starter bugbass
- Start date
sure thing. I emailed Mike and he said no prob. The only thing is, he asked $475 for it
* Mike Pope <[email protected]> [Thu, 04 Oct 2007 09:26:06 -0400]:
I make a 3 band preamp that is similar to the Fodera, but not tuned for their basses. It's set up like this:
>>
>> Stacked Volume/Tone
>> Balancer
>> Bass
>> Midrange
>> Treble
>> Active/Passive toggle switch
>> Midrange frequency switch
>>
>> It's very flexible. It would work great with your friend's Ibanez bass as well. The preamp in Victor's basses is the Fodera preamp in a different layout. I didn't change anything for his specifically. The 3 band with the passive tone and midrange switch is normally $475.00. If you two want to buy at the same time, I can drop the price 15% on both of them. So you can get 2 of them for a little over $800.00. That includes shipping. Let me know how that sounds and if you have any more questions. Thanks!
>> -Mike
I wasn`t thinking of any specific Fodera model, just trying to get tips of some little more affordable highend basses. I have some nice jazzbasses(AC/Sad/Fender), but I could use a different type of bass too. A bass with a ultra fast neck, very responsive and even sounding..I don`t know really. I guess I`ve been into jazzbasses for so long, I just forgot to look at all the others
If by "Fodera" you mean a generally higher end, non Fender looking instrument, there are lots of choices, especially used but I understand you may not have easy access to that. The problem is that with most basses you can't tell much by looks alone. It depends on what you want and how discriminating or "picky" you are. I've played a bunch of great looking basses over the years that I wouldn't want to own simply because they did nothing for me. A great looking bass that plays and sounds great is what I'm after... or a not so great looking bass that plays and sounds great. I need at least those two attributes.
Good luck.
If by "Fodera" you mean a generally higher end, non Fender looking instrument, there are lots of choices, especially used but I understand you may not have easy access to that. The problem is that with most basses you can't tell much by looks alone. It depends on what you want and how discriminating or "picky" you are. I've played a bunch of great looking basses over the years that I wouldn't want to own simply because they did nothing for me. A great looking bass that plays and sounds great is what I'm after... or a not so great looking bass that plays and sounds great. I need at least those two attributes.
Good luck.
Thanks
I`m in no hurry, I`ll take my time. Actually, looks don`t matter that much, but it must be a cuttin`punchy sucker with ultralow action
You're absolutely right. I guess I found the >$7K price tag a little intimidating when simply doing some window shopping. Or perhaps I was afraid of what would happen if I fell in love with it.
I am curious about the "feel" of a Fodera though. As for the sound/tone, they probably vary a lot depending on the models. Matthew Garrison, Victor Wooten, and James Genus all have a very different sound.
I actually really like James Genus & Anthony Jackson's tone. And I know they play one Fodera or another... I'm probably just afraid to fall in love with these basses.
WOW!!
I want one!! Sure it's expensive, but if there's something giving the Fodera tone to a Fodera, it's definitely the Pope pre.
Just Thumpin'
Commercial User
- Mar 7, 2008
- 4,534
- 1,664
- Disclosures
- Manager and Partner, Fodera Guitars (10/14/09 - 12/16/19)
I'd like to weigh in here on the Fodera / Pope Preamp. First of all, it is a FABULOUS preamp, Mike Pope designed it along with David Yates and Joey Lauricella. The preamp is tailored to Fodera and unique in that Mike does not sell them to anyone but Fodera.
You can buy our (Fodera's) internal preamp directly from the shop. They cost $450. You would be responsible for dealing with making sure that our preamp fits in your control cavity and/or re-routing your bass.
However, please do NOT expect your bass to sound like a Fodera just by using the Fodera / Pope Preamp. Our instruments are built so that the sum of all of their parts -- custom pickups, pickup placement, aged and selected tone woods, Fodera Strings, etc. -- create the Fodera Sound.
The definition of a great preamp is one that is sonically neutral -- one that when in the flat position will add no color to the sound of the instrument at all. The Pope / Fodera internal preamp in our basses comes as close to that as presently possible, but it does not create the Fodera sound, it is merely one piece of the puzzle.
For that matter, for $399 we also sell an outboard version of the Pope / Fodera Preamp that you can use without even dealing with routing your bass or drilling holes in it...again, it sounds KILLER, but unless you are playing a Fodera, you are not going to completely get the Fodera sound...hope this all makes sense!
You can always contact us for more customized information at:
[email protected]
Regards,
Jason
You can buy our (Fodera's) internal preamp directly from the shop. They cost $450. You would be responsible for dealing with making sure that our preamp fits in your control cavity and/or re-routing your bass.
However, please do NOT expect your bass to sound like a Fodera just by using the Fodera / Pope Preamp. Our instruments are built so that the sum of all of their parts -- custom pickups, pickup placement, aged and selected tone woods, Fodera Strings, etc. -- create the Fodera Sound.
The definition of a great preamp is one that is sonically neutral -- one that when in the flat position will add no color to the sound of the instrument at all. The Pope / Fodera internal preamp in our basses comes as close to that as presently possible, but it does not create the Fodera sound, it is merely one piece of the puzzle.
For that matter, for $399 we also sell an outboard version of the Pope / Fodera Preamp that you can use without even dealing with routing your bass or drilling holes in it...again, it sounds KILLER, but unless you are playing a Fodera, you are not going to completely get the Fodera sound...hope this all makes sense!
You can always contact us for more customized information at:
[email protected]
Regards,
Jason
LilRay
Commercial User
- Dec 27, 2007
- 4,166
- 39
- Disclosures
- Owner: Cockeyed Cow Custom Leathercraft
Can somebody describe to me the "Fodera" sound or the uniqueness that is "THE Fodera sound?" I have a tough time believing that a very similar sound is not readily available for a working musician.
Thank You,
God Bless, Ray
Thank You,
God Bless, Ray
- Apr 24, 2004
- 1,359
- 53
- Disclosures
- Designer Fodera Guitars/Michael Pope Design, Inc., Trickfish Amplification
Yeah I agree with Jason. No one component of a Fodera is going to entirely give you the Fodera sound. No doubt about it.
Just for the record, the design of the current preamp was hashed out over the course of about 2 years by David Yates and me which involved collectively easily more than 1000 hours of development. We took it in it's nearly final form to Fodera and presented it for approval. They loved it, and now it's in production.
To be clear, this was a MAJOR update to the Fodera preamp and took place about a year ago. Since then, there has not been any other preamp I've made for anyone that is similar. When I say "similar to the Fodera preamp", I'm referring to the last version of the Fodera preamp which is the one most people know and is a great design and sounds fantastic. It's not designed to eke out every last vestige of performance the way the current Fodera preamp is.
The preamp that is now in the Foderas is fundmentally different than any other preamp I now make except maybe the MPP-1/MPP-2 which are MUCH HIGHER performance but virutally impossible to realize in a battery powered internal preamp. Given that there are specific layouts it is designed to go in, I was able to lay it out taking advantage of the fact that it doesn't need to adapt to any bass. This may not sound like a big deal, but it's a big part of the extra performance you get out of the current design that you just don't get anywhere else from an internal preamp.
The frequency centers of the EQ are only a small part of what the preamp is doing for you. They're the most obvious thing, but truth is the way the new Fodera preamp gets your signal in and out without degredation is so much better than just about anything else out there you wouldn't believe it. But that's hard to detect without a/b comparing and you can't do that without actually changing the preamp. It has SUPER wide bandwidth, very low noise, and really great transparency. Any change in sound between active and passive is due to losses from cable runs and amp inputs in passive mode. Actively the preamp swamps effectively ALL of that out. The volume/balancer/tone arrangement is such that the much-maligned losses from said arrangement are eliiminated. In active mode, the PU's electrically see vol/vol/tone. Ground is actively driven, there is a cable driver, four layer circuit boards. Stuff not typically seen in such a circuit. Best of all, in only pulls about 1.1mA so your batteries will still last about 500 hours. They exist to serve the purpose of making Fodera basses sound great. What they do for any other bass is a guess. But my guess is they'd perform great in many applications. I've not tried it.
The custom circuits I build are just that...custom. There are some that resemble the original Fodera preamp in some ways. And they do sound great and are reliable. They're all built on a similar active topology with frequency tuning unit by unit to suit (hopefully and usually) the PU's and woods used. I generally make a call as to what will work and am happy to make a modification if the preamp arrives and doesn't do what was expected. This has yet to happen. I can typically make them so the bass requires no routing or modification...assuming the bass was active to start with. The preamps are, admittedly, expensive. But it's because of the hand work in each of them. I build them complete and ready to install starting with the most basic task of stuffing the resistors, capacitors, etc., which has a lot of value to some people.
I assume the outboard preamp Jason is referring to is the Model 20xx. Now the Model 2010 which is the same as the Model 2006 which is a major update to to the original Model 2000. They are now available again from Fodera. Contrary to what Jason implied, it is not really an outboard version of the internal preamp. But it does share many of the same design attributes and, more importantly, has the same really open, transparent sound.
I hope this clarifies how things have been arranged between Fodera and me. Our relationship is complicated because I'm both a supplier, and an endorser. Not only do I only sell the Fodera preamp to Fodera, I don't have any OEM arrangements with any other company regarding ANY product. As a supplier I am a one client company. If a preamp of mine shows up in any other builders' basses it's because the person buying the bass requested it and they paid retail price. And it's not a Fodera preamp unless it was purchased from Fodera. Practically speaking, my preamps all sound really great, in the opinion of many. But it's important to understand that Fodera and I have a VERY exclusive arrangement between us and that their preamp recipe is theirs and only theirs.
Just for the record, the design of the current preamp was hashed out over the course of about 2 years by David Yates and me which involved collectively easily more than 1000 hours of development. We took it in it's nearly final form to Fodera and presented it for approval. They loved it, and now it's in production.
To be clear, this was a MAJOR update to the Fodera preamp and took place about a year ago. Since then, there has not been any other preamp I've made for anyone that is similar. When I say "similar to the Fodera preamp", I'm referring to the last version of the Fodera preamp which is the one most people know and is a great design and sounds fantastic. It's not designed to eke out every last vestige of performance the way the current Fodera preamp is.
The preamp that is now in the Foderas is fundmentally different than any other preamp I now make except maybe the MPP-1/MPP-2 which are MUCH HIGHER performance but virutally impossible to realize in a battery powered internal preamp. Given that there are specific layouts it is designed to go in, I was able to lay it out taking advantage of the fact that it doesn't need to adapt to any bass. This may not sound like a big deal, but it's a big part of the extra performance you get out of the current design that you just don't get anywhere else from an internal preamp.
The frequency centers of the EQ are only a small part of what the preamp is doing for you. They're the most obvious thing, but truth is the way the new Fodera preamp gets your signal in and out without degredation is so much better than just about anything else out there you wouldn't believe it. But that's hard to detect without a/b comparing and you can't do that without actually changing the preamp. It has SUPER wide bandwidth, very low noise, and really great transparency. Any change in sound between active and passive is due to losses from cable runs and amp inputs in passive mode. Actively the preamp swamps effectively ALL of that out. The volume/balancer/tone arrangement is such that the much-maligned losses from said arrangement are eliiminated. In active mode, the PU's electrically see vol/vol/tone. Ground is actively driven, there is a cable driver, four layer circuit boards. Stuff not typically seen in such a circuit. Best of all, in only pulls about 1.1mA so your batteries will still last about 500 hours. They exist to serve the purpose of making Fodera basses sound great. What they do for any other bass is a guess. But my guess is they'd perform great in many applications. I've not tried it.
The custom circuits I build are just that...custom. There are some that resemble the original Fodera preamp in some ways. And they do sound great and are reliable. They're all built on a similar active topology with frequency tuning unit by unit to suit (hopefully and usually) the PU's and woods used. I generally make a call as to what will work and am happy to make a modification if the preamp arrives and doesn't do what was expected. This has yet to happen. I can typically make them so the bass requires no routing or modification...assuming the bass was active to start with. The preamps are, admittedly, expensive. But it's because of the hand work in each of them. I build them complete and ready to install starting with the most basic task of stuffing the resistors, capacitors, etc., which has a lot of value to some people.
I assume the outboard preamp Jason is referring to is the Model 20xx. Now the Model 2010 which is the same as the Model 2006 which is a major update to to the original Model 2000. They are now available again from Fodera. Contrary to what Jason implied, it is not really an outboard version of the internal preamp. But it does share many of the same design attributes and, more importantly, has the same really open, transparent sound.
I hope this clarifies how things have been arranged between Fodera and me. Our relationship is complicated because I'm both a supplier, and an endorser. Not only do I only sell the Fodera preamp to Fodera, I don't have any OEM arrangements with any other company regarding ANY product. As a supplier I am a one client company. If a preamp of mine shows up in any other builders' basses it's because the person buying the bass requested it and they paid retail price. And it's not a Fodera preamp unless it was purchased from Fodera. Practically speaking, my preamps all sound really great, in the opinion of many. But it's important to understand that Fodera and I have a VERY exclusive arrangement between us and that their preamp recipe is theirs and only theirs.
I love the title of this tread "Budget Foderas"
Oh yeah, aisle 12 next to the Alembic Clearance Sale... why pay retail?
Nice commercial for Pope pre's, although a bit long winded (they are good and I own one and am not associated with Fodera)
Now to what OP is addressing, there are some very high quality builders out there and $3000 can get you a really spectacular bass with build and material quality on par with a brand like Fodera. Especially if are looking at used basses in this economy, you can score large with that budget. Not with a Fodera name plate on it however(unless you are looking at NYC Empires). Have a look at what is for sale in the classified, there is lots to choose from and I guarantee, no one is selling anything right now. In other words, it's a buyers market and low offer probably gets you a mac-daddy bass for a fraction of what is worth. I see plenty of high end Jazz Basses, Rbass, Stambaugh, Smith, Elrick and at least 3 Fodera NYC Empires and many more, all can be gotten of less than $3k
Oh yeah, aisle 12 next to the Alembic Clearance Sale... why pay retail?
Nice commercial for Pope pre's, although a bit long winded (they are good and I own one and am not associated with Fodera)
Now to what OP is addressing, there are some very high quality builders out there and $3000 can get you a really spectacular bass with build and material quality on par with a brand like Fodera. Especially if are looking at used basses in this economy, you can score large with that budget. Not with a Fodera name plate on it however(unless you are looking at NYC Empires). Have a look at what is for sale in the classified, there is lots to choose from and I guarantee, no one is selling anything right now. In other words, it's a buyers market and low offer probably gets you a mac-daddy bass for a fraction of what is worth. I see plenty of high end Jazz Basses, Rbass, Stambaugh, Smith, Elrick and at least 3 Fodera NYC Empires and many more, all can be gotten of less than $3k
- Apr 24, 2004
- 1,359
- 53
- Disclosures
- Designer Fodera Guitars/Michael Pope Design, Inc., Trickfish Amplification
What can I say? It takes a lot to explain it. If I said too little I'd be accused of being vague
LilRay
Commercial User
- Dec 27, 2007
- 4,166
- 39
- Disclosures
- Owner: Cockeyed Cow Custom Leathercraft
I dig the info, Thanks Mike. I prefer "long winded" when something needs to be said. Dummies like me need education
God Bless, Ray
Dummies like me need educationGod Bless, Ray
Just Thumpin'
Commercial User
- Mar 7, 2008
- 4,534
- 1,664
- Disclosures
- Manager and Partner, Fodera Guitars (10/14/09 - 12/16/19)
Mike -- Sorry that I was not completely clear in my post...I opted for fairly short and you clarified things in a meaningful way.
Specifically, Mike and David did ALL of the heavy lifting in terms of designing the new internal preamp...Joey's involvement was early on in creating a "wish list" of things that the new Pre would do better than the older version and then in playing and listening to early prototypes of the new model to provide feedback about how things were sounding and working. Rereading my earlier post gave the impression that Joey was actively involved in the actual design of the circuit...not so.
Also, yes, from an electronics standpoint, the Model 2010 Outboard Preamp is NOT an exact replica of the current inboard Pre, however, as Mike indicated, it was designed to be very similar in terms of functionality and tone...
Regards,
Jason
Specifically, Mike and David did ALL of the heavy lifting in terms of designing the new internal preamp...Joey's involvement was early on in creating a "wish list" of things that the new Pre would do better than the older version and then in playing and listening to early prototypes of the new model to provide feedback about how things were sounding and working. Rereading my earlier post gave the impression that Joey was actively involved in the actual design of the circuit...not so.
Also, yes, from an electronics standpoint, the Model 2010 Outboard Preamp is NOT an exact replica of the current inboard Pre, however, as Mike indicated, it was designed to be very similar in terms of functionality and tone...
Regards,
Jason
- Apr 24, 2004
- 1,359
- 53
- Disclosures
- Designer Fodera Guitars/Michael Pope Design, Inc., Trickfish Amplification
Very true. I always suggest playing ANYTHING and everything you can get your hands on, cheap or expensive. I also think it's good to have at least 5 years on bass before ordering a custom.
I guess what I'm trying to say is that you like the idea of a Fodera, but need to try stuff out. Foderas have several pickup and at least used to have a few different pre-amps, so there are probably several Fodera sounds you can get.
You'll hear different opinions on overall sound in terms of how close/far a Fodera clone might be to the real thing. I suppose someone could argue that my Stambaugh sounds nothing like a Fodera.
Still, before you put down the coin, you really need to know exactly what you want/need in a bass in terms of your general specs, which can be independent of how it sounds. You can get the exact sound of something and the entirely wrong feel for you. You can get the exact feel but wrong sound, too. Naturally, you can get both if/when you know what you're doing.
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