On the race car, we call those "lightening holes" and we say things like "Shaved 2.4 pounds off the right side!"
speed holes. they make the car go faster.
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Building A CNC - Watch a first timer stumble through a crazy build
- Thread starter John_Nicholas
- Start date
speed holes. they make the car go faster.
Here’s something kind of interesting… last week Chris from Highline Guitars released a video about how fast his CNC can work. A viewer wrote a completely off-base comment filled with untruths and actual lies. Honestly it made me hot under the collar and got me to write out a very long reply, using the text editor on my computer. When it was time to post it, I discovered the comment had been deleted. Which I 100% agree with.
But I had just spent a significant amount of time writing out a reply, so I figured I might as well share it with Chris. We had a little exchange. It’s really nice to be able to converse with a fun and intelligent person.
Today he released a new video discussing the challenges involved with building a CNC, and specifically from his plans.
Here’s where the fun part comes it, at the end he shares some photos of the builds from folks who have purchased his plans. Included in that list was some photos of my machine! This is so cool!!
But I had just spent a significant amount of time writing out a reply, so I figured I might as well share it with Chris. We had a little exchange. It’s really nice to be able to converse with a fun and intelligent person.
Today he released a new video discussing the challenges involved with building a CNC, and specifically from his plans.
Here’s where the fun part comes it, at the end he shares some photos of the builds from folks who have purchased his plans. Included in that list was some photos of my machine! This is so cool!!
His videos are excellent, if a bit plodding and long winded at times. (I forgive him
)I think I’ve watched most of his videos related to finishes. Haven’t seen the CNC one yet. I don’t think think there’s any doubt a CNC would improve the average builders output, but as you demonstrate, some serious time and money investment involved to get up and running. I think if I ever talk myself into oval inlays again, I’ll have them CNC cut!
)I think I’ve watched most of his videos related to finishes. Haven’t seen the CNC one yet. I don’t think think there’s any doubt a CNC would improve the average builders output, but as you demonstrate, some serious time and money investment involved to get up and running. I think if I ever talk myself into oval inlays again, I’ll have them CNC cut!
His videos are excellent, if a bit plodding and long winded at times. (I forgive him
Once I get this all set up, it would be my pleasure to cut anything you might need for your builds.
It's funny, I don't sub to Chris's channel, mostly because the bulk of the stuff he does is CNC based and it does zero to help me. But I do find myself watching a lot of his general info videos on things like finishing and such. I saw that video go up and went "Meh, not really any info in there for me" and passed on by it. Now I'll need to go check out the one with your build pics in it. 
I do enjoy his videos and his "style". He's one of the few who speaks in a manner that you can actually understand and follow.
I do enjoy his videos and his "style". He's one of the few who speaks in a manner that you can actually understand and follow.
It’s been a while since posting an update on this thread, even though quite a bit of work has been in progress. The problem is that the work has been mostly updating stuff. So the updates is subtle and doesn’t really show much progress.
As an example one area that bothered me is pretty silly. Replacing the rear Y Axis motor mount brackets. What was wrong with the old ones? Nothing but some extra holes drilled when I made a mistake of how to bolt up the ball screw bearing holder, made them look a bit like Swiss cheese. Honestly, with the stepper motors bolted on, you would never see them, but I knew it would bother me….
An interesting side benefit happened along the way. As mentioned before this is a learn as you go build, many things are new to me and mistakes have been made along the way. I know some folks can be concerned about sharing their misses or issues during a build, but to me it seems that sharing the good with the not so good is far more helpful.
After cutting out the new brackets, it occurred to me that the holes drilled for the motor mounts themselves were drilled with a larger than needed drill bit, which meant that the tapped threads weren’t as deep as they should have been.
In addition when tapping, it was done freehand… I discovered that using a scrap piece of 3/4” Aluminum with some holes drill on the press made a fabulous tap guide. Even better using the guide speed up the time it took to tap the holes!
Drilling the larger 32mm holes on the brackets was quite a challenge, having to set the table higher so the reach was deep enough to cut all the way through and needing a scrap wood block with a giant hole in the middle to protect the Aluminum from deep scratches on the steel drill press table.
FYI, the step drill bits purchased for this project, are getting very dull. After all the drilling on the Carbon Steel box and the Aluminum brackets, some of the steps basically don’t cut at all! The trouble is there’s still a Stainless Steel cabinet that requires quite a few holes drilled using the step bits… not sure if they will cut through the stainless, so another one may need to be purchased!
In addition, when the brackets were first made, the 8mm bolts were not countersunk very deeply, they sort of “hung” out of the face of the front and rear brackets. So they were all removed and the counterbore was drilled deeper so the heads would be nearly level to the face of the bracket, while leaving more than enough strength on the bracket face to hold them to the extruded frame.
Both the Z and X Axis base plates were originally made using 3/4” 6061 Aluminum. Quite a few people have mentioned it’s really important to keep the spindle center as close as possible to the X Axis. So these plates were to be replaced with 1/2” Aluminum. Also had to add a second set of linear bearings to the Z Axis, going from 2 to 4 bearings, so the Z Axis plate needed to be longer.
A very interesting discovery, the longer, thinner Z plate weighs less than the original 3/4” aluminum plate.
Then the plate was bolted onto the Z Axis slider onto the rebuilt (cleaned and lubricated) linear bearings. Now I’m very happy with my updated slider!
As an example one area that bothered me is pretty silly. Replacing the rear Y Axis motor mount brackets. What was wrong with the old ones? Nothing but some extra holes drilled when I made a mistake of how to bolt up the ball screw bearing holder, made them look a bit like Swiss cheese. Honestly, with the stepper motors bolted on, you would never see them, but I knew it would bother me….
An interesting side benefit happened along the way. As mentioned before this is a learn as you go build, many things are new to me and mistakes have been made along the way. I know some folks can be concerned about sharing their misses or issues during a build, but to me it seems that sharing the good with the not so good is far more helpful.
After cutting out the new brackets, it occurred to me that the holes drilled for the motor mounts themselves were drilled with a larger than needed drill bit, which meant that the tapped threads weren’t as deep as they should have been.
In addition when tapping, it was done freehand… I discovered that using a scrap piece of 3/4” Aluminum with some holes drill on the press made a fabulous tap guide. Even better using the guide speed up the time it took to tap the holes!
Drilling the larger 32mm holes on the brackets was quite a challenge, having to set the table higher so the reach was deep enough to cut all the way through and needing a scrap wood block with a giant hole in the middle to protect the Aluminum from deep scratches on the steel drill press table.
FYI, the step drill bits purchased for this project, are getting very dull. After all the drilling on the Carbon Steel box and the Aluminum brackets, some of the steps basically don’t cut at all! The trouble is there’s still a Stainless Steel cabinet that requires quite a few holes drilled using the step bits… not sure if they will cut through the stainless, so another one may need to be purchased!
In addition, when the brackets were first made, the 8mm bolts were not countersunk very deeply, they sort of “hung” out of the face of the front and rear brackets. So they were all removed and the counterbore was drilled deeper so the heads would be nearly level to the face of the bracket, while leaving more than enough strength on the bracket face to hold them to the extruded frame.
Both the Z and X Axis base plates were originally made using 3/4” 6061 Aluminum. Quite a few people have mentioned it’s really important to keep the spindle center as close as possible to the X Axis. So these plates were to be replaced with 1/2” Aluminum. Also had to add a second set of linear bearings to the Z Axis, going from 2 to 4 bearings, so the Z Axis plate needed to be longer.
A very interesting discovery, the longer, thinner Z plate weighs less than the original 3/4” aluminum plate.
Then the plate was bolted onto the Z Axis slider onto the rebuilt (cleaned and lubricated) linear bearings. Now I’m very happy with my updated slider!
Next up was to replace the X Axis plate… which was ordered on Thursday and arrived on Saturday!! I can’t tell you how happy I was that it was here so quickly. It was ordered from 6061 Dude on Ebay… great seller if you are looking for 6061 Aluminum!
When updating the plate, it was a great idea to extend the top edge of plate to properly support the slider. Originally the idea was to have the plate be 14” tall, but decided that 12” would be more than long enough. This is being done so the Z Axis slider could bolt on and add some additional strength to the Z Axis setup.
Although the major improvement is that the spindle center is now a 1/2” closer to the X Axis setup.
The interesting part is the 3/4” plate was only 3oz lighter than the new extended 1/2” plate.
Then the new X Axis plate was bolted on….
Next up was to bolt on the Z Axis slider and the spindle holder. Which means that the Chassis is now complete!!
Sure, there are still the drag chains to hook up. Which will require designing some new brackets and manufacturing them. There was an odd issue with the drag chains… which will be talked about a bit later.
The Spindle was temporarily installed.
When updating the plate, it was a great idea to extend the top edge of plate to properly support the slider. Originally the idea was to have the plate be 14” tall, but decided that 12” would be more than long enough. This is being done so the Z Axis slider could bolt on and add some additional strength to the Z Axis setup.
Although the major improvement is that the spindle center is now a 1/2” closer to the X Axis setup.
The interesting part is the 3/4” plate was only 3oz lighter than the new extended 1/2” plate.
Then the new X Axis plate was bolted on….
Next up was to bolt on the Z Axis slider and the spindle holder. Which means that the Chassis is now complete!!
Sure, there are still the drag chains to hook up. Which will require designing some new brackets and manufacturing them. There was an odd issue with the drag chains… which will be talked about a bit later.
The Spindle was temporarily installed.
One really important aspect of building a CNC is to make sure everything is as square as possible. I used a digital “level”… sure, it’s not super accurate or anything but it should be very close! Here are the photos to show how I set up the level in different areas of the chassis to make sure they were very close.
Here are all the X Axis measurements…..
Then all the Y Axis measurements….
So what do you think… is this really close??
Here are all the X Axis measurements…..
Then all the Y Axis measurements….
So what do you think… is this really close??
Well, I think we'll all find out once it runs and you can see if/where it binds. 
Well, I think we'll all find out once it runs and you can see if/where it binds.
As its being built, I've run every Axis through its entire travel... to be sure there is not binding of any of the movements.
The test after getting everything up and running is to tram the machine. To confirm everything is square to everything else....
Thank you! Originally the plan was to purchase the commercially available tap guide... but didn't think it would be needed, you know what they say, hindsight is 20/20.
I don’t feel like there’s any great need to buy one unless you need it often. As you have shown it’s pretty easy to make one yourself.
Details, details, details….
Sure, this is not a huge deal, but with my OCD behavior, it just bugs the stuffing out of me!!
CNC Stepper motors for the most part have wires just “hanging” out of them. It looks awful and unprofessional in my opinion.
The idea is that you are supposed to solder a connector to these loose wires, so they can be connected to a shielded cable which connects to the stepper motor drivers.
Google to the rescue! Some folks did all kinds of creative or silly fixes, but I found that CNC4PC sold covers which seemed to be the best solution I’d seen.
[Invalid or Expired Link Removed]
My issue with those covers is they were “universal” and really big. Ideally it would be better to have a slimmer look and feel, while still covering the wires and leaving a proper method for mounting the Aviation connector to the motor. A good friend suggested looking on Thingverse, where I discovered the computer files to 3D print covers that would fit my very fussy needs! LOL
Parametric NEMA 23 Stepper Motor Cover by chaddavisdesign
My buddy Jason took these files and printed out a set of four covers. Not sure if you’ve seen parts printed in this manner, but they are very cool!!
As you can see in the photos, a “tray” is printed first, then the parts are printed on that tray. This serves a couple of duties, first printing parts on the tray is safer because in case the nozzle accidentally touches the part, it can move and the remaining part of the print will be off. It also keeps them all together in one place!
The tray is “peeled” off of the tray, which leaves a strange “look” to the part that was facing the tray, but a quick shot of a heat gun, “dissolves” it and they look amazing!
These bolt to the end of the stepper motor using the existing threaded end of the motor. But there is a small “issue”, the bolts sometimes go all the way to the edge of the motor. The way to attach the covers is to remove the bolts one at a time and file the ends, approximately 2mm.
Then it’s a simple process to bolt the covers onto the motors.
In my humble opinion these look professional and clean. So much better than the bare wires!
Of course, the aviation connector has not been soldered on yet… that will be one of the next steps on my list, right after finishing up creating brackets and getting the drag chains attached.
Why? To ensure the cables can be measured multiple times, in order to build the cables to the correct length. Then my soldering station can be set up to “mass-produce” the cables and other wiring required to assemble the CNC controller box.
Sure, this is not a huge deal, but with my OCD behavior, it just bugs the stuffing out of me!!
CNC Stepper motors for the most part have wires just “hanging” out of them. It looks awful and unprofessional in my opinion.
The idea is that you are supposed to solder a connector to these loose wires, so they can be connected to a shielded cable which connects to the stepper motor drivers.
Google to the rescue! Some folks did all kinds of creative or silly fixes, but I found that CNC4PC sold covers which seemed to be the best solution I’d seen.
[Invalid or Expired Link Removed]
My issue with those covers is they were “universal” and really big. Ideally it would be better to have a slimmer look and feel, while still covering the wires and leaving a proper method for mounting the Aviation connector to the motor. A good friend suggested looking on Thingverse, where I discovered the computer files to 3D print covers that would fit my very fussy needs! LOL
Parametric NEMA 23 Stepper Motor Cover by chaddavisdesign
My buddy Jason took these files and printed out a set of four covers. Not sure if you’ve seen parts printed in this manner, but they are very cool!!
As you can see in the photos, a “tray” is printed first, then the parts are printed on that tray. This serves a couple of duties, first printing parts on the tray is safer because in case the nozzle accidentally touches the part, it can move and the remaining part of the print will be off. It also keeps them all together in one place!
The tray is “peeled” off of the tray, which leaves a strange “look” to the part that was facing the tray, but a quick shot of a heat gun, “dissolves” it and they look amazing!
These bolt to the end of the stepper motor using the existing threaded end of the motor. But there is a small “issue”, the bolts sometimes go all the way to the edge of the motor. The way to attach the covers is to remove the bolts one at a time and file the ends, approximately 2mm.
Then it’s a simple process to bolt the covers onto the motors.
In my humble opinion these look professional and clean. So much better than the bare wires!
Of course, the aviation connector has not been soldered on yet… that will be one of the next steps on my list, right after finishing up creating brackets and getting the drag chains attached.
Why? To ensure the cables can be measured multiple times, in order to build the cables to the correct length. Then my soldering station can be set up to “mass-produce” the cables and other wiring required to assemble the CNC controller box.
Coming very soon is the wiring… but before starting that process, a permanent home for the controller boxes needs to be set in stone, so to speak. Since there are many peripherals to be connected, access to the sides of the boxes needs to be maintained.
My idea was to build a wall to hang the boxes from, it made sense since these are basically electrical boxes and designed to hang on the wall. While it need to be sturdy, it would have been over kill to use 2x4’s and since the price of lumber was so high at the time of purchase, 2x3’s were chosen.
After a bunch of measuring and fiddling around with the boxes, the locations were determined and the build began! It was easiest to build the ladder structure outside of the work table and then just slide it in place.
Once it was in place and leveled, it was screwed into the top and bottom joists.
Since the main controller box was taller, the hanging mounts are taller than the wall, so a spare 2x4 was added above the space where that box would reside and screwed into place.
Some random pieces of wood were used to determine the height of the cabinets, which made it easy to mark where the lag bolts would be set.
The idea is to “hang” the boxes on lag bolts. This way the cabinets could be removed if and when needed.
At this point the lag screws have been left loose, in order to make it easy to remove or rehang the cabinets.
As you can see the doors swing open to allow easy access to everything within.
Here’s where care needed to be taken, the side of the controller box needs easy access to the inputs so it can be connected to the monitor, pendant, USB access, and tool setter probe. There is a power connection at the top of the box to power the monitor.
Now that the boxes are set, the wiring can commence once the drag chains have been properly mounted to the chassis.
My idea was to build a wall to hang the boxes from, it made sense since these are basically electrical boxes and designed to hang on the wall. While it need to be sturdy, it would have been over kill to use 2x4’s and since the price of lumber was so high at the time of purchase, 2x3’s were chosen.
After a bunch of measuring and fiddling around with the boxes, the locations were determined and the build began! It was easiest to build the ladder structure outside of the work table and then just slide it in place.
Once it was in place and leveled, it was screwed into the top and bottom joists.
Since the main controller box was taller, the hanging mounts are taller than the wall, so a spare 2x4 was added above the space where that box would reside and screwed into place.
Some random pieces of wood were used to determine the height of the cabinets, which made it easy to mark where the lag bolts would be set.
The idea is to “hang” the boxes on lag bolts. This way the cabinets could be removed if and when needed.
At this point the lag screws have been left loose, in order to make it easy to remove or rehang the cabinets.
As you can see the doors swing open to allow easy access to everything within.
Here’s where care needed to be taken, the side of the controller box needs easy access to the inputs so it can be connected to the monitor, pendant, USB access, and tool setter probe. There is a power connection at the top of the box to power the monitor.
Now that the boxes are set, the wiring can commence once the drag chains have been properly mounted to the chassis.
The craftsmanship on this thing continues to be mind blowing.
Wow! Thank you so much!
My drag chain adventure… it sort of reads like Goldie Locks!!
Look, the truth is my build is a learn as you go experience. Which is why in so many instances things are being updated as I go along, many times before finishing that one aspect!
Of course a big part of the issue was adding a water cooled spindle, which of course means water lines are required. Even worse, no thought was given to the thickness of the wires and water lines combined.
My first order was for a set of drag Chains purchased from AliExpress that were 15mmx30mm (inside measurement) As you can see, just the cable for the Spindle and the water cooling lines fit and it was a very tight!
I had to sell these on Ebay. Next up was to order another drag chain set that measured 18mmx50mm. Still a very tight fit.
Someone recommended the YouTube channel by corvetteguy50 … for anyone considering building a CNC this is a MUST watch channel. Vince has done a ton of research and ALWAYS resorts to best practices in every aspect of CNC robots. Watching these videos has been very, very helpful to me.
In this particular case the video was about drag chains.
This is a two part video that goes into minute detail about the reasoning behind the choices to be made. Warning, the two parts are nearly 2 hours long.
What I learned from this video was the 18x50 chain was stuffed too tight, which could cause some severe issues if not corrected.
So I searched and searched.. Strangely, the next size I was able to find was 35mmx100mm!! What was learned by those in depth videos was the proper way to design a drag chain.
As you can see, all the wires are very loose in this chain. It would be just fine, but the truth is as I worked on brackets to mount this chain, the drag chain was so huge, it completely overpowered the machine!! The bend radius of the drag chain was huge!
Here is a comparison of the 18x50 and the 35x100 drag chains..
So it was back to searching and of course after buying the big chain, more size options were popping up everywhere! Finally settled on a 25x77 drag chain. Which seems to be just right for my machine. Leaving plenty of room for adding additional wires if required, yet having plenty of room so the cables (wires) weren’t so close that they would rub together, and possibly cause stress or failure.
The good news is that the 35x100 drag chains (I purchased 3) were purchased from Amazon so they were sent back for a refund!
Lesson learned? Plan ahead. So often I purchased items without having enough information or understanding what was required and bought wrong parts a number of times.
Building a CNC from “scratch” is not for the faint hearted. You need a great deal of patience, ingenuity, determination and a willingness to make mistakes and still keep moving forward. Sometimes even after tons of costly mistakes.
Just like so many other issues, it turns out the main controller box, is too small. Why? It’s perfectly sized for what I will be installing. But in doing research, it turns out that adding an additional two axis (giving you the ability to carve 5 Axis projects) is not far fetched or very difficult to do!
Adding the parts for 5 axis use would require a larger controller box so the additional equipment needed would fit. Oh well another lesson learned!!
Look, the truth is my build is a learn as you go experience. Which is why in so many instances things are being updated as I go along, many times before finishing that one aspect!
Of course a big part of the issue was adding a water cooled spindle, which of course means water lines are required. Even worse, no thought was given to the thickness of the wires and water lines combined.
My first order was for a set of drag Chains purchased from AliExpress that were 15mmx30mm (inside measurement) As you can see, just the cable for the Spindle and the water cooling lines fit and it was a very tight!
I had to sell these on Ebay. Next up was to order another drag chain set that measured 18mmx50mm. Still a very tight fit.
Someone recommended the YouTube channel by corvetteguy50 … for anyone considering building a CNC this is a MUST watch channel. Vince has done a ton of research and ALWAYS resorts to best practices in every aspect of CNC robots. Watching these videos has been very, very helpful to me.
In this particular case the video was about drag chains.
This is a two part video that goes into minute detail about the reasoning behind the choices to be made. Warning, the two parts are nearly 2 hours long.
What I learned from this video was the 18x50 chain was stuffed too tight, which could cause some severe issues if not corrected.
So I searched and searched.. Strangely, the next size I was able to find was 35mmx100mm!! What was learned by those in depth videos was the proper way to design a drag chain.
As you can see, all the wires are very loose in this chain. It would be just fine, but the truth is as I worked on brackets to mount this chain, the drag chain was so huge, it completely overpowered the machine!! The bend radius of the drag chain was huge!
Here is a comparison of the 18x50 and the 35x100 drag chains..
So it was back to searching and of course after buying the big chain, more size options were popping up everywhere! Finally settled on a 25x77 drag chain. Which seems to be just right for my machine. Leaving plenty of room for adding additional wires if required, yet having plenty of room so the cables (wires) weren’t so close that they would rub together, and possibly cause stress or failure.
The good news is that the 35x100 drag chains (I purchased 3) were purchased from Amazon so they were sent back for a refund!
Lesson learned? Plan ahead. So often I purchased items without having enough information or understanding what was required and bought wrong parts a number of times.
Building a CNC from “scratch” is not for the faint hearted. You need a great deal of patience, ingenuity, determination and a willingness to make mistakes and still keep moving forward. Sometimes even after tons of costly mistakes.
Just like so many other issues, it turns out the main controller box, is too small. Why? It’s perfectly sized for what I will be installing. But in doing research, it turns out that adding an additional two axis (giving you the ability to carve 5 Axis projects) is not far fetched or very difficult to do!
Adding the parts for 5 axis use would require a larger controller box so the additional equipment needed would fit. Oh well another lesson learned!!
