Bummed

[Spawndn72]

Long story:

So a few years back I bought a bass and mentioned to our choir director that I had done so and asked if he could give me some pointers. At the time he was playing bass and they had an outside guy playing drums. Little did I know that Ron played drums also. He wanted me to start playing bass so that he could play drums. I told him I had no clue what i was doing, he said I could learn and so the journey began.

I go to a traditional piano and organ church so the praise band only plays a maximum of 4 times a year. But now that they had a bass player (me) and they did not have to beg, borrow or steal a drummer they had planned on playing a lot more. That has never really materialized and we still only play 2-4 times a year. I have not made much progress since we started playing. I mainly play the root and honestly I am usually searching for the next note on the fret board. I have tried to practice more and get better but with the infrequency at which we play or practice and with two small kids at home I just have not gotten a whole lot better. I can play the root and most of the time I play the right one and on a few songs I can even play a bit of what I would call a bass line. But things have been going good. No one really expects much from me and for the most part they are just happy to have someone playing bass. And I have been having fun.

That was until we had a new guy start coming to church; a guitar player. A really good guitar player. The guy has been a musician all of his adult life. He can play a song after hearing a measure or two, honestly the guy amazes me.

Except he is a first class jerk. The first time he came to practice I warned him that I was not much of a bass player but I was all we had. Sorry if I played the wrong note, etc...
Yet he still has to either call me out or just shake his head every time I make a mistake or I don't play something exactly like he thinks it should be played. Last night we were playing a song that I had never played. I had a chord chart and was just play whole notes playing the roots. He stops in the middle of his solo and says can't you do more than just boom boom boom? You should be playing with the kick drum. That is what a real bass player does. I need more than just boom boom boom to solo over, it is just killing the vibe. So I try my best to play with the kick drum still just playing the root but playing 1 &3. I hit a wrong note, he shakes his head and sighs. At this point I was ready to leave but I held it together and finished out the practice.

I know I sound like a whiner and I probably am, just bummed.
What was once a fun 2-4 times a year thing has turned into something I stress over.

Thanks for letting me vent.

 

[T_Bone_TL]

Jerks are no fun.

As for making progress, see if you can fit "regular" (3 times a week) "short" (10-20 minutes) practices into your hectic homelife. Even 5 minutes, if it's not 3 minutes of setting up each time - find a spot you can leave things set to grab a quick practice.

Long bouts infrequently do a lot less for you, IM very HO.

 

[Violen]

Stop stressing and practice every day. I doubt you have more then 15 minutes worth of music to practice. I am sure you can find time if you really want to.

 

[Bassist4Eris]

Sometimes veteran players will try to shape up newbies by riding them a bit hard. I'm not saying it's a good method or a bad one, but I've seen it.

In his defense, it can be very difficult to solo over accompaniment that doesn't feel right. But considering it was a new song for you, the thing for him to do would have been to not worry about his precious solo until you had the chord progression down. Guitarists. Sounds like he needs to temper his expectations to the actual reality of the playing situation.

In any event, I'm not a Christian, but his behaviour doesn't sound particularly Christian to me, according to my understanding of Christian values. If you don't feel comfortable confronting him directly, maybe you could talk to the music director about your feelings?

 

[bassteban]

You might mention the notion of *forgiveness/esteeming others higher than oneself, etc* to Mr Jerk.

 

[IPYF]

I thought the point of church bands was too have fun, be inclusive and praise whichever man in the sky you happen to believe in? Sounds like the guitarist in question has differing priorities to you.

Just take the guy aside and let him know how you feel. If he still chews you out then he honestly shouldn't be there, but let's be honest here and call a spade a spade. If it comes to him or you, if this was anything other than a church band (which in my opinion should be about community involvement but what do I know) it will be you who gets the axe.

It's great that you're being stretched beyond your abilities. You'll appreciate that later when you're a better musician because of it. But you'll never grow if someone in your act is bellyaching at you. You're just going to resent what you're doing and you'll naturally do less work than you probably need to.

I agree that you might need to practice more than you were used to. More songs and more performances is going to take input from you. Perhaps it might be time to start getting some lessons.

Apologies if this post misrepresents church in any way shape or form. I don't know squat about church. Last time I tried to go into one I started melting.

 

[praisebass]

Since churches are full of people, they never will be perfect. Anyway, I smell us bro. I suggest going to your guy and saying 'hep a brother out. I'm new to this stuff and I would really appreciate your input'.

See where that gets you.

 

[two fingers]

In any event, I'm not a Christian, but his behaviour doesn't sound particularly Christian to me, according to my understanding of Christian values. If you don't feel comfortable confronting him directly, maybe you could talk to the music director about your feelings?

I AM a Christian and this is spot on. Talk to the director and see if he can get with the guitar player (who obviously has no idea why he is there). And ego trip in a praise band is an irony beyond belief.

 

[Renaissance]

+1 on trying to find some regular practice time. Who knows, maybe SuperGuitar would even be willing to help you some if you asked.

Please don't take offense - hopefully I'm just reading your post wrong - but your attitude seems rather lacking. You bought a bass a few years ago and started playing but haven't progressed any at all. By your own admission you are playing root notes and searching the fretboard for the next note. It seems like the only time you pick up your bass is the couple times a year the band plays.

Don't let me rain on your parade, I'm a mediocre player myself and I've been playing for 30+ years. A journey of a thousand miles...

 

[mellowinman]

Take all the suggestions offered, plus, have a nice one on one talk with him. At some point, pull him close, put your hand on your shoulder, and explain you have an involuntary twitch, and that's what caused your knee to suddenly come up between his legs like that. Tell him that when you feel relaxed and confident, you are in much better control of your twitch.

 

[noiseguy]

That sucks. One of the reasons I play in church is to avoid this kind of d-bag.

Am in very similar situation (playing bass b/c worship band has enough rhythm guitarists already). Group has been very supportive.

Suggest talking with MD regarding expectations, and take a decision how to proceed.

 

[Marko 1]

All good advice above, including the part about your needing to learn how to play and practice. Just because people should be tolerant doesn’t mean that you don’t owe it to them/whomever, including yourself to do better. You’ll also find it fun and rewarding.

There are plenty of resources on line, even YouTube for free lessons and instructions.

Best of luck.

 

[jmclearnon]

Yeah but still if i'm playing with a less experienced musician, if they are struggling i will offer some assistance/advice.... if they want it (not forcing anything). I feel this is a better approach to slagging them off, that is not going to get that particular musician anywhere and its just going to drop his/her confidence.

 

[na4ito]

I won't be so much supportive as others - sorry for that! But in my very humble opinion you should really practice more. From what I've read here I should believe the drummer plays not only the downbeat on the kick - if he isn't as pissed off at your playing whole notes only (again I might have misunderstood that) as the guitar guy - then he's just a good christian.
Why don't you try to play say twice a month with the drummer only? After all - he should be your ultimate mate - not the guitard.

I do not approve of such conduct of the guitard, but trust - you'll enjoy playing bass much more with a bit of practice.

 

[bluewine]

The whole P & W thing gets away from me. I think it's because it was not a part of the Rock and Roll band culture I grew up in.

Personally, I knew there was a huge conflict between what's phiisophically driving Rock and Roll and what drives this type of worship, so I stayed away from it.

Back in the 60s and 70s Churches didn't have bands outside of a few Gospel Churches which is where I think the whole concept of P & W evolved from.

blue

 

[totallyfrozen]

...Except he is a first class jerk...if I played the wrong note, etc...he still has to either call me out or just shake his head every time I make a mistake or I don't play something exactly like he thinks it should be played...

The bottom line is that this is a Praise & Worship service and he is WAAAAAAAAAAAAY out of line acting like that.

My advice is either to speak to him yourself (with 2 or 3 witnesses) if you feel confident in your Bible knowledge and your approach. Or talk to the pastor about it and have the pastor talk to him about his arrogant, ungodly attitude. The talent, experience, and ability that he has to play guitar are ALL gifts from God and it has almost nothing to do with him at all. I know there are a lot of non-Christians on TB who disagree and think they got where they are by their own hard work. The truth is it wouldn't take much of a bump on the head to make any one of us a drooling quadripeligic (I've taken care of many a patient in that condition!). All that you have is a gift from the Creator (James 1:17)

He needs to be humbled. He has the choice to either humble himself and actually let God receive the glory (which would turn his music into actual Praise & Worship), or he can wait until God humbles him in which case, he will end up humiliated.

In any case, this sort of pride is harmful to the church and is 100% unfitting to the team that is tasks with leading the congregation in praise and worship of the Lord. His behavior is like that of the Pharisees of Jesus's day.

If he does not respond to Bible-based appropriate confrontation, then simply hand him over to the Lord and wait for the Lord to deal with him. I've seen it with my own 2 eyes before. He will strongly wish that he'd changed himself before being brought to a humiliating place of suffering by the Holy Spirit. All through the Bible you can see examples of how jealously God guards His worship.

That's the FIRST priority.

Secondly, get some Ed Friedland books and study/practice every chance you get (even if it's just 5 minutes here and 10 minutes there). It's the Lord's will that we study diligently to be masters at whatever we put our hand to do.
I also recommend getting Edly's book and learning AT LEAST a basic overview of music theory so you can understand what other musicians are talking about and you can "talk shop" with them.

 

[bassbully]

If he wants you to play better ask him for help. I understand where you are at but I am not sure you are ready for the role you are in. Experienced musicians get uneasy if they do not have others playing with them that are not experienced enough to perform. I have been in his shoes with others who did not know how to play above basics..

You say you do not know your fretboard? Sorry, you need to learn it of be able to spot the notes in the scales quickly enough to do more than bang the roots all night.

This might sound like I'm getting on you but I'm not. When I got back to playing 11 years ago I did not know the fretboard and like you stuck to the roots. At a practice with a band of a band I was trying to get into the guitarist sat down and showed me you have to know the fretboard ..he was frustrated with me! If you don't its like driving on a long trip without a map.

I left that band, sat down and learned it in about a week or so. There is a ton of info on the net...use it. Challenge yourself to get better and show the band and guitarist you can.

 

[totallyfrozen]

...In his defense, it can be very difficult to solo over accompaniment that doesn't feel right...

You have a good point. While I understand that you are not a Christian, I just want to point out that since we are talking about Praise & Worship music which is specifically meant to turn the listener's/participant's focus on God and cause them to want to worship Him, I fail to see how a guitar solo is important, necessary, or even appropriate. Seems like this guitarist is treating this situation as more of a "gig" than a church service. He really just needs to be reined in a bit. I think we all agree on that.

 

[totallyfrozen]

I thought the point of church bands was too have fun...

No. The point of a praise & worship band is just that...to bring praise & worship to God. There is something WAY BEYOND fun that you experience when you are praising God. The difference in the experience between fun and praising God is like the difference between either having one chocolate chip or having an entire chocolate factory sitting on top of a chocolate mountain!

The catch is that it requires humility. You can't praise God when your busy praising yourself. This guitarist lacks the humility.

 

[DWBass]

Gonna be honest and suggest that you take lessons. After a couple years, you should have a least some sort of command of the instrument. If your progress is really that slow, get some proper instruction. Guitarist needs to chill. Admittedly, I get frustrated very easily with lesser musicians and tend to bail! No sense in admonishing anyone. It doesn't help and it makes enemies!