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Caste Football

#21
Dr. Cheese said:
Race is a social construct. Clearly there are people in Brazil who would be considered black in the US, and there are people on the team who are considered black in Brazil too. The main point is that Brazil has more people of visible African heritage than any country in the West, and really any country period outside of Nigeria with the possible exception of Ethiopia or Congo.
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Not exactly, Race is based on science(DNA is considered different, right?), not social culture. I'm just wondering that if dark skinned Puerto Ricans are considered Hispanic(are they?), are dark skinned Brazilians considered Hispanic or African, in a DNA way.

Sorry I'm so uninformed on the subject, just really curious.
 
#22
Dr. Cheese said:
White players are channeled into certain positions based on race.
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To add to this; I think white players are channeled to different sports entirely.

Whites primarily play baseball, football and soccer growing up. They start getting channeled out of football almost at the high school level.

Blacks primarily play basketball, baseball and football growing up. They start getting channeled out of baseball almost at the high school level.
 
#24
Adam Barkley said:
To add to this; I think white players are channeled to different sports entirely.

Whites primarily play baseball, football and soccer growing up. They start getting channeled out of football almost at the high school level.

Blacks primarily play basketball, baseball and football growing up. They start getting channeled out of baseball almost at the high school level.
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We should ask to what degree this is because of "channeling", and to what degree it happens because of the social context of the kids involved. Actually, the number of black playing baseball has dropped in the last couple of decades, and the culture in many black communities is more oriented to basketball and football. That quickly becomes a circular situation as fewer and fewer kids play baseball, and therefore fewer of them go on to play baseball in high school and college. When they come back to their community, they in turn have little interest in baseball - and that affects the next generation.

Conversely, Hispanics have been entering professional baseball in increasing numbers. This is partly because of increased recruiting in Caribbean countries, and perhaps partly because there is increasing interest in this sport in their communities. Baseball is a potential way out of poverty in the Dominican Republic and similar areas.

I'm not saying there is no 'channeling" going on - but we should all note that human beings behave the ways they do because of many factors, and trying to select one as the primary factor is at best chancy, and more often just a mistake.
 
#25
Pilgrim said:
We should ask to what degree this is because of "channeling", and to what degree it happens because of the social context of the kids involved. Actually, the number of black playing baseball has dropped in the last couple of decades, and the culture in many black communities is more oriented to basketball and football. That quickly becomes a circular situation as fewer and fewer kids play baseball, and therefore fewer of them go on to play baseball in high school and college. When they come back to their community, they in turn have little interest in baseball - and that affects the next generation.

Conversely, Hispanics have been entering professional baseball in increasing numbers. This is partly because of increased recruiting in Caribbean countries, and perhaps partly because there is increasing interest in this sport in their communities. Baseball is a potential way out of poverty in the Dominican Republic and similar areas.

I'm not saying there is no 'channeling" going on - but we should all note that human beings behave the ways they do because of many factors, and trying to select one as the primary factor is at best chancy, and more often just a mistake.
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By channeling, I didn't really mean to point squarely at the coaches. I can see where that wasn't clear.

I agree that economic background (baseball/football costs 10X what basketball does) and lack of heroes/perceived escape from poverty keep certain races focused on certain sports. Not many black lacrosse players, despite Jim Brown being one of the best ever.
 
#29
basstotheface said:
Not exactly, Race is based on science(DNA is considered different, right?), not social culture. I'm just wondering that if dark skinned Puerto Ricans are considered Hispanic(are they?), are dark skinned Brazilians considered Hispanic or African, in a DNA way.

Sorry I'm so uninformed on the subject, just really curious.
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DNA and race are two different things. DNA differences often do not match that neatly with racial differences. Furthermore, racial categories are always subjective. Clearly some are black, white, Asia, etc. but who do you categorize all of those who fall in the middle? That is subjective.

As for dark Latinos, it is basic history that far more African slaves went to Brazil and the Caribbean Basin than were sent to North America. Darkness in those areasn is very much due to African ancestry whether these people consider themselves black or not.
 
#30
Dr. Cheese said:
DNA and race are two different things. DNA differences often do not match that neatly with racial differences. Furthermore, racial categories are always subjective. Clearly some are black, white, Asia, etc. but who do you categorize all of those who fall in the middle? That is subjective.

As for dark Latinos, it is basic history that far more African slaves went to Brazil and the Caribbean Basin than were sent to North America. Darkness in those areasn is very much due to African ancestry whether these people consider themselves black or not.
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Thanks, that explains things perfectly. For the record I never meant to try and classify people based strictly on race, just curious and appreciate your help.
 
#32
This reminds me of an exercise I did back in High School, where we had an outside speaker come in and talk about race issues in sports (among other things).

The speaker had built a perfect picture of a football game. He spoke for quite a long time, and made made it sound like it was a game for the ages. Eventually, the speaker said something to the effect of, "Imagine the quarterback throwing a perfect spiral pass, and the wide receiver catches the ball with ease and swiftly runs to the endzone for a touchdown to win the game." Then, the speaker said something like, "Ok, in the picture you just built in your head of my story - what race was the quarterback and the wide receiver?"

Amongst the people who considered themselves fans sports of football, almost all of them said it was a white QB and a black WR. Amongst non-sports fans the answers were all over the board - because they didn't follow football, they weren't aware of what races these positions are "supposed" to be. It definitely drove home a good lesson of how often we perceive race without even realizing it.
 

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