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Choosing a speaker to build a small ans efficient cab

C

calif

Sep 12, 2006
5
0
#1
Hello,

My goal is to be able to play my electric 4 strings bass on a battery powered amp in the streets with acoustics instruments. So I don't need to be as loud.
I looked for manufactured battery-powered amps, but found more or less nothing dedicated to the bass guitar.
So i decided to build my own.
I found an amp module (40 w, 16v, 4ohms) which, powered with a 12v battery, delivers enough power and for enough time to move the cab on my combo Hartke vx2510.
You can imagine I really would like to have a cab smaller.

After reading a lot (but probably not enough) in that excellent site, I know I have first to choose the speaker. I also know that I can't ask for "small, loud and bass".
-As I have a low power amp i need efficency,
-As I have to move it easily it must be small,
-As it is mostly to play in the street it is not necessary to have a really nice sound. Sound must be correct, that's all.
I also played with WinISD but didn't find a real answer.

Now is my real problem : THE SPEAKER CHOICE..

Best :
Tell me the speakers I should use.

Good:
Tell me the parameters I should compare. What are the parameters and values which permits to be sure that the speaker is usable for playing a bass guitar.

Worst:
Don't answer.....

Thank you at least to read that prose, and pardon me for my english ( I'm french, you can imagine...)
 
#2
Hoffman's Iron Law:
1. Small
2. Loud
3. Low

Pick two, any two. You can't have all three. If you need a speaker that goes low enough to handle bass and is efficient enough to work well with a low watt amp then it must be large. If it is small it either will not go loud (or in this case moderate level with minimum power) or will not go low. If it was possible to go small, loud and low you wouldn't have to build your own, you'd be able to buy it.
 
#5
[Invalid or Expired Link Removed]

Not to redirect your efforts, but the pjb briefcase has an internal battery. I know nothing of these combos or ther capabilities, other than the inclusion of a battery. Surprisingly, the Briefcase banner ad was at the top of your thread.
 
#6
Eminence is as good a source as any. One of the builders on my site has a T24 sub and DR250 top, driven by a full size power amp, powered by car batteries, carried in a hand cart. He uses it for bass in a football stadium with the marching band, quite successfully. When you're limited by the power supply getting good output is a matter of using a more efficient speaker, and that means larger.
 
#7
You know, I found a company up in St. Louis, Phil Jones Bass, just the other day that actually does make a battery-powered bass amp. It has an internal, recharcgeable battery and two 5 inch drivers in a pretty good sized cab, and it's only $599 direct...there aren't many dealers. It's called the briefcase. Here's a link...[Invalid or Expired Link Removed].

I'm thinking it's pretty good...I know the first rep, he was raving about his stuff, and I trust his opinion.

Hope this helps!

DD
 
#8
Phil Jones Bass Briefcase looks pretty good, technically really interresting, a bit less interresting regarding the price, added to the fact I leave in France and I have to add 19.6% for charges probably some $ for delivery, plus the price for transportation in case of problem.
Mean, no chance to get except if Phil Jones send me one for free for demonstrate in Europe....

Bill
When say larger, I suppose y're talking about larger speaker and larger box. I was thinking about a limit of 60 L (3.6 In3) may be it's not enough ?
 
#9
calif said:
, I suppose y're talking about larger speaker and larger box. I was thinking about a limit of 60 L (3.6 In3) may be it's not enough ?
Click to expand...
60 L is way short of what a football stadium requires, but it's plenty adequate to keep up with a few acoustic instruments. That translates to 2 cubic feet, BTW.
 
#11
In terms of seriously throwing away low end in return for higher sensitivity, a neo midbass driver might be worth modeling in WinISD to see how it plays in Peoria. For example the B&C 12HPL64. I tried one of these for exactly this purpose, and it worked great in the Loud department. After a while, the lack of low end got annoying, and it gathers dust in my garage awaiting a guitarist to give it to.

About amps, consider a car power amp, or one of the AMP modules sold by www.41hz.com in kit form.
 
#12
getz 76
I did check the Crate Bass Bus, the guys in the shop told me they stop selling it because they had to much return and too short autonomy.

fdeck
I couldn't find B&C 12HPL64 at B&C SPEAKERS.

Are there specifics parameters I have to check to be sure a speaker will be able to be driven from a bass guitar.
 
#13
calif said:
Are there specifics parameters I have to check to be sure a speaker will be able to be driven from a bass guitar.
Click to expand...
If you have to ask this, I suggest you build a known design or be prepared to put in a lot of time and effort learning. Maybe one of Bill's Omni 10's would be a good starting point.
 
#14
calif said:
Are there specifics parameters I have to check to be sure a speaker will be able to be driven from a bass guitar.
Click to expand...
Don't even think about designing your own cabinet until you have purchased, read, understand and have at the ready whenever you may need it this:
Invalid Link Removed
or something similar.
 
#16
Carlos Tiberio said:
Would be a good Idea replace the original speaker from my shuttle 6.0 112t which is 375w @8ohm, for a faital 12hp1060 1000w@4ohm? Will be loud I will have the crispy lowB? This cab will support the speaker? Cheers.
Click to expand...
No, this is not an appropriate speaker for your cabinet. Youvwill find that the real world sensitivity is much lower than the stock speaker, and the mid response is much less useful.

The stock driver (which I designed) is optimized for the smaller internal volume of the Shuttle cabinet and optimizes the most important parameters between performance, size, weight and real world power handling.

The real world sensitivity of the 12HP1060 in a cabinet is really about 92dB/1W/1M compared with the ~98dB/1W/1M of the Shuttle, so the two would have approximately equal output when feeding the Shuttle 250 watts and the Faital 1000 watts.

You give up more sensitivity than the higher power handling brings in this case.
 
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#17
agedhorse said:
No, this is not an appropriate speaker for your cabinet. Youvwill find that the real world sensitivity is much lower than the stock speaker, and the mid response is much less useful.

The stock driver (which I designed) is optimized for the smaller internal volume of the Shuttle cabinet and optimizes the most important parameters between performance, size, weight and real world power handling.

The real world sensitivity of the 12HP1060 in a cabinet is really about 92dB/1W/1M compared with the ~98dB/1W/1M of the Shuttle, so the two would have approximately equal output when feeding the Shuttle 250 watts and the Faital 1000 watts.

You give up more sensitivity than the higher power handling brings in this case.
Click to expand...
Ok. Thanks. Which one would you recommend? Can't find a match cab, to make it a pair. Cheers
 
#18
Since you aren't in the states it wouldn't make sense to ship an original factory replacement driver, you can use a eminence deltalite 2512 which will be close but not identical. The original driver tunes better in the smaller cabinet and has a different mid voicing, but will be about as close as you can get given the circumstances.
 
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