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Double Bass Chorda plain gut A string!

Trivolis

Trivolis

Aug 2, 2016
162
94
51
Athens, Greece
#1
Hello, I recently found out that I can purchase an unwound gut plain A Chorda. I didn't even know they used to make that string but I sent an email to Pirastro and they confirmed it.
Does anyone know what the diameter and/or tension of that string is, I already sent Pirastro an email requesting the above information but I don't know if/when they are going to answer and I'm about to pull the trigger on it so any information would be most appreciated!
 
#2
IIRC they initially made a full plain gut set!

I play with a plain A (and a plain E), and the plain A might actually be one of my favourite strings I've ever used. It's SO BEEFY. It makes steel A strings sound like whiny schoolchildren in comparison. if you want to hear some phone quality audio of how it sounds check out the end of the thread "Four plain guts and a spirocore" for some clips of it settled in.

I finally decided to invest in a wrapped gut B string (thanks to @Sam Dingle for the recommendation, though I initially rejected it and he probably thought I was a madwoman), so when that shows up I'll record something.

Gushing aside, this is really not an articulate, soloist-y setup. It's fine for orchestral work, it's GREAT for baroque work and laying down workmanlike basslines, but it's not for the Lauren Pierces and Scott LaFaros of the world. You are actively making your life more difficult to get (IMHO) a really good sound.
 
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#3
eerbrev said:
... the plain A might actually be one of my favourite strings I've ever used. It's SO BEEFY. It makes steel A strings sound like whiny schoolchildren in comparison...
...
You are actively making your life more difficult to get (IMHO) a really good sound.
Click to expand...

Yes, my plain Gamut A string is mighty like that. Unfortunately, your second point rules ...
 
#4
I've used my old combo of plain and wrapped guts (made by Nick Baldock, RIP) with a spirocore low B for modern orchestra concerts and it's totally fine, but don't have enough experience with this plain A to be sure. I'd definitely ditch this plain E for a modern classical concert, it's too much of a princess under the bow and I wouldn't have the mental energy to baby every bow stroke in the context of a modern rehearsal.
 
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#5
eerbrev said:
IIRC they initially made a full plain gut set!

I play with a plain A (and a plain E), and the plain A might actually be one of my favourite strings I've ever used. It's SO BEEFY. It makes steel A strings sound like whiny schoolchildren in comparison. if you want to hear some phone quality audio of how it sounds check out the end of the thread "Four plain guts and a spirocore" for some clips of it settled in.

I finally decided to invest in a wrapped gut B string (thanks to @Sam Dingle for the recommendation, though I initially rejected it and he probably thought I was a madwoman), so when that shows up I'll record something.

Gushing aside, this is really not an articulate, soloist-y setup. It's fine for orchestral work, it's GREAT for baroque work and laying down workmanlike basslines, but it's not for the Lauren Pierces and Scott LaFaros of the world. You are actively making your life more difficult to get (IMHO) a really good sound.
Click to expand...
Do you by any chance have a picture of the A string? Or know what is the actual gauge of the string? I am using the Chordas C. H version for D and G and I'm wondering just how big the plain A is? Bigger than 4mm? Also, does it feel solid or is it floppy?
Thanks a lot!
 
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#6
Trivolis said:
...I'm wondering just how big the plain A is? Bigger than 4mm? Also, does it feel solid or is it floppy?
Thanks a lot!
Click to expand...

My plain A from Nicholas Baldock (so sad to hear of his passing!) is 3.6mm and thunderous both pizz and arco. Not sure what the Chorda plain A is but I'd bet it's pretty close. These can feel floppy if you're coming from any sort of metal string but there are ways around it.
 
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#8
coldtrain said:
My plain A from Nicholas Baldock (so sad to hear of his passing!) is 3.6mm and thunderous both pizz and arco. Not sure what the Chorda plain A is but I'd bet it's pretty close. These can feel floppy if you're coming from any sort of metal string but there are ways around it.
Click to expand...

I used steel strings for a long time than I switched to Gut-a-like strings. I used various kinds of these strings and then I decided to go for the real thing and got rhe D and G for the C. H Chorda set as I decided to stay away from wrapped gut for tuning and fragility issues. I played with a 4.1mm A string for quite some time ( the gut a like deluxe) and I think I'd rather have a plain gut A string with a smaller diameter but I need the string to feel as solid(higher tension, not a lot of "give" for the right hand, not floppy) as possible.
Right now I'm considering the Chorda A, a plain A from Kurschner( maybe "catline" version as they call it or) a plain A from the Real Guts company in the UK). The Chorda A that I have found is about 50 euros more expensive than the other two.
Well, that's the situation so far.. Any feedback is welcome!
Edit:My string heights are 10-14mm and I'm using Evah pirazzi Slaps for E and A. Also have E and A Silver Slaps in the mail. But I'm definitely going to give one of the above plain A's a shot...
 
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#9
I'm thinking the smaller diameter plain A will most likely have less tension than the 4.1mm gut-a-like, but I don't have experience with those. If you try the plain A I'd recommend sticking with it for a while to give it an honest try. Not just for the break-in period, but post-honeymoon. There'll be good days and bad days, and when you consistently have more good days in a row than bad, THEN you can really make a determination. But it takes a while and I'm definitely not un-biased.
 
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#10
Trivolis said:
Do you by any chance have a picture of the A string? Or know what is the actual gauge of the string? I am using the Chordas C. H version for D and G and I'm wondering just how big the plain A is? Bigger than 4mm? Also, does it feel solid or is it floppy?
Thanks a lot!
Click to expand...


The A string I have now is 3.9 mm. Nick's plain A (coming from an email he sent me while I was considering strings) was 4.0mm.

The A I'm using now feels great. bows very well - no complaints! Keep in mind I haven't routinely used orchestral gauge modern strings in a long time (even my mixed modern set is solo gauge tuned down because my bass likes that).
 
#11
I'm open to opinions/suggestions on the following:

Background: I play Goetz raw GDA with a Spiro Solo F#/D (at concert pitch). I started this set up at the beginning of the pandemic just for Bach, bowing etc; but now I use it full time in a few community orchestras that do standard repertoire (and where I am principal in one). Everyone is impressed with the sound of the guts and their bowability (nothing to to with me!!) Now the question:

The Gotz A is the "weakest) of the 3 - loud, but unfocused UNLESS I am really focused with bow placement, and then it's a canon. I've tried replacing it with Olive, Exudoxa, and Lenzer strings but nothing came close the satisfaction of the plain gut string when it is "on".

(Cobersely, I could replace it with a Spiro solo B/A or Jargar A (and Ext E), but then I feel like I'm not bowing guts but "guts over...")

The Chorda is a possibility. But also these:

Kontrabass Saite A - Pure Corde - Gutstrings, 195,19 €

(modeled after the Nick Baldock strings John Feeney uses, but 4.3 seems HUGE.)

or:

Contrabass A-3 Pistoy (which might be a safe bet)

or:

I could just leave it alone and practice!
Thanks
Louis
 
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#12
LouisF said:
The Chorda is a possibility. But also these:

Kontrabass Saite A - Pure Corde - Gutstrings, 195,19 €

(modeled after the Nick Baldock strings John Feeney uses, but 4.3 seems HUGE.)

or:

Contrabass A-3 Pistoy (which might be a safe bet)

or:

I could just leave it alone and practice!
Thanks
Louis
Click to expand...

The Pure Corde strings, even in their lighter gauges, seem to definitely be approaching a more old school, turn-of-the-century orchestra set of gauges (nearly at the level of a reverse-bumped set, compared to later on in the thirties and forties when the recommendation was gauges more like what we have now); bigger, more tension, more authoritative, darker sound, and at least one person said they actually bow somewhat nicely.

I feel like you're always going to have to baby a plain A a bit to get it to come out nicely, but it might be fun to experiment with the higher tension if you think your hands and your old Tyrolean can handle it. Maybe your experience will line up with jneuman's about them responding easier under the bow?
 
#16
LouisF said:
I'm open to opinions/suggestions on the following:

Background: I play Goetz raw GDA with a Spiro Solo F#/D (at concert pitch). I started this set up at the beginning of the pandemic just for Bach, bowing etc; but now I use it full time in a few community orchestras that do standard repertoire (and where I am principal in one). Everyone is impressed with the sound of the guts and their bowability (nothing to to with me!!) Now the question:

The Gotz A is the "weakest) of the 3 - loud, but unfocused UNLESS I am really focused with bow placement, and then it's a canon. I've tried replacing it with Olive, Exudoxa, and Lenzer strings but nothing came close the satisfaction of the plain gut string when it is "on".

(Cobersely, I could replace it with a Spiro solo B/A or Jargar A (and Ext E), but then I feel like I'm not bowing guts but "guts over...")

The Chorda is a possibility. But also these:

Kontrabass Saite A - Pure Corde - Gutstrings, 195,19 €

(modeled after the Nick Baldock strings John Feeney uses, but 4.3 seems HUGE.)

or:

Contrabass A-3 Pistoy (which might be a safe bet)

or:
I could just leave it alone and practice!
Thanks
Louis
Click to expand...

A rougher surface, like the Gamut Pistoy or round-wire-wrapped, "beats" the arco of smoother-surfaced plain guts IMO. The Pistoy A string should do better than the Gotz, but then, so should the Gamut Red Diamond.
 
#17
I'm not sure why, but I find the sound of the wrapped gut As I've tried (Eudoxa, Olive, and one other that I don't remember - Fisoma??) much less satisfying than the plain A... when it works. The Pistoy light is about the same dimension as the Gotz (3.8) and the Medium+/Heavy in the same range as the Pure-Cord (3.96-4.06)

All three Gotz strings respond well to the bow; it's just the sound of the A seems more diffuse at times.
Thanks
 

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