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CHURCH GIGS FROM HELL STORIES

Every single worship keyboardist I've played with who is assigned to play string pads always plays the lower notes of the chords, way down at the bottom end, left side of the keyboard. These notes carry a lot of fundamental as well as second harmonic information, so it pretty much kills the bass guitar.

As a side note, every worship soundman I've worked with always interprets the low end that the synth puts out as "too much bass guitar" and cuts the volume to the point where it makes no real sense to even be playing. I'm grateful that this isn't an every-week thing, and it rarely occurs for me on secular gigs.
 
Every single worship keyboardist I've played with who is assigned to play string pads always plays the lower notes of the chords. These notes carry a lot of fundamental as well as second harmonic information, so it pretty much kills the bass guitar.

As a side note, every worship soundman I've worked with always interprets the low end that the synth puts out as "too much bass guitar" and cuts the volume to the point where it makes no real sense to even be playing. I'm grateful that this isn't an every-week thing, and it rarely occurs for me on secular gigs.

Do we really want to bring up the subject of church volunteer soundmen?? :mad:

We have one guy where I'm not even sure God can hear the bass in the mix. All drums and vocals . . .
 
Do we really want to bring up the subject of church volunteer soundmen?? :mad:

We have one guy where I'm not even sure God can hear the bass in the mix. All drums and vocals . . .

Oh, so this happens in other churches as well? I'm not even in the mix. I rely strictly on my head and cabs to be heard. I've asked several times for them to put me in the mix and they keep making excuses that they can't even when there's still 4 channels that aren't even used. They just don't want the headache of something else to adjust.
 
Do we really want to bring up the subject of church volunteer soundmen?? :mad:

We have one guy where I'm not even sure God can hear the bass in the mix. All drums and vocals . . .

I totally hear ya on that! (okay okay, bad joke!)
Just had a pretty bad one last week. We rent space from another church, and they are expected to keep up the facilities.
There was a water faucet stuck in a random cabinet off to the side near the piano. I was locking up the place along with another member when we heard some water running. We checked the cabinet and found the faucet which was still running, and apparently had been for some time. Tried to turn it off and the piping exploded sending a torrent of water into the room. It was a very mad dash to move the piano, PA speakers, drums, and guitar/bass gear out of the way. Luckily nothing even got close to the water, and I am glad that it happened while I was there instead of losing everything to water damage.
 
Oh, so this happens in other churches as well? I'm not even in the mix. I rely strictly on my head and cabs to be heard. I've asked several times for them to put me in the mix and they keep making excuses that they can't even when there's still 4 channels that aren't even used. They just don't want the headache of something else to adjust.

Yesterday during rehearsal, just for fun (my cabs are mike'd --- this is a big auditorium), I turned my stage level down to as low as I could go and still be able to hear myself play (barely), just to see what the soundguy in question would do. Then, during the break, I went back and took a look at the board.

Just as I thot: The slider was at negative infinity; the bass level was OFF. The bass level was OFF. OFF! IT WAS F&&#@ING OFF~!

Not to worry . . . I didn't say a thing to the soundman, who was suspiciously asking me what I was looking at! :hiding:

So, for the subsequent two services, I let the SVT-4 Pro and my Berg Cabs BREATH. I let them BREATH. I LET THEM BREEEEEAAAAAATH! That's bridged watts into 4 ohms. You could see eyeballs in the front 4 rows go wide! :p

And then I listened to the "sound" man bitch the rest of the day! It felt so good! :D

Gawd it was good!
 
...As a side note, every worship soundman I've worked with always interprets the low end that the synth puts out as "too much bass guitar" and cuts the volume to the point where it makes no real sense to even be playing...

Our sound guy does a great job with my bass at church. :)

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.

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It helps that I AM the sound guy. And I also installed and setup the whole sound system. :D

MX
 
Every single worship keyboardist I've played with who is assigned to play string pads always plays the lower notes of the chords, way down at the bottom end, left side of the keyboard. These notes carry a lot of fundamental as well as second harmonic information, so it pretty much kills the bass guitar.

As a side note, every worship soundman I've worked with always interprets the low end that the synth puts out as "too much bass guitar" and cuts the volume to the point where it makes no real sense to even be playing. I'm grateful that this isn't an every-week thing, and it rarely occurs for me on secular gigs.

+1,000,000

I have been struggling with this for years ... I am pretty passive and other than the periodic reminders to play higher to not conflict with the low frequencies we got along ok.... until last fall. He buys his own mini PA for his own personal monitor system but the speakers are pointed at me as I am behind him on stage. So the solution? Last week I pointed my cabs at him and used the low B every song. The white flag went up by second set.
 
:::LONG STORY:::

I am the original bassist at my church. About 3 years ago I moved away for a bit, and cut my time down from every week to every other week, plus a lot of the special events. I moved back within 6 months, and still play the every other schedule. Well, when I moved away, I left a cheapy squire there for the other bass player to use, as he is a converted guitarist. I also leave my backline, no big to me.

Well here we are 3 years later, and I have sold my Squire to a kid who wanted to learn ($50), and now have two nicer Fenders I play. I used to leave my American J or P up there for alternate bass player to use, until I started to notice they were not being cared for by said bass player.

Well, he must have really liked playing my instruments, especially when he was playing all American made Fenders for free. So much so that to this day he has never, ever bought a single piece of gear to use. Not an SX bass, not a set of strings, not even a pick. He uses all of mine. :scowl:

Well, I took all of my guitars home, to be in my care all of the time. He was left in the cold one practice, as I took them home to set them up, put strap locks, and general maintainence. He apparently wandered around aimlessly until they called me to bring it up for him to use. :mad:

My revenge was putting leather straps on that fit me comfortably. I am 6', 175. He is 5'10", 280 or so. He had to play with the bass on top of his gut, as adjusting those things takes for ever, and I don't think he has the guts to mess with my settings.
 
This thread title has been cracking me up. I've played in church settings off and on my whole playing career, most recently, quite a lot from 2005 through May 2008, but haven't done any since. I've started attending another church, with an excellent music program, but have not gotten back into the playing yet, just enjoying going and not messing with playing.

Playing music with a praise band in church is generally all about conflict, if you don't have a leader who is firmly in control, has perspective, and knows how to do it all well. I suspect those leaders are in a very small minority of churches. For all the rest of us, playing in church is an ongoing exercise in conflict and contests of wills.

If it's not a sound person, it's a keyboard player. If it's not a keyboard player, it's a musician who is right in front of you telling you you're too loud (because the worship leader insists they stand where they are.) If it's not a musician right in front of you, it's someone in the audience saying it's too loud. It goes on and on, just a lot of conflict of wills. Who's going to be right, who's going to get their way, and you have to back down. Blah, blah, blah.

Most churches want to be 'contemporary' but they don't want to be 'rock and roll', so the bass has to be kept under lock and key control at all times. I say if you are going to have a band/rhythm section, then cut 'em loose and let them play (within reason, not at 120 dB). If not, then go back to piano and organ, or solo acoustic guitar.

It's all about the conflict. I think that most of us secretly love the conflict- why else would we put up with it and keep trying to play in church? We like to push back, play with an amp instead of Aviom/earbuds, turn up when we're told to turn down. It's like rock and roll in the 60's, rebellion against the establishment.

For those of you bass players who are in church worship programs where you have good, strong leadership and the conflicts are minimized, the other 80% (or more) of us envy you. :)
 
The only thing worse than a church gig is not playing . . . and even then sometimes not playing is better.

And if you do play church, and word gets out on you, there's a much higher chance that you will never play anywhere else in your musical community.

Could we get some dirt please? You know, winks (or more) from the congregation, church-league-softball-fistfights, screaming matches, passive-aggressive matches (I once did the point the amp at the guitar player thing). DIRT!
 
Well, there was this one time where my pastor came up to me and punched my bass. He was upset that someone had taken his seat behind his congas and switched it with the drummer's seat. Both the drummer and I had no idea who did that. Then he asks me," You don't leave you stuff around here so people can mess with it do you?" I said, "No way. This bass was $2000 and stays with me at all times."Then he came up to me and said,"$2000?!?!?!", and proceeded to punch my bass while it was around my neck. It finally came to an end when we sat down with the elders and he apologized for what he did but at the time I was fairly upset, almost to the point of leaving that church.

BTW, I posted this story last year in the P&W thread so this is all water under the bridge now. No need for advice on this since it was already taken care of.
 
During practice yesterday before youth group, we were practicing, just the band leader, guitarist, and me. Leader kept telling me I'm too loud, and I was like okay, I'll turn down.

When the program started though, I cranked my rig and my Cream Pie and everyone I talked to said they could hear me and that it sounded good.

I guess they're not used to actually hearing bass and it actually sounding good.
 
I play in a Roman Catholic church, and it's good to know that the troubles of being a church bass player are not restricted to one denomination. I've had everything happen to me, but it pretty much sums as the bass shouldn't be heard at all, even though it's the "most important" instrument in the group.


That said, our pastor is a very Venice-Beach type muscle jock, extraordinarily rare for a Catholic priest, and he used to love sitting in front of my bass amp when I brought that along. :bassist:
 
So...

(recent story)

We're paid session guys... had a VERY talented and VERY cool leader who was moving on.

I begged and begged to be with him on his last service.... we always got along great bs'd and joshed the entire time.

He asked me to bring his favorite bass.

He then picked a tune with the "crowd clap - drums - bass" breakdown. He looks at me.. I totally brainfart.. can't remember what the song is or what the 4 note riff was.

He starts laughing uncontrollably... points and says "if you don't know what song we're playing.. what key we're in.. you pick it - you have about 8 more bars to save your seat"

Tim
 
Do we really want to bring up the subject of church volunteer soundmen?? :mad:

We have one guy where I'm not even sure God can hear the bass in the mix. All drums and vocals . . .

This is another thread by itself.

I have played with some of the most incompetent sound people on the face of this earth.

I never understood why the Pastor just didnt HIRE a REAL soundperson and not bafoons that don't know a soundboard. All piano all the time! No drums, guitar, key, organ, sax or bass.

I play through my own stack and the mix isnt their at all because the piano overpowers everything.