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Cliff Burton Hype

#261
RapierSix said:
I beg to differ sir, I believe thrash pertains to all bands that play thrash (Metallica, Exodus, Slayer, Megadeth, Fueled by Fire, Nuclear Assault, etc etc). Crossover Thrash means punk/hardcore bands that switched into thrash/made their music metaler (Suicidal Tendencies, DRI, etc).

I know people will flame me for this but, I honestly hate Dave Mustaine. Sometimes his voice makes me want to stab my ears with toothpicks, his face pisses me off for some reason (I have redheaded friends but Dave's hair and lips just make me angry), and I dislike his poofy old fashioned shirts (Come on Dave, your in a speed/thrash metal band not classical power metal band), and frankly I'm not thrilled about his riffs or attitude.
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all the bands you mentioned played "metal" and came to the party 83 or later the term THRASH was around earlier.only the first 2 DRI records are thrash after that they crossed over and slowed down.most metal bands got faster around this time.therefore crossover.
i do agree with you on mustaine,i never did get into megadeth.
 
#264
SKATE RAT said:
then who played metal in the early 80's?
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Easy: any band that didn't play thrash, punk, new wave, disco... and so on. :p

Iron Maiden. Judas Priest. Poison. Queensryche, Guns n' Roses, Twisted Sister, Van Halen, Ozzy, Dio, Quiet Riot, Yngwie Malmsteen...

...and so on. :p

Metal became schizophrenic in the 1980s. The underground scene was the driving force behind that.
 
#266
MysticBoo said:
Easy: any band that didn't play thrash, punk, new wave, disco... and so on. :p

Iron Maiden. Judas Priest. Poison. Queensryche, Guns n' Roses, Twisted Sister, Van Halen, Ozzy, Dio, Quiet Riot, Yngwie Malmsteen...

...and so on. :p

Metal became schizophrenic in the 1980s. The underground scene was the driving force behind that.
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:eyebrow: Guns N' Roses formed in 85 and released their debut album in 87. They aren't "metal" they have metal roots but they have mainly a huge mix in their style (punk, metal, Classic Rock,blues).
 
#267
SKATE RAT said:
you must be very young if you lump Judas preist together with poison.
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The point wasn't to say they were alike. The point was to say they were considered "metal" back then. They're not very alike otherwise. I've listened to the majority of Priest records since British Steel, so I think I'm qualified to say so. :p

The definitions have changed quite a bit, but some bands - like Maiden, Priest, Ozzy, etc. - remain definitively metal in the classic and everlasting sense of the term. :)

Now, a band like Led Zeppelin was considered heavy metal at one point, but I call them "classic rock". Terms change.

I'm not about to delve into glam rock, hair metal, the roots of progressive and classical metal, black metal, speed metal... I'm being really general here.

peaveyuser said:
:eyebrow: Guns N' Roses formed in 85 and released their debut album in 87. They aren't "metal" they have metal roots but they have mainly a huge mix in their style (punk, metal, Classic Rock,blues).
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Their debut album was considered to be one of the last great metal albums of the 1980s. I don't really think of it as metal, personally...

Besides, he asked about the 80s in general - it's his fault for not specifying. :p

Again, I'm not saying that I consider them metal - it's the general perception of the band, at least during that time.
 
#269
"Kill 'em All" has a lot of speed metal influences and is thrash as well. "Ride the Lightning", "Master of Puppets", and "...And Justice for All" are also thrash albums. I would say Metallica was a thrash band when they made these albums :) They started shifting their style around "The Black Album", which is just considered a "Heavy Metal" album. I agree they are just bad now. Don't get me started on "St. Anger", etc. :rollno:
 
#271
SKATE RAT said:
my point was that Metallica was/is not THRASH.they were speed metal.now they're just bad.
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This whole thing about one band being thrash and another being metal, or speed metal, or any other metal is all a matter of opinion.

The big four of Thrash were Slayer, Metallica, Anthrax, and Megadeth. Now I know that all of these bands considred themselves Speed Metal.

I remember back in High School many considered Slayer "Death Metal", which technically I would agree with too.

Metallica and Megadeth were accepted as speed metal.

Anthrax was usually called Thrash, but Ive heard them refer to themselves as Speed Metal.

Crossover, Death Metal, Industrial Metal, Speed Metal, Black Metal, and all the other real heavy stuff in the 80s-early 90s is generally lumped together as being "thrash metal".
 
#274
MysticBoo said:
To a non-metal fan, they're one of the most famous, if not the most famous, especially during the 1990s (their peak). Once upon a time, that wasn't the case.

Now, to us metal fans... it's another story. Metallica isn't very high on my personal list of favorites. :D

Regarding thrash: I'm a fan of thrash, and I respectfully disagree about the riff complexities of the genre. Case in point: Megadeth. :bassist:
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Holy wars !! :D <3
 
#275
jaymeister9195 said:
This whole thing about one band being thrash and another being metal, or speed metal, or any other metal is all a matter of opinion.
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I know we are getting way off topic but genres go way beyond a matter of opinion and genres prevent the spread of false information. Genres were created when bands started playing something new, which incorporated previous Metal and other music influences. You'd have to categorize a particular band into the genre of music they are currently playing and not so much into the genre they used to play.

jaymeister9195 said:
Crossover, Death Metal, Industrial Metal, Speed Metal, Black Metal, and all the other real heavy stuff in the 80s-early 90s is generally lumped together as being "thrash metal".
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Death Metal, Industrial Metal, and Black Metal came after "Thrash Metal" and "Thrash Metal" came after "Speed Metal". All of these genres can be generally lumped together as being "METAL" but "Thrash Metal" is a subgenre of "METAL"; not the other way around.
 
#276
BELLATOR said:
I know we are getting way off topic but genres go way beyond a matter of opinion and genres prevent the spread of false information. Genres were created when bands started playing something new, which incorporated previous Metal and other music influences. You'd have to categorize a particular band into the genre of music they are currently playing and not so much into the genre they used to play.



Death Metal, Industrial Metal, and Black Metal came after "Thrash Metal" and "Thrash Metal" came after "Speed Metal". All of these genres can be generally lumped together as being "METAL" but "Thrash Metal" is a subgenre of "METAL"; not the other way around.
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I hate to take this anymore off topic, but I respectfully disagree. First I never said Thrash metal was a sub genre of metal. Thrash is certainly a sub genre of metal. As for death metal or balck metal or anything else coming before or after, I could debate that for a few pages. If Venom is Death Metal, then Death Metal DID NOT come after Thrash.

Take Black Sabbath for example. Are they Heavy Metal or Black Metal? I would say hands down Heavy Metal. But there are some who may technically call it Black Metal.

What genre does Slayer fall under? Why are they considered Thrash? Or are they Speed Metal? Or are they Black Metal? By the very "definition" it would be Black Metal.

Who cares what genre they specifically fall under! If they play well and you want to hear it then call it what you want!

I doubt any of these bands or the Genre Police are going to be knocking on any doors to make sure they are placed in the right genre. Unless of course they got lobbed into the "Hair Metal" genre!:spit:
 
#278
jaymeister9195 said:
I never said Thrash metal was a sub genre of metal. Thrash is certainly a sub genre of metal.
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I don't want to take this further off topic either but I know you didn't say thrash metal was a subgenre of metal. I did. You said the opposite in a previous post.

jaymeister9195 said:
As for death metal or balck metal or anything else coming before or after, I could debate that for a few pages. If Metallica is speed metal, and Venom is Death Metal, then Death Metal DID NOT come after Thrash. Take Black Sabbath for example. Are they Heavy Metal or Black Metal? I would say hands down Heavy Metal. But there are some who may technically call it Black Metal.
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Venom was a NWOBHM, Speed Metal, Thrash metal, and First Wave of Black metal band that first coined the phrase "black metal", which influenced many "black metal" bands. All extreme genres such as death metal and black metal came after thrash because bands wanted to play something more extreme than thrash. That's when death metal and black metal were created. Black Sabbath is one of the first influences of heavy metal. I agree. However, they are not black metal because black metal did not exist yet.

jaymeister9195 said:
What genre does Slayer fall under? Why are they considered Thrash? Or are they Speed Metal? Or are they Black Metal? By the very "definition" it would be Black Metal.
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Slayer is a thrash band but they are a little heavier, their lyrics are about death, and Slayer was a major influence on death metal. By the very definition Slayer would not be black metal. Do you know what black metal really is?

jaymeister9195 said:
Who cares what genre they specifically fall under! If they play well and you want to hear it then call it what you want!
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True Metalheads care what genres they specifically fall under. If you call it what you want and it's false, you spread false information. You probably wouldn't call something else in regards to music something that it is not. It's like calling the bass player on stage the mandolin player. With all due respect, read the history of heavy metal and leave this discussion to rest. Otherwise, start another thread. Is this thread about Cliff Burton? :D
 
#280
i have my phases with cliff burton, sometimes i think he's awesome and sometimes just ok. he definitely was unique in his sound/approach to the instrument and much more interesting than other metal bassists at the time. his technical prowess is imho less important than his 'songwriting' or 'playing for the song'. he did very well in that respect. just a shame that it's often barely audible.
 

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