Confessions of a Flatwound convert...

[badboy1984]

I agree all the thing you said about the flats.

I have 2 bass, a fender jazz strung with chromes and a warwick corvette strung with roundwound.

I love the 2 bass but i found myself using the fender msot of the time because i can get the sound i wanted when playing live. Now you got me thinking about changing my warwick using flatwound.

 

[Sundogue]

The jury is still very much out for me and flats. I love the heavy low mid, lack of sustain, and attack of dead flats. I hate the feel, though. So far I've tried LaBellas, Fenders, Rotos, TI's, and Chromes. I almost like the feel of the Chromes because they're fairly light and easy to work, but they're still not as easy to work as rounds, and they won't settle down and go as dead as I'd like. TI's were actually easier tension wise, but they feel creepy and sound like rounds to me. Rotos were less creepy but still too bright. Fenders and LaBellas sound the best to me but they're so stiff.

But I'm trying. When I hear the attack of flats as opposed to rounds, I get all warm and fuzzy and I feel like I'm on the right track soundwise, but if I could get them to have the flat attack, I'd much rather use rounds.

I love the feel of smooth flats. But I too have this weird thing with flats still. But it is always within the context of playing by myself though. Once I'm playing with the whole band it's better. at rehearsals not so much, but on a gig then I don't miss the rounds one bit.

You should try getting strings from juststrings.com. No music store around here (3 of them) carries a decent selection of strings anyway...and when they do have what I'm looking for the price is outrageous. I always order online. Juststrings has every brand you could want to try.

 

[drewhrt2]

i still use round wounds but i know what your talking about. its all about giving the band a bass to build off of and in many cases its best to thicken up the tone and just lock in with the kick and the rest of the drums.
you are good writer btw. well said!

 

[Mastermold]

Choice in flats depends on the bass too. For example, I've found TI flats sound amazing on a split coil P-bass, but on my single coil P-bass I like Fender flats. Maybe it's the stringing through the body? Don't know.

 

[smeet]

Whoops, previously posted this in the wrong thread...

My main bass is a Sadowsky Jazz 5 (currently with SS LowRiders), and I've been thinking about putting flats on it. I play through an Aguilar DB750 and GS412, so it's a bright bass through a relatively dark-sounding amp.

If I make the jump, will I still be able to get a bright, cutting sound when I want it? And, how does that modern Sadowsky sound mesh with the old-school flat sound? I'm thinking of going with the Chromes because for some reason the Sadowsky makes all strings feel low-tension.

Oh yeah, how is the B string on the TIs and the Chromes? I don't want it to sound TOO huge and bassy, more like a lower extension of my E string.

 

[Chef]

The Chromes B on my Reverend 5L (35" scale, fwiw) is very nice; in terms of tension, playability, and tone. Generally, I have not cared for Chromes in the past, I do like them on that bass.
The LaBella B that I tried on my 51P reissue (34" scale, fwiw) I did not care for at all...big string, big tension, epic failure on tone and playability. I love the 760FL on everything else, including my (now former) 51P 4 string.
I hope to try Sadowsky flats on that bass next. They're taper wound on the B; that may help. The LaBellas weren't; don't recall on the Chromes.

 

[Sundogue]

Whoops, previously posted this in the wrong thread...

My main bass is a Sadowsky Jazz 5 (currently with SS LowRiders), and I've been thinking about putting flats on it. I play through an Aguilar DB750 and GS412, so it's a bright bass through a relatively dark-sounding amp.

If I make the jump, will I still be able to get a bright, cutting sound when I want it? And, how does that modern Sadowsky sound mesh with the old-school flat sound? I'm thinking of going with the Chromes because for some reason the Sadowsky makes all strings feel low-tension.

Oh yeah, how is the B string on the TIs and the Chromes? I don't want it to sound TOO huge and bassy, more like a lower extension of my E string.

I can't help you on the Sadowsky. But the Low B Chromes flatwound on my 34" scale 5 string Washburn is killer (and apparently some people go to a longer scale just for a better low B). It is tight (sounding, as well as not being floppy) and the tone is clear...like the low E...not just a big boomy B string. A lot of low B's sound like they don't belong to the same set of strings, but the Chromes sound quite even from the G all the way to the Low B.

I'd go so far as to say that even if I switched back to rounds, I'd keep the low B Chrome flatwound on it...it's that good. Subjective opinion of course.

The low B is not tapered on the Chromes. But it also just barely goes through the hole on the bridge. Kind of a snug fit.

Keep in mind that if you order Chromes pay attention to the scale. D'Addario's website's FAQ section tells how to measure your bass to find the right scale length Chromes for your bass. Mine is a 34" scale and I ordered the Regular length (perfect fit). You may need to order Super Long Scale for a 35" scale bass, though I don't know that for sure. Check out D'Addario's website and measure.

 

[smeet]

Cool! For some reason I thought a flatwounds would not have a good B string... I think I'll have to pick up a set of Chromes from GC on my way home tonight...

I think my trio bandmates might kill me, but I gotta try it...

 

[idoker]

This thread has been very informative. I've wanted to switch or try out flat wound strings, but never really had enough input on how it would be of a benefit or not to my overall sound and/or style.

My main question is about the tension of the TI Jazz Flats, as well as that of the Chromes.

It has been said that the tension of the TI Flats is relatively low. Is this in comparison to other Flats or to round wounds also? So would the tension of the TI Flats be less than the tension of, let's say… DR Low-Riders? The DR hex-core string is a relatively standard tension round wound string. But, I could of used many different string models as an example.

As for the Chromes, I've read about their higher tension. Once again, would this be relative to other Flats or to rounds in general?

I realize that most flats are generally higher tension than rounds. But I’m just trying to get a feel for the strings before I buy any. Thanks for the help.

 

[monsterthompson]

I'll jump in with a question (boldly skipping the search feature) and ask about experiences with flats and picks. Have any of the resident experts found that some flats sound better or worse when playing with a pick than others? I'm loving the sound of my La Bellas fingerstyle, but I am more comfortable with a pick, and I don't find the tone quite as pleasing. Thoughts?

 

[billoetjen]

Sundogue -

That was the most articulate, artistic testimonial to flats that I've ever heard, read or could never compose myself. I haven't read all the responses yet, but I fully intend to. Your analysis reminds me of the very simple statement by one of my all-time favorites, Michael Rhodes:

"Your primary role is to serve the song and be beautifully anonymous in it. Bass is the power of anonymity.”

Amen and Peace to you Brutha.

Bill

 

[smeet]

This thread has been very informative. I've wanted to switch or try out flat wound strings, but never really had enough input on how it would be of a benefit or not to my overall sound and/or style.

My main question is about the tension of the TI Jazz Flats, as well as that of the Chromes.

It has been said that the tension of the TI Flats is relatively low. Is this in comparison to other Flats or to round wounds also? So would the tension of the TI Flats be less than the tension of, let's say… DR Low-Riders? The DR hex-core string is a relatively standard tension round wound string. But, I could of used many different string models as an example.

As for the Chromes, I've read about their higher tension. Once again, would this be relative to other Flats or to rounds in general?

I realize that most flats are generally higher tension than rounds. But I’m just trying to get a feel for the strings before I buy any. Thanks for the help.

I tried TI flats on a bass years ago, and as I remember they were VERY low tension even compared to rounds. If you play with a heavy touch, the string will "bottom out" on every note.

 

[Jeff K]

I have flats on all my basses, and have been a "flat" man for about the last 7 or 8 years. (Yeah, I know. Not very versatile of me, but on the other hand, I know what I like.) Before switching to flats, my roundwounds of choice were the D'Addario SloWounds (which they don't make anymore).

The only thing I have a slight disagreement with in the original post is that I've never felt flats sounded dull when playing by myself. I think they sound awesome when playing alone or playing along with a CD. I just love that rubbery thud that you get with flats, and I also love the fact that there is no string hiss when sliding.

 

[billoetjen]

Thoughtful, respectful, tasteful and erudite.

Sundogue, in recognition of starting the best thread ever, you are hereby appointed Flatwound Ambassador for Life.

We play ELECTRIC BASS, not bass guitar. I have lost track of how many times I've tried to explain this patiently to someone who introduces me as the "bass guitarist." I think that the flat vs round dichotomy reflects the difference. On my last band's business card (acoustic contemporary and trad. blues) we had the motto: "we're here to serve the song." That is still my approach, above all: serve the song.
I had a mentor from day one; an old school R&B and country bassist who insisted that I only use flats. Thanks to him, I can't even pick up an axe in a store and feel good about it if it has rounds.
I can only imagine that in switching from rounds to flats (fortunately I was spared that handicap), you have to take it slow, really listen, and pay careful attention to the nuances of technique in cultivating the sound. Try to appreciate the power unleashed by the attack of high tension flats - that's what brings back the pulse that's so missing in music today.
Whooo, and a hard-picked, palm-muted attack - sweet Jesus - makes you think you're at Sun Studios.

About the Chromes - give them time, lots of time. Eventually they lie down and reveal their soul. Thanks for pointing out the many flavors of flats. You could spend a lifetime exploring only a couple of them. Not a bad way to go.
Flats really make you listen.

Keep up the great work.
TB rules!
Bill

 

[JimmyM]

I love the feel of smooth flats. But I too have this weird thing with flats still. But it is always within the context of playing by myself though. Once I'm playing with the whole band it's better. at rehearsals not so much, but on a gig then I don't miss the rounds one bit.

You should try getting strings from juststrings.com. No music store around here (3 of them) carries a decent selection of strings anyway...and when they do have what I'm looking for the price is outrageous. I always order online. Juststrings has every brand you could want to try.

Ya, I've bought from them. Great store. They have everything, too.

Well you'll be happy to know that I just got a little bit more sold on flats. Got my 69 SVT out of the shop today and played a bass with flats on it for the first time ever. Wow, just wow! It may be a 40 year old amp that weighs a ton, and I may be even older than it and weigh almost as much, but I'm taking it to my gig tonight just to hear it rock a PJ with flats in a band setting.

 

[Sundogue]

Ya, I've bought from them. Great store. They have everything, too.

Well you'll be happy to know that I just got a little bit more sold on flats. Got my 69 SVT out of the shop today and played a bass with flats on it for the first time ever. Wow, just wow! It may be a 40 year old amp that weighs a ton, and I may be even older than it and weigh almost as much, but I'm taking it to my gig tonight just to hear it rock a PJ with flats in a band setting.

First chance I have to obtain (and afford) a tube amp, I am getting one.

Every time I've ever played through a tube amp, I've had that musical epiphany..."Damn this is how a bass is supposed to sound!"...much like I feel about flats.

But flats with a tube amp? Bass Nirvana.

 

[Sundogue]

Thoughtful, respectful, tasteful and erudite.

Sundogue, in recognition of starting the best thread ever, you are hereby appointed Flatwound Ambassador for Life.

We play ELECTRIC BASS, not bass guitar. I have lost track of how many times I've tried to explain this patiently to someone who introduces me as the "bass guitarist." I think that the flat vs round dichotomy reflects the difference. On my last band's business card (acoustic contemporary and trad. blues) we had the motto: "we're here to serve the song." That is still my approach, above all: serve the song.
I had a mentor from day one; an old school R&B and country bassist who insisted that I only use flats. Thanks to him, I can't even pick up an axe in a store and feel good about it if it has rounds.
I can only imagine that in switching from rounds to flats (fortunately I was spared that handicap), you have to take it slow, really listen, and pay careful attention to the nuances of technique in cultivating the sound. Try to appreciate the power unleashed by the attack of high tension flats - that's what brings back the pulse that's so missing in music today.
Whooo, and a hard-picked, palm-muted attack - sweet Jesus - makes you think you're at Sun Studios.

About the Chromes - give them time, lots of time. Eventually they lie down and reveal their soul. Thanks for pointing out the many flavors of flats. You could spend a lifetime exploring only a couple of them. Not a bad way to go.
Flats really make you listen.

Keep up the great work.
TB rules!
Bill

Well, as the newly appointed "Flatwound Ambassador" I humbly accept this appointment and would like to thank the Flatwound Academy, my parents (for allowing me to play bass very loud in their home when I was a teenager), my friends (who encouraged me to play in a band...because they had no talent and being a friend of a guy in a band guaranteed them the leftover chicks), and of course all the bandmates I've had over the years, without whom I never would have known what not to do to be successful, and to those other musicians who have inspired me to become a better bass player by becoming less of a guitard. Thank you!

 

[Sundogue]

Sundogue -

That was the most articulate, artistic testimonial to flats that I've ever heard, read or could never compose myself. I haven't read all the responses yet, but I fully intend to. Your analysis reminds me of the very simple statement by one of my all-time favorites, Michael Rhodes:

"Your primary role is to serve the song and be beautifully anonymous in it. Bass is the power of anonymity.”

Amen and Peace to you Brutha.

Bill

Being a writer helps I guess (of course, writing quickly in online shorthand isn't meant to be mistaken for great literature). I just thought the subject deserved more analysis than simply saying "Flats Rule and Roundwounds suck!"

My intent was for it to be more of a declaration of what it means for me to be a bass player. It just so happened that rediscovering flatwound strings enlightened me. Part of what being a bass player is all about is to lose one's ego. I don't care to be a star. I don't play bass to get accolades from anyone, I just want to share the beauty and power of rhythm...that force that makes people move involuntarily.

Flats Rule!

 

[Bassman316]

Well, as the newly appointed "Flatwound Ambassador" I humbly accept this appointment and would like to thank the Flatwound Academy, my parents (for allowing me to play bass very loud in their home when I was a teenager), my friends (who encouraged me to play in a band...because they had no talent and being a friend of a guy in a band guaranteed them the leftover chicks), and of course all the bandmates I've had over the years, without whom I never would have known what not to do to be successful, and to those other musicians who have inspired me to become a better bass player by becoming less of a guitard. Thank you!

Nice accepatance speech there!

 

[markjazzbassist]

still playing my flats. i've got rounds on 2 of my basses, i would have flats on them, but they are too bassy for them. there would be no definition.

BUT, the basses that i do have flats on, sound just amazing. my main bass a 69 fender jazz just has "that tone" and i love it.

labella flats