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Confessions of a Flatwound convert...

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#162
Great thread, Sundogue and I agree wholeheartedly. I play only flats: TI's, LaBella FS, DR Flats and occasionally tapewounds. I agree that one important role of the bass is to give the drums a tonal voice and that no one musician trumps the band and the band is there to serve the song.

I love to listen to and be inspired by Jaco, Victor, Stanley, etc, but I ain't them. I am a caveman bassist and try to stay in the pocket and make the band sound better.

I recently got a last chance, low cost opportunity to go on a Jazz cruise hosted by Marcus Miller. Besides being a great host, Marcus performed 6 times in a variety of band settings. I expected the virtuosity but what blew me away was the basics. He played mostly finger style, rarely soloed and never went on and on. These were short shows averaging an hour or so, so maybe it was different from the norm. But the groove ruled the day and Marcus and drummer Poogie Bell were locked in, swinging very hard.

If Marcus Miller isn't more important then what he's playing then no one else is either.
 
#163
PilbaraBass said:
Yep...save 2 lbs on your bass and add 80 to your rig...

get yourself a weight lifter's belt for support...and don't go and get yourself no hernia...ya hear?

Me...I'm trying to figure out how to stop luggin' a 35lb 1x10 combo around and I don't even HAVE back problems...
Click to expand...
Ha! You lazy sod!

I've been lucky with the back, too. The shoulder, though...not so much. So those 2 lbs. I save with the P Lyte make the difference between a comfortable drive home and a raging headache. Point taken about the weight lifting belt, though. I'm not getting any younger and I sure don't need a hernia.
 
#164
JimmyM said:
Welp, after tonight, I think I'm sold on the Chromes. I brought my 69 SVT to its first gig in over 11 years after getting it restored, and I saw God! The bottom end was massive but never muddy, and there was just enough extra treble with the 810's as opposed to the 215 rig I've been using to make it sound snappier on the attack but not twangy. So I think I'm going to stick with the Chromes and the SVT...back trouble, here I come!
Click to expand...

You gotta have Back-Bone to deliver the God-Tone!
or...
Put your Faith in a tight Back-Brace!

Good luck with your back, JimmyM, be careful haulin' that 810!
:D
 
#165
idoker said:
Thanks, sixway. I didn't know how the TI's would fit on my 5-string 35+" scale bass. I have a good idea now. I attempted to try Chromes on my bass, but the B-string was not long enough. So I also had reservations about the TI Jazz Flats.

Also, I've heard time and time again about the tension issue of the TI strings. This, I believe, also has to do with the scale of the bass.

So, I'm going to go ahead a try them out and see how they are.
Click to expand...

I looked at my old TI string box, and the model to look for ( in nickel) is JF 365, which means 36" scale - 5 strings.

On my bass, I have a different stringing challenge: the B-string is almost too long, and has to be strung carefully so it won't kink or snap (did that once!), and I have to make sure any extra-long string set has an E-string that is long enough to make it around the E tuning peg. That's why I wish string companies would list the lengths of the strings either on the package, or on the website. It forces me to take my bass with me at times to the local music store, and is the reason I've been reluctant to buy online.

Maybe we could help ourselves, and start listing string lengths of the various brands we use, as we buy and install them. I know some of you, and myself included, aren't changing our long-playing strings just yet (they're just getting broken in!), but I have some old sets I can take measurements of. And even though they've been cut, we would know that the length, plus the windings, plus another three inches or so would give us a good indication of the length of the strings when new.

I just got back from a gig, so I'll look at my string collection tomorrow and see what lengths I come up with. So what I will post will be:

Name: (Ex.) Thomastic Infeld
String Type: (Ex.) Nickel
Length: (Ex.) B__ E __ A__ D__ G__

It's late, and I'm tired but it sounds like a good idea to me. Is it worth it fellow bass players?
 
#166
Ooooh, this is interesting.
I've often felt like my bass would sound amazing and rich when im alone, but as soon as the guitars start up I'm drown out. It gets to the point where it seems as though we all have volume wars in an attempt to be able to hear ourselves, which ends up being a mess anyway.
I think I'll try out some flats...

Which brings me to my next question, How do flats sound through distortion pedals? Namely, a Russian Big Muff?
 
#167
I've been running my flats through an MXR Blow Torch and it does tweak the tone from my rounds. As everyone has pointed out, each brand of flats has different tonal characteristics. In general it seems like they are darker and more bass focused, which gets amplified by the additional gain on the fuzz. I can still EQ enough on my pedal to get tones that are good and useable, but I can't speak for the Muff.
 
#168
...maybe darker isn't the word. More "thumpy subwoofer-ish" feel, particularly if you cut the mids. I think it takes some of the grind out of the fuzz, but the high's still have a sparkle that comes through and the bass still seems to hold together well, though I do run the blend knob to keep it that way.
 
#169
pointbass said:
I like the LaBella 760FM's ... the tension, feel, basically everything about them is great IMO ....

"your bass sound was like I got hit in the stomach with a bat"
Click to expand...

That feeling is what I'm looking for! I just put on a set of Chromes, haven't played them with a band yet. How do the LaBella 760FM's compare to the Chromes? I like the fact that the Chromes have lots of highs, but I wouldn't mind getting some additional oomph on the attack...

I'm using the medium lights (132/100/80/65/45) Has anybody tried the medium Chromes (105/85/70/50)? The B string is certainly fat enough already! I wonder if I would get a more "fist-like" tone out of the thicker set.
 
#171
JoeyZ said:
Ooooh, this is interesting.
I've often felt like my bass would sound amazing and rich when im alone, but as soon as the guitars start up I'm drown out. It gets to the point where it seems as though we all have volume wars in an attempt to be able to hear ourselves, which ends up being a mess anyway.
I think I'll try out some flats...

Which brings me to my next question, How do flats sound through distortion pedals? Namely, a Russian Big Muff?
Click to expand...

There are a few songs I use a Chorus, Flanger and 8 string effects on (using my Zoom B2). All still very effective using flats.

The last time I had a big Russian muff, it had nothing to do with bass, so I can't help you there. ;)
 
#172
Just last week, I put a set of LaBella Deep Talkin's on my '08 Am Std P. It seems to like them, more punch and thump, less noisy junk. P's are funny though-they have a built-in 'middy' character that seems to work so well with flats. I didn't care for them on my J, but so far am digging them on the P. And +1 to the flats+pick sound, just awesome.
 
#173
Found another set of TI flats laying around and threw them on my Kawai FBII. Had to raise the action just slightly, but they seem to work much better on that bass than on my P. The FBII is string-thru so maybe that is helping comp. for the tension of the TIs. One of the most noticeable first impressions is how much volume the flats put out.
 
#174
Good thread!

I converted to flats a couple years ago, and though I play in smaller and less guitar-dense units generally, I am with it about the ownership of the lower bandwidth in an ensemble. With flats, I have a whole 'sonic room' to myself (oh yeah- and the drummer!) in which I can establish a figure, vibe, approach for the song in, and no 'sonic blur' with guitar or keys.

Flats are my weapon of choice on all 4 of my basses, including the Squier Classic Vibe 50's P-Bass I'll be picking up this week- that'll be getting a set of Chromes put on it. After I remove those roundwounds that I know are on it! :bassist:

I tried the Fender Stainless Flats, but they were real high tension. A guy I know says they have "Neck Snapping Tension"! The Chromes are a good bit friendlier, they feel quite nice.
 
#175
Count Bassie said:
Good thread!

I converted to flats a couple years ago, and though I play in smaller and less guitar-dense units generally, I am with it about the ownership of the lower bandwidth in an ensemble. With flats, I have a whole 'sonic room' to myself (oh yeah- and the drummer!) in which I can establish a figure, vibe, approach for the song in, and no 'sonic blur' with guitar or keys.

Flats are my weapon of choice on all 4 of my basses, including the Squier Classic Vibe 50's P-Bass I'll be picking up this week- that'll be getting a set of Chromes put on it. After I remove those roundwounds that I know are on it! :bassist:

I tried the Fender Stainless Flats, but they were real high tension. A guy I know says they have "Neck Snapping Tension"! The Chromes are a good bit friendlier, they feel quite nice.
Click to expand...

Yeah, that 'sonic room' is, to me, the single greatest contribution of flats to the whole equation. I can appreciate those who wish to hang with the guitars (I was one of them for far too long), but even if one plays tight with the drummer and hangs in the pocket all night long, if it ain't on flats, there is something missing. The sonic space between the guitars and drums is gone. Unless one plays rounds more percussively and mutes all night long that low end will be lacking to some degree.

With all the advancements in technology, it was inevitable that bass players were going to find a way to stand out. While it's given bass players a higher profile, it's been at the cost of a tight low end rhythm section. Unless one were to play with two bass players, a band with a bass wanker (no matter how tastefully he incorporates his chops with the rhythm section) will lose that rhythm section 'pulse'. Of course the style of music has everything to do with what fits and what doesn't.

I do think most music benefits from a bass player playing the 'bass player role' far more than with one who wants the spotlight. It would be difficult for an orchestra to play such complex music if no one played their part. Some don't want to play the 'part'. They want to stand above it. To each his own.

But that 'sonic room' most bass players relish (and I would say we are in the majority) is where it's happening.
 
#177
I'm in the process of converting to flats, I definitely prefer the feel of them to roundwounds, and the tone is closer to what I want as well. I just need to find the right ones for me....

My local shop sold me some EB flats at cost last week so I could see if I liked them at all. I do, and it was suggested here on TB that I try several different types so I picked up some D'addario chromes today. They are quite a bit different than the EBs and seem to ring out a lot more (actually, the EBs seem quite "flat" in comparison). They're taking a bit of getting used to but I can't run the Chromes thru-body due to the felt extending past the nut.

Any suggestions for a similar string without that issue?
 
#178
RI ran TI's for a while and just strung up some Chromes today too. I just went through the bridge. Makes no difference in my opinion. TI' when through the body...

rustynuts said:
I'm in the process of converting to flats, I definitely prefer the feel of them to roundwounds, and the tone is closer to what I want as well. I just need to find the right ones for me....

My local shop sold me some EB flats at cost last week so I could see if I liked them at all. I do, and it was suggested here on TB that I try several different types so I picked up some D'addario chromes today. They are quite a bit different than the EBs and seem to ring out a lot more (actually, the EBs seem quite "flat" in comparison). They're taking a bit of getting used to but I can't run the Chromes thru-body due to the felt extending past the nut.

Any suggestions for a similar string without that issue?
Click to expand...
 
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