• TalkBass has been independent since 1998. Add your voice.
    Create a free account to reply to discussions, view embedded media, and browse with fewer display ads.
    Join free Log in
    Want zero display ads or expanded classifieds tools? Compare plans.

Consignment sale fraud??

#46
elgranluis said:
No money whatsoever. It sucks that he sold it for less , however it sucks even more that I never got paid !
Click to expand...

That is beyond brutal. I'd be filing a police report to at least get this documented. But @BassUrges is right - if there was no INTENT to defraud, it's hard to justify criminal charges. Proving that intent could be difficult. If you're very lucky, this might make it onto the desk of a hungry detective - but probably not.

Do you have any recourse through insurance?
 
  • Like
Reactions: dbsfgyd1
#47
elgranluis said:
No money whatsoever. It sucks that he sold it for less , however it sucks even more that I never got paid !
Click to expand...
Okay.

Do you know if he’s still open for business? Did he close up shop and go to Hawaii? Has he been incarcerated for something? Did he have an accident and was hospitalized, got ill or maybe even died? You may have to do some detective work.
 
  • Like
Reactions: elgranluis and mikewalker
#50
My career was in banking and financial services for 47 years before retiring. I have been involved in more debt collection circumstances than I can enumerate.

You might be able to cause this disreputable third party a few headaches, but I suggest it is highly likely that it will cost you more than you'll recover to pursue action against him. And, the bad news is, he won't care about the headaches. Folks who treat others the way he has treated you don't have the conscience to develop headaches over something like this.

My advice is:
  • Try to see him to work it out personally.
  • Under no circumstances engage in a conflictive or threatening physical confrontation....you'll be the person in jail.
  • If the personal meeting doesn't work, file a police report.
  • If you want to try and recover money via legal means decide, before pursuing it, how much money you're willing to spend for the outcome you want.
  • Be mentally prepared to accept the outcome, particularly if it's negative. You don't have to like it, but you do eventually have to accept it. Otherwise, it'll drive you crazy. This is a bad deal, but you can't let it be the most important thing in your life.
  • Learn from the experience.
The proceeds from his sale of your bass are gone and, likely, his pockets are empty.

I really hope this works out for you. Best of luck.

Koog.

Edit for punctuation only.
 
Last edited:
  • Like
Reactions: BadJazz, mikewalker, dkelley and 1 other person
#51
i would suggest letting him know that if you don't receive the money for your part of the sale, you'll have no choice but to take him to small claims court.

here's the thing. if he's lost his money and is losing the store due to the pandemic, you don't get anything because he may not have any money. if you win in court, you can't garnish his wages unless he pays himself regular wages, which a lot of small business owners don't. and then he'd have to garnish his own wages, and i wouldn't count on that.

btw, almost everyone in my industry i know who got burned by someone was always someone they could - as one associate put it - "look in the eye and shake his hand". it's a easy to con or at least convince someone to do something in person.
 
  • Like
Reactions: mikewalker, Coolhandjjl, dkelley and 1 other person
#53
If you can’t garnish his wages, but you can send the sheriff to seize his inventory.

I have a friend who won a case against a major national retailer for mid 6-figures. When they didn’t pay, he showed up at a local branch with some deputies and started literally pulling brand-new TVs off the shelves in full view of the shoppers.

The manager made a panicked call to HQ and *miraculously* a check appeared.
 
  • Like
Reactions: mikewalker, PaulS and elgranluis
#54
This is why even eBay works so well.... you can set a minimum. If the minimum (which may not be published information to bidders) is not reached, it won't be sold.

I cannot STAND consignment places. They act like they try to sell your stuff... but in most cases, they let the item sell itself. If it's a great item, awesome.

What was the badge price you agreed on with the consignment place to start at? What was the depreciation agreed to as it sat unpurchased? There is normally a reduction in sticker price as it sits.

If it's a percentage of the original... that amount could easily have dropped by thousands over 3 months.

Also - I don't get the thing where you care to meet the guy selling it for you.

Why does that matter? They are in the business of making money off of other folks' money. There is nothing admirable or story-worthy about what they do, imho.

What I like to do is exchange stories and tell stories about the instrument I'm selling to the actual prospective buyer.

Sorry it didn't work out - but it sounds like a common problem with consignment sales, and follows what I've always seen contractually as the approximate price you'd end up at after the initial price you outlined as it's value.
 
  • Like
Reactions: elgranluis and zie
#55
pcake said:
i would suggest letting him know that if you don't receive the money for your part of the sale, you'll have no choice but to take him to small claims court.

here's the thing. if he's lost his money and is losing the store due to the pandemic, you don't get anything because he may not have any money. if you win in court, you can't garnish his wages unless he pays himself regular wages, which a lot of small business owners don't. and then he'd have to garnish his own wages, and i wouldn't count on that.

btw, almost everyone in my industry i know who got burned by someone was always someone they could - as one associate put it - "look in the eye and shake his hand". it's a easy to con or at least convince someone to do something in person.
Click to expand...
As mentioned earlier, court judgements and getting paid are two entirely different things. He may already have judgements and liens against him already and you merely get in line and may not get a dime. If her were a W2 employee, a court judgement may allow wage garnishment, but since he’s the proprietor, there is no way to forceably make someone pay.

Regarding filing a lien, if you prevail in court, you file the lien against any real assets he has such as property. Then when he goes to sell that property, you get in line after secured creditors, such as a bank, to receive money along with any other lien holders before he sees any proceeds from that sale. But if he does not have plans to sell anytime soon, you will be waiting a long time. And if total liens exceed the proceeds, or if he has no real property to lien against, you are out of luck.

Again, a court judgement in your favor and actually receiving money is two different things.
 
  • Like
Reactions: mikewalker, AaronMB, pcake and 1 other person
#56
In many states, consignment stores have to be licensed same as pawn shops. Check that locality, see if he is licensed and complain to that licensing authority. If he is under threat of having his licensing pulled, or if he is operating sans-license, the threat of business closure may be in your favor to help grease the wheels.
 
  • Like
Reactions: elgranluis and vid1900
#57
K, now that I know you were never paid, it totally sounds like a scam.

Firstly, every legal consignment deal from a business that does this on the up and up has a very carefully worked out contract. They have to, by law. Generally the terms are standard for the guy who does consignments all the time, and he should have pointed them out before you signed anything and agreed to this. I have never consigned something where this wasn't done first, and the guy with the store (real or online) initiated all this information sharing.

Secondly - I really really feel bad for you, OP! This is ridiculous that you have to go through this, whether or not the guy was on the up and up or actually tries to run his business this way, if it's actually supposed to be a legit business.

There are enough of us on this forum with P bass copies that we could take him out for you easily... just say the word!
 
  • Like
Reactions: elgranluis

Latest posts

Top Bottom
Back